Chieu Hoi ... Oh How I Wish
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Originally Posted by
120mm
I think the trick is to get as many "current" insurgents to come work for our side. I have reason to believe that in both Afghanistan and Iraq, we are attempting and sometimes succeeding at doing just that.
This is not a bad strategy, except that its being handled in sort of a clumsy way.
Its a common misperception that every insurgent is a Jihadi and will never surrender or stop his actions ... religious extremist insurgents comprise only 15-17% of the insurgency (AQI is just 2-5%) ... the Mujhideen Central Command (which is better translated as the Unified Mujahideen Command) are actually the Baathists FRLs ... they couldn't care less about Islam, even though they are Moslems who use the Rhetoric of the Islamists, they aren't fanatics - yet they account for 83-85% of the daily attacks.
In fact with the right amount of money the FRLs could be bought, but it will take huge concessions on the oil pipeline through to Syria and a ruthless crackdown on the Shiite Militias before that could even be brought to the table. Most Sunni AIFs just want a life and air conditioning for their kids ... with the right incentives they could be a force to rid us of AQI.
Just a thought. ;)
A request was made for me to elaborate.
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We would like to hear your perspective on the subject. For example, if you could provide your reasoning as to why or why not amnesty programs or subsidizing Sunni families would or would not have an impact upon the insurgency.
Heh, it's very amusing to observing how you americans think and tackle problems, i don't like to generalise all of you, but i think it's fair to say many of you have a capitalistic mentality, or atleast the ones in power. You think everything can be bought, everything has a price, people's lives, peoples dignity. You kill someones brother, mother, child, and you think that throwing money at the issue is going to fix it all. You assume that everyone is just an opportunist, who only acts only to further their own interests, because you assume everyone is like you.
Well i'll tell you why your strategy won't work, since your asking. The people whome you fight don't think the same way as you do, they belive in things that you probably can't even comprehend, like honour. They do not accept bribery, with money or power, because neither of those things is what they are fighting for. Try to understand, even if you where NOT knocking down peoples doors, raping their sons and daughters and stealing their resources, even if your occupation was the most benovelent in history, there would still be resistance against you. People don't like to be meddled with, it's not your place not your right, to meddle in the country's affairs.
Don't worry about it, Every Iraqi who was willing to sell their souls, their nation, and their people for money and power is already collaborating with you. Wether he/she was a sunni or a shia, or a ba'athist, or simply a back stabbing thief. Every opportunistic dirt bag who was already corrupt on the inside before the war, is already on your side. Furthermore, contrary to what you implied with your question, there is a shia resistance just aswell as a sunni resistance, and sunni traitors as well as shia traitors. It doesn't matter what you are but who you are and there is good and dirt everywhere.
This was all quite elequently put by US consul Warren Parker during the fall of Saigon. "All these years I've been down there, doing a job of work for my country and for this country, and today all I can see is that we've succeeded in separating all the good people from the scum, and we got the scum." - As reported by John Pilger.
Your battle with the resistance is a battle to the end, they will remain steadfast. Money won't save you. They fight for their nations dignity and freedom in the real sense. To suggest you can put a price on that or on peoples lives, is an insult.
-Victory or Martyrdom.
It's not about what you want, it's about how to achieve what you need.
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Once the americans leave, AND the puppet government and puppet securit aparatus they left behind is annihilated.
Unfortunately, you, like everyone else in history, must fight the war you have, not the one you want. As much as I hate to say it, there are very few Americans who are going to countenance -- for the best of intentions, no matter what you'd like to believe -- leaving Iraq before something stable is established to take its place. It's going to take a lot more loss in the way of casualties and treasure for people to just throw up their hands and quit -- we're a stubborn lot, which is going to mean time, which is going to mean a continuation of the dismal situation for the Iraqis.
In war, you must be effective. It may be satisfying to kill Americans and their supporters, and it may seem that it is only just to demand that the new Iraq get set up on your own terms in the way that you want. But pursuing that as a goal is not effective to your policy objective, which is an Iraq free from foreign interference. In the short term, you may have to alter your desired sequence, get something stable and amenable to the largest number of people established. And then ask -- or tell, I don't really care -- the Americans to leave. The public/political sentiment in this country will be overwhelmingly in support of such a thing, and there won't be a damn thing any administration will be able to do to argue that we must maintain a presence there. If you want to go back and tinker with the system established, go for it -- these United States were originally established under one set of governing principles (Articles of Confederation and Perpetual Union), which were discarded and replaced with the Constitution we now have.
So, the question is, is it more important to kill Americans, to dictate a timetable that's just not likely to work, or to be effective to your policy goals, to have a good strategy that achieves most of your aims in the shortest amount of time with the least damage to the Iraqis?
At this point, I'm one of the few people who believes that America can "lose" in Iraq and still walk away just fine, who's suggested a plan for admitting defeat, offering a reparations package, moving out, and getting on with being a better and more productive force for something positive in this world. However, it's not likely I'm going to be elected president any time soon. Thinking like mine isn't common, so you need to come up with a plan that takes better account of your enemy.