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Thread: Mystery missile contrail stumps Pentagon

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    Council Member AdamG's Avatar
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    Default Mystery missile contrail stumps Pentagon

    W T F, over?

    WASHINGTON — The US military has so far been unable to explain an apparent missile contrail off the coast of California and is still trying to determine its cause, a Pentagon spokesman said Tuesday.

    KCBS television caught the long exhaust plume on camera as it arced into the evening sky west of Los Angeles on Monday night, sparking reports of a missile launch.

    http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp...6981673a8d.2f1

    See also
    http://www.cbs8.com/global/category....partnerclipid=
    Last edited by AdamG; 11-09-2010 at 05:12 PM.
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    http://i.imgur.com/IPT1uLH.jpg

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    Supporting "time-limited, scope limited military actions" for 20 years.

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    Council Member AdamG's Avatar
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    Reasonable explanation, but it should have taken less than an hour for the FAA to whip out the flight plan of whatever aircraft was on that vector - as seen from the angle of the film.

    Right?


    *
    If we're playing "Most Likely/Most Dangerous", here's something asymmetrical to think about...
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...cks-a-reality/
    Last edited by AdamG; 11-10-2010 at 12:01 AM.
    A scrimmage in a Border Station
    A canter down some dark defile
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    Council Member slapout9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdamG View Post
    Reasonable explanation, but it should have taken less than an hour for the FAA to whip out the flight plan of whatever aircraft was on that vector - as seen from the angle of the film.

    Right?


    *
    If we're playing "Most Likely/Most Dangerous", here's something asymmetrical to think about...
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...cks-a-reality/
    AdamG,that is interesting because "IF" it is a missile it seems to act more like a solid fuel rocket than some type of a sub launched missile as the media say may have happened. Could very well be contrails too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AdamG View Post
    Reasonable explanation, but it should have taken less than an hour for the FAA to whip out the flight plan of whatever aircraft was on that vector - as seen from the angle of the film.

    Right?
    Probably, assuming they have the correct time for the sighting.

    You can actually track aircraft live and you can see there are always a lot of flights heading toward LAX from the Pacific. Historic data is available if one is willing to pay.
    Supporting "time-limited, scope limited military actions" for 20 years.

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    Council Member AdamG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Entropy View Post
    Probably, assuming they have the correct time for the sighting..
    One would think that a minion of the Pentagon would have been all over this like the proverbial white-on-rice in the first hour : if a layman such as I can point out 1) the hard position, bearing and time of the observer (KCBS TV helicopter crew, time marked digital tape) and 2) the database of all flights (from your aforementioned FAA database) within +/- 5 degrees of the observers' camera bearing , match target's travel vector (from point first observed to where it leaves the film frame) to one of the FAA radar tracks and it'd be real simple to say "Oh, that was Flight XXX from XXXX".*

    Failure to do so has left the folks responsible for Pax Americana's perimeter security looking like smacked asses.

    * Yes, I've done this before - with surface vessels. Made the E4 RTO put down his undergrad coursebook and work up the math, just to make life interesting in the TOC.

    *
    What the spot reports probably sounded like -
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiWQZhUmmRw
    Last edited by AdamG; 11-10-2010 at 02:46 AM.
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    Two thousand pounds of education
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    Council Member carl's Avatar
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    The reference cited by Entropy states that an aircraft would have taken 12-15 minutes to lay a contrail like that. If it was a missile it would have taken much less time to lay a smoke trail like that. Does anybody know how long the video in question was?
    "We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene

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    Council Member bourbon's Avatar
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    Swamp gas from a weather balloon was trapped in a thermal pocket and reflected the light from Venus.


