Ukraine & Chernobyl

[Beelzebubalicious]

other than the fact that I lived in a place for which there are no rational explanations...

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gmHjfTWj3DFOuNzFREjOH9AGrarA

[Danny]

Okay. Let me try to assess the condition of the helicopter. Dumb reporters, possibly dumber people. First of all, if being "radioactive" means that it has contamination on it (they don't elaborate), then even though expensive, it could be decontaminated (though also dumb because it would generate lots of liquid radwaste). If by "radioactive" they mean activation products, then it is even more dumb to be around this thing because it can't be decontaminated.

More => At least one helicopter was used to drop graphite and other stuff onto the molten core at Chernobyl. If the core had been contained (as it would have been at a U.S. reactor with a hard, thick containment), there would be no neutron irradiation with which to contend. But since the containment was essentially a sheet metal building - the roof of which was blown off due to the steam explosion - there was an actual neutron as well as gamma dose to the surrounding area. If this is the helicopter that was used to do the dropping of stuff onto the molten core, then it is probably highly, HIGHLY radioactive from transmutation of stable light elements into radioactive light elements from neutron irradiation from the core.

As for the people. Goodness. Why anyone would actually think of doing something like this is beyond me. The authorities saved a lot of people from unnecessary radiation dose.

As another interesting aside, I knew someone who lived in Kiev. They (all of the homes) still have GM detectors and survey their food before eating it. At a certain number of counts per minute, they throw the food away.

The whole area still suffers from the design of the reactor, which lacks the power coefficient to shut down upon sustaining transients (contrary to the design of U.S. reactors). The design, by the way, is amenable to creating what can eventually be turned into weaponized material, also contrary to U.S. commercial reactor design criteria.

In all, I believe that 36 firefighters and others died soon after the accident. Many more children suffer from thyroid problems (or had to have them removed).

[Fuchs]

I remember a photo of a Mil Mi-26, not -8 dropping something into the reactor building.

edit:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2264710035777728006
OK, looks like they used what they had. A Mi-6 and either Mi-8 or -17 are visible in this video as well.

[J Wolfsberger]

other than the fact that I lived in a place for which there are no rational explanations...

Probably, and I'm not joking, too much vodka and "... it seemed like a good idea at the time."

[Van]

Originally Posted by J Wolfsberger
Originally Posted by Beelzebubalicious

other than the fact that I lived in a place for which there are no rational explanations...

Probably, and I'm not joking, too much vodka and "... it seemed like a good idea at the time."

Let's be fair. The same general quality of thought is displayed in the U.S. weekly, but the morons in the U.S. don't have access to anything on a par with the garbage dumps aroung Chernobyl.

[J Wolfsberger]

Originally Posted by J Wolfsberger

Let's be fair. The same general quality of thought is displayed in the U.S. weekly, but the morons in the U.S. don't have access to anything on a par with the garbage dumps aroung Chernobyl.

That's why I thought the behavior pattern looked familiar. :D

[Beelzebubalicious]

Danny, I've been living in Kiev for the past 2 years with my family (2 young boys) and have often wondered about the radiation in food. Embassy and others say not to buy from street stalls, but it's okay (regulated) in markets. Others say don't buy mushrooms or other certain types of vegetables. Hard to know what's a true risk or not.

Where do you get these GM detectors, by the way?

My bigger worry is other chemical/biological accidents, normal pollution, poor water quality, etc. I'd like to be able to check my apartment for environmental safety (paint, etc.) but don't know how to do that. Any suggestions?

Thanks,

eric

[Featherock]

that's a good story, thanks for posting.

what do you do in Kiev, B.?

[Rank amateur]

Probably, and I'm not joking, too much vodka and "... it seemed like a good idea at the time."

Alcohol causes much stupidity, but it always a good idea to remember that even sober, intelligent people do really stupid things, usually caused by things that we're all susceptible to: ignorance and false assumptions.

[Beelzebubalicious]

F, I keep seeing an extra "c" in your name and it "tickles" me...Okay, now that I've gotten that out of the way, I can answer your question. I'm in Ukraine working on a USAID funded project working with the national and local governments on budget policy reform and budget management. I've been here for over 2 years and am leaving in less than 2 weeks.

So, it's a bit late for me to do anything about radiation, etc. but I have friends that would like to know.

[Featherock]

Do you see the extra "C" now? That's for you, B., and for the hundreds of kids who made fun of my real last name -- Featherstone -- for so many wonderful years! It's a fun name to have.

Seriously though, that sounds like interesting work. I've always wanted to do a story (I'm a journalist) that would take me to Russia and/or the former Soviet republics. This one has all the elements of a fun story. I wonder what will happen to the geniuses who got caught.

Where's your next assignment, B.?

[Beelzebubalicious]

Featherstone is a great name. I hope you gave those kids a good "featherstoning".

I'll PM you a potential story line, but you'll have to bring your cage, b/c it requires you to swim with a lot of sharks.

As for my next assignment, it's TBD at this point. I go home for awhile and then hopefully to some place a bit warmer...

[Stan]

Where do you get these GM detectors, by the way?

My bigger worry is other chemical/biological accidents, normal pollution, poor water quality, etc. I'd like to be able to check my apartment for environmental safety (paint, etc.) but don't know how to do that. Any suggestions?

Thanks,

eric

Hey Eric !
Our Director was part of the initial disaster relief team working well well within the "Chernobyl Zone". Based on his experience the Rescue Board ordered GM-45USB (geiger counters) from Black Cat Systems. For less than 200 bucks (a year ago) you can detect alpha, beta, and gamma / x-ray radiation.

I'll try and find the brochures, etc.

Regards, Stan

[Featherock]

I give my kids a good Featherstoning every day whether they deserve it or not, just for good measure.

I'm always open to good story lines, and I've found that folks who work with the State Dept. or USAID often have interesting ideas. One DOS rep I met in Afghanistan while on assignment has been working with local mullahs on madrassa reform. He's more or less done this on his own. Madrassa reform, if you ask me, really goes to the heart of what you might call a COIN strategy, and has more far reaching consequences than, say, building fortified district centers for the ANP and the ANA. I'd like to do a story on it, but he's been hard to reach and, like you, he's leaving theater in a week or two, probably going to Iraq--again. (He was in Anbar for three years with the Marines)

[Featherock]

okay, here's the email address written to avoid spam bots:

sfeather AT twcny DOT rr DOT com

[Beelzebubalicious]

Thanks Stan! I found the website, but I probably won't buy since my radiation exposure is now only for 8 more days. I also wouldn't want to know if I were exposed, b/c it's been two years already. I'm quite sure it's nothing, but then again, my sh*t glows, so that's not a good sign.

Feathers, I'll try and get you some materials today.