The Other Side of the Mountain
I have been doing some research on tribal governments, particularly early big man systems, and their similarity to comments made by Mujaheddin leaders in "The Other Side of the Mountain" by A. Jalali and Lester W. Grau. In particular, the need to provide spoils to their followers in exchange for continued service and to maintain prestige. I am curious if other similar stories exist either from the Afghan conflict or from other conflicts.
I understand the obvious connection with criminal enterprises (subsets of the major social system) but I am looking more for incidences where larger societies or the entire cultural systems were in play.
Thanks
a question of terminology
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Steve Blair
Spoils within the context of Native American conflicts is a tricky subject due in no small part to the great differences that often existed at the basic cultural level between many of the Plains Tribes. In some cases spoils did play a role, and indirectly they certainly did when it came to treaty negotiations (the "presents" provided by the U.S. negotiators usually played a major role in obtaining signatures). It was more common for it to come down to leaders jockeying for position by offering the opportunity for spoils (raiding parties and the like) rather that actually distributing the spoils themselves.
This leads to a separate question. I see the word "tribal" bantered around quite a bit but are the terms "big man" or "chiefdom" ever used? I ask this because they are significantly different systems.
we've gone far afield ... but what the heck
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dayuhan
Not ignore the problems, accept that they are not our problems to solve and that we've neither the responsibility nor the right to impose ourselves and our "solutions" on those involved.
While that solution has a certain elegance reality is that we have made it our problem. Call it "the best defense is a good offense" or simply a prophylactic approach to instability/terrorism, we have decided that it is better to expend a little blood and treasure now than have to deal with the consequences latter.
Taking that as a given, I think it better to do it with some understanding of the social/cultural systems we are screwing with rather than to simply continue to tinker with them, assuming everyone wants to be just like us without analyzing what it is they actually want or even what it is about us they may have any desire for. When things don't work out we blame them for being "too corrupt" without understanding why corruption "works" in their society. We say they don't understand, they have no loyalty, they are not professional, they micromanage, all the while thinking to ourselves 'we're right, why can't they just be more like us?" but never really looking into why it is that are not like us.
Assuming there are actually recognizable cultural/political typologies and that there is a reason why these typologies work in certain situations and not in others, I would think it would be worth our effort to look into these rather than continuing to try things and then analyze the data after our failure to figure out where we went wrong.
There ... I feel better now.
My interest is primarily Afghanistan, but it would make no deference if it were there or Africa -- the cultural/political typologies should be universal (with obvious local flavors): Head Man/Big Man; Chiefdom/Monarchy; Democracy/Republic. What I am looking at is the value system that underlay each of these and make them acceptable to the segment of the population we are concerned with influencing. I do not believe they are evolutionary, but rather specific to the environmental/economic condition the population find themselves in.