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    Default End of Ze World

    Entropy, great links with math to boot. Nothing like logic to dispel rumor and flawed intel

    It was only a matter of time before this missile thread got hijacked but Bourbon has beat me to it

    This video should at the very least clear any misconceptions about nuclear war and what happens to California

    Regards, Stan
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    Council Member AdamG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bourbon View Post
    Swamp gas from a weather balloon was trapped in a thermal pocket and reflected the light from Venus.
    Your scientists have yet to discover how neural networks create self-consciousness, let alone how the human brain processes two-dimensional retinal images into the three-dimensional phenomenon known as perception. Yet you somehow brazenly declare seeing is believing? Your scientific illiteracy makes me shudder, and I wouldn't flaunt your ignorance by telling anyone that you saw anything last night other than the planet Venus, because if you do, you're a dead man.

    [/QUOTE]



    Quote Originally Posted by Stan View Post
    Entropy, great links with math to boot. Nothing like logic to dispel rumor and flawed intel
    Declaring a problem solved without providing an answer is a Pentagon trick.

    Video of object's contrail starts about about 0.28 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AMdHBgHtNE

    Oh yeah, definitely a Southwest Air commuter... if it has two wings shorn off and is defying gravity. 'Zippy' is a good description, don't you think?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stan View Post
    It was only a matter of time before this missile thread got hijacked but Bourbon has beat me to it
    Regards, Stan
    Scroll up to Post #6, this was already self-hijacked <pinky to lips>

    Meanwhile, Pentagon thumbs remain firmly lodged in their third points of contact.
    http://www.nationaljournal.com/natio...ve-it-20101110

    *

    When someone makes an unannounced launch what looks to be a ballistic missile 35 miles from the nations second largest city (at sea in international waters), and 18 hours later NORAD still doesn't have any answers at all - that complete lack of information represents a credible threat to national security. If NORAD can't answer the first and last question, then I believe it is time to question every single penny of ballistic missile defense funding in the defense budget. NORTHCOM needs to start talking about what they do know, rather than leaving the focus on what they don't know.
    - naval analyst Raymond Pritchett

    http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010...hing-near-l-a/
    Last edited by AdamG; 11-10-2010 at 02:40 PM.
    A scrimmage in a Border Station
    A canter down some dark defile
    Two thousand pounds of education
    Drops to a ten-rupee jezail


    http://i.imgur.com/IPT1uLH.jpg

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    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Hey Adam,

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamG View Post
    Declaring a problem solved without providing an answer is a Pentagon trick.
    Yep, had 23 years of practice doing the dance

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamG View Post
    Video of object's contrail starts about about 0.28 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AMdHBgHtNE

    Oh yeah, definitely a Southwest Air commuter... if it has two wings shorn off and is defying gravity. 'Zippy' is a good description, don't you think?
    Thanks for the video. I gotta tell ya the Russian rocket scientist with the "ballistic missile launched from a sub" was a real nice touch

    This is good too !

    All DoD entities with rocket and missile programs reported no launches scheduled or inadvertent, during the time period in the area of the reported contrail...
    Regards, Stan
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    Council Member AdamG's Avatar
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    KZLA LOS ANGELES A2832/10 - THE FOLLOWING RESTRICTIONS ARE REQUIRED DUE TO NAVAL AIR WARFARE CENTER WEAPONS DIVISION ACTIVATION OF W537. IN THE INTEREST OF SAFETY, ALL NON-PARTICIPATING PILOTS ARE ADVISED TO AVOID W537. IFR TRAFFIC UNDER ATC JURISDICTION SHOULD ANTICIPATE CLEARANCE AROUND W537 AND CAE 1176. CAE 1155 WILL NOT BE AVAILABLE FOR OCEANIC TRANSITION. CAE 1316 & CAE 1318 WILL NOT BE AVAILABLE FOR OCEANIC TRANSITION. CAE 1177 WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR OCEANIC TRANSITION. W537 ACTIVE, CAE 1176 CLOSED. SURFACE - FL390, 09 NOV 20:00 2010 UNTIL 10 NOV 01:00 2010. CREATED: 08 NOV 20:52 2010
    NOTAM was supposed to start three hours after the plume was seen (reported as @ 17.00 Pacific).

