Thoughts on "don't ask, don't tell?"
Hi everyone,
I know there is a similiar thread in this section, but reading this on yahoo news, I found it interesting. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_obama_gays
A study reported on in the L.A. by a UC Santa Barbara think tank said that women are dismissed more from the military than men for being openly gay.
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...,6656168.story
In academia, at least my experience with University of California, gay and lesbian issues aren't just accepted, they are embraced as part of "diversity" just like women's studies, ethnic studies, etc. There are not just gay and lesbian student groups for sexual orientation in general, but LGBT groups (Lesbian, gay, transgender, bisexual) student that combine both orientation and ethnic groups (Latino, Asian, Jewish, Caucasian, African American)."
Academia tries hard to be politically correct, or is genuinely progressive, I don't know. I find this issue fascinating in the military because again, its culture is so different from academia. Thoughts? Comments? Opinions?
Naomi
Define "liberal" and "diversity"?
I do not know which UC campus your experience is with but IMHO if American academia was truly interested in embracing “diversity” there would be ROTC on virtually every campus as well as full administration support for “republican” or “conservative” groups. In my experience the liberalism and diversity of many in academia (as with many liberals) is only liberal and diverse if your world view conforms exactly to theirs.
Why is it on some campuses conservative speakers are not invited to speak, or if they do appear some are barely allowed to speak by those who oddly claim to believe in diversity? Somehow I find preventing an individual from freely voicing an opinion in a classroom or on a campus to be neither a “liberal” attitude nor the promotion of “diversity.”
As to DADT, I personally feel it is a ridiculous policy that actually may be counter productive. Simply allow men and women to serve, the UCMJ has enough archaic clauses governing personal behavior to keep them in line. I am not sure that, even absent DADT, gays would be too “open” about their orientation since, as others can point out, the military tends to lean more towards conservatism.
Good. That means you may have learned if
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cavguy
I was an XO of a mixed male/female AVN BDE HHC, and I had far, far more problems with heterosexuals in those few months than gay incidents in 12 years.
it really is true the best place to hide things from an Aviator is under the soap? :D
As long as it's not dropped soap...
A one time fix perhaps, but if done often enough the message might sink in. The key of course is how often will be enough and it adds more time to an already full day.
Agree the Army (and other services) are not always great places to practice social engineering particularly when engaged in war on two fronts. Yet as Cavguy said much of the resistance to gays serving seems to be generational. I still feel that not many would be “open” about their orientation, without DADT they just wouldn't have to deal with hiding it off duty.
The problems in the higher chain of command need to be fixed in the same way, it's just a different dynamic for officers as not as many live in barracks.
My point on the UCMJ is that it would first need a bit of a revamp (like eliminating the article prohibiting sodomy, which covers all other sexual acts outside of standard male/female intercourse, which is way outdated) so that it prohibits not the type of sexual activity but the time and place where it is prejudicial to good order and discipline. I'm no Puritan, and have nothing against men having sex with men, but if they are doing it my barracks area, work area, or military vehicles, then I do because it impacts others who shouldn't have to be exposed to anyone's proclivities. Goes the same for male/female and female/female as well as a host of other activities (e.g. proselytizing). There is a time and place for all activities and sometimes people just need to keep their libidos in check until they can find that time and place. I know that can be hard on occasion but so be it.
I would like to see DADT eventually go away since I have friends and relatives who are gay and do serve and they have expressed some angst about having to live a lie and watch their back when they are off base. The adage when I was on AD was that you spend 90% of your time dealing with the f*d-up 10%.
The big difference is you have to currently deal with all those various permutations of raging hormones whereas I can now sit back, out of the fray, and take pot shots. :D