Cops or Police in Counterinsurgency COIN

**slapout9** · 07-13-2010

About 70 Marines from Camp Pendleton are spending time with LAPD in order to learn how to adapt Police Techniques to fight gangs. My favorite is stop calling them Taliban and start calling them Gangsters!!!!Yes,the more you criminalize them the more you De-legitimize them. Absoulutely Outstanding!

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/lo...-98202989.html

**Rex Brynen** · 07-13-2010

Originally Posted by slapout9

My favorite is stop calling them Taliban and start calling them Gangsters!!!!Yes,the more you criminalize them the more you De-legitimize them. Absoulutely Outstanding!

I'm not sure ordinary Afghans are likely to find it all that convincing, especially in a context where many of the most powerful real gangsters are on the government/coalition side (AWK, anyone?)

**MikeF** · 07-13-2010

I was wondering if John P. Sullivan had anything to do with this? I like the cross-talk between police/military.

**jmm99** · 07-13-2010

where the locals select the Taliban courts (despite their drawbacks) in preference to the national courts.

Since we don't have a gendarmerie, the rest of the program looks like a "good start". Of course, IIRC, a "good start" is 1000 lawyers in chains at the bottom of the sea.

Cheers

Mike

**40below** · 07-13-2010

I'm torn on this one: part of me wants to argue that street gangs have been fighting a small, dirty, limited war against the government and the police for years; but as soon as I say that, there's a part of me that's gonna want to point out that the government and the police have been losing that war.

**MikeF** · 07-13-2010

Originally Posted by 40below

I'm torn on this one: part of me wants to argue that street gangs have been fighting a small, dirty, limited war against the government and the police for years; but as soon as I say that, there's a part of me that's gonna want to point out that the government and the police have been losing that war.

If you're interested, we've compared and contrasted the nature of gangs and insurgencies in various threads. This one is about the issues in NorCal.

John P. Sullivan has also written extensively in SWJ on the issues in LA and future threats.

**huskerguy7** · 07-13-2010

This is some really interesting stuff and in my opinion, should have happened a while ago. Not only are we possibly causing the Taliban to appear as criminals (which may or may not be good as Rex mentioned), but we are strengthening the enforcement of the law. Having guys trained take down gangs with the proper law enforcement techniques is better than sending in heavily armed guys that start a firefight for obvious reasons. Ideal results: Less "gangs" through action that doesn't completely disturb and annoy the population.

It would even be better if we could try to pass this law enforcement training to the Afghan National Police. Yes the ANP have alot of issues to work out, but we are mainly providing them with paramilitary training right now. If they learn how to do "proper" law enforcement (methods of handling evidence, undercover agents, CSI, etc), then in the long term, I think they would be more efficient and the situation would be better. An interesting article discussing this was published by FP a couple of weeks ago.

This is a good step, especially when thinking long term. We will see how it works out.

I will make sure to check out John Sullivan's work.

**40below** · 07-13-2010

Originally Posted by MikeF

If you're interested, we've compared and contrasted the nature of gangs and insurgencies in various threads. This one is about the issues in NorCal.

John P. Sullivan has also written extensively in SWJ on the issues in LA and future threats.

This topic has actually come up at a few NA security conferences I've attended, with fun sidebars like how Iran is underwriting Columbia's cocaine industry. Thanks for the link, I'm reading.

Ian

**slapout9** · 07-13-2010

Originally Posted by 40below

I'm torn on this one: part of me wants to argue that street gangs have been fighting a small, dirty, limited war against the government and the police for years; but as soon as I say that, there's a part of me that's gonna want to point out that the government and the police have been losing that war.

The Police just like the military can enforce the Law and enforce the Peace but only the Government can win it. The Police always win the battles unless our budget gets cut. What happens is the Government never addresses the underlying causes of the problem, it is easier just to call 911.