    Marc Ambinder, who is an encyclopedia of how the government works, thinks it could be a a spy satellite. He tweets: When launching spy satellites, opsec = timing of launch... post-launch cover story can be weak.
    So, basically, it could have been an impromptu satellite launch.
    http://www.businessinsider.com/was-t...#ixzz14tGttNAf
    A scrimmage in a Border Station
    A canter down some dark defile
    Two thousand pounds of education
    Drops to a ten-rupee jezail


    http://i.imgur.com/IPT1uLH.jpg

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    Council Member Fuchs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slapout9 View Post
    AdamG,that is interesting because "IF" it is a missile it seems to act more like a solid fuel rocket than some type of a sub launched missile as the media say may have happened.
    Many SLBMs have solid fuel rocket engines. It's safer and more durable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuchs View Post
    Many SLBMs have solid fuel rocket engines. It's safer and more durable.
    We were talking about SCUD's


    I think this guy did it
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9uPv3x2eDo

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    Personally, I like Jeffrey Lewis' translation of the DoD statement:

    I should render this statement in English:

    DOD: “While there is nothing at this time that leads the Department of Defense to believe this is a missile launch …”

    English: It wasn’t a missile.

    DOD: … the department and other US government agencies with expertise in aviation and space continue to look into the condensation trail (CONTRAIL) seen and reported off the coast of southern California on Monday evening.”

    English: But we will take this very, very seriously because we are professionals. After work, however, over a beer, we might use the term “nutjob that doesn’t know a jet contrail from his ass on fire.”

    DOD: “All DoD entities with rocket and missile programs reported no launches, scheduled or inadvertent, during the time period in the area of the reported contrail.”

    English: Look, we didn’t launch anything.

    DOD: NORAD and USNORTHCOM confirmed that it did not monitor any foreign military missile launch off the California coast yesterday …

    English: Nor did we see anyone else launch anything.

    DOD: and has determined that there was no threat to the US homeland.

    English: Did we mention that we are taking this very, very seriously because we are professionals? At least until we get to the bar?

    DOD: In addition, the FAA ran radar replays from Monday afternoon of a large area west of Los Angeles. Those replays did not reveal any fast-moving, unidentified targets.

    English: Don’t you think it is odd that the FAA radars only show airplanes?

    DOD: The FAA also did not receive reports of any unusual sightings from pilots who were flying in the area Monday afternoon.

    English: Or that no one else, other than the helicopter crew, say anything but airplanes?

    DOD: “If any new information comes to light in the coming days, we will update the press and public.”

    English: Time for that beer.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdamG View Post
    NOTAM was supposed to start three hours after the plume was seen (reported as @ 17.00 Pacific).

    Not if, as I suspect, they use Zulu (UTC) time.
    Last edited by davidbfpo; 11-10-2010 at 07:35 PM.

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    Council Member AdamG's Avatar
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    But Doug Richardson, the editor of Jane’s Missiles and Rockets, examined the video for the Times of London and said he was left with little doubt.

    "It’s a solid propellant missile," he told the Times. "You can tell from the efflux [smoke]."

    Richardson said it could have been a ballistic missile launched from a submarine or an interceptor, the defensive anti-missile weapon used by Navy surface ships.
    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/...n7040379.shtml
    A scrimmage in a Border Station
    A canter down some dark defile
    Two thousand pounds of education
    Drops to a ten-rupee jezail


    http://i.imgur.com/IPT1uLH.jpg

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    If it was an intentional launch of a missile.....then why was it done? What is the message and who is it for?

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    it could have been an impromptu satellite launch.
    Is this the missile equivalent of stand-up comedy?

    Who launches satellites on an impromptu basis?

    Serge, the Rodeo Drive Designer Rocketman?

    "oooh you look like a big payload guy with lots of thrust..."

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    Default A ruse...

    Just to let the international community know we are still alive and kicking over here. (Pacific Coherence)

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