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Thread: The Wikileaks collection

  1. #521
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    Default A bravo sierra argument ...

    is this:

    from JMA
    The aim (IMHO) is to sort Bradley Manning out and not try to use him to get to Assange. As the Brits will tell you... a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
    Oh, are the UK folks going to tell us about Kim Philby (cryptonym: Stanley), Donald Duart Maclean (cryptonym: Homer), Guy Burgess (cryptonym: Hicks) Anthony Blunt (cryptonym: Johnson), and John Cairncross (cryptonym: Liszt) ?

    For them and more links, see the Cambrifge Five; and for the more diligent, The Vassiliev Notebook and The Mitrokhin Archive - at the Wilson Center, Cold War International History Project). Also, at GWU National Securiy - the Rosenberg Grand Jury Transcripts, and at NSA - Venona (the mother lode).

    The idea in any conspiracy case (which includes all true espionage cases) is to determine whether there was a conspiracy (which usually means that a conspirator flips); and then who was involved in it (which usually requires lengthy interviews with the flipped conspirator and with all other leads). Instead of using the term "conspirators", you may use "accomplices before the fact" with more universal legal meaning.

    When to pull the trigger in these cases is a matter of judgment - too quickly, and other birds fly; too slowly, and all birds fly. Was the trigger pulled too quickly on Manning ? Perhaps, perhaps not; I don't have the evidence to even suggest an estimate. Since the trigger has been pulled, trying to determine "conspirators" ("accomplices before the fact") is only prudent. We'll see if Manning will co-operate in tht endeavor.

    Regards

    Mike
    Last edited by jmm99; 12-25-2010 at 03:02 AM.

  2. #522
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    Default It can only happen in America?

    Wikileaks and Julian Assange Slapped with $150-M Lawsuit

    Pitchford said that the damage that WikiLeaks’ actions will cause will lead to a reduction of the Medicaid benefits that he relies upon for health care, because the United States may eventually run out of money.
    It really seems mental health issues are getting out of control in the US...

  3. #523
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    Default

    JMA, anyone in the U.S. can file a lawsuit. Your comment is gratuitous.

  4. #524
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    Default JMA, you post interesting news items ...

    and then destroy the arguments with 1/2-a$$ed conclusions. Oh well, that is your privilege.

    Let's see. No attorney, and the plaintiff pays a $350 filing fee (GENERAL CIVIL CASE FILING REQUIREMENTS, p.17 of pdf) and takes a shot at $150 M. Are the odds worse than Lotto ? Probably.

    However, the guy may have more method than that in his "madness". If Wikileaks and Assange do not defend, the plaintiff can default them. Now, no judge will award $150M (and Assange and Wikileaks are likely already protected against judgments); but the guy will get his 15 minutes of fame.

    If they defend, the judge probably will not allow discovery of Wikileaks and Assange; but what if he did ? If so, the plaintiff might do as good a job as DoJ in investigating the direct and indirect contacts with Manning, pointing to a conspiracy (see prior post #301).

    So, the plaintiff may not be able to spell, may or may not have mental health issues, but probably sees himself as a patriot - who is taking the legal approach, rather than blasting away with a 9mm Glock.

    And, that is where your argument picks up apples (file a complaint) and oranges (blow someone away), conflates the two and ends up with a genuine fruit salad.

    Regards

    Mike
    Last edited by jmm99; 01-17-2011 at 01:09 AM.

  5. #525
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    JMA, anyone in the U.S. can file a lawsuit. Your comment is gratuitous.
    I understand vexatious litigation and would expect that to be thrown at Assange/Wikileaks in this matter but this an obvious case of frivolous litigation which should be/should have been dismissed with costs.

  6. #526
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Default I can't take it anymore

    It's no wonder I'm freezin my alpha off here instead of wallowing in the Florida sun.

    What will this trailer park resident do with all that cash in the aftermath of a nuclear war
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  7. #527
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    Default Two UK-based think tanks say

    Two contrasting comments on Wikileaks: by a RUSI analyst, which opens with:
    The damage to US and allied interests lies less in the embarrassment the leaked cables may have caused and more in the real intelligence they have provided to well-organised and sophisticated international terrorist groups.
    Link:http://www.rusi.org/analysis/comment...4D2DD4B6DB505/

    By the more international outlook IISS, which IMHO is both wider and less alarmist.

    Link:http://www.iiss.org/publications/str...-sharing-data/
    davidbfpo

  8. #528
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Default WikiLeaks Views Won’t Get Military Computers Wiped

    From the folks at the Danger Room...

    Work for the military? Couldn’t help but view a purloined WikiLeaks cable on your desktop?

    The Pentagon has to insist you delete it.

    This being the Pentagon, the memo tells information experts to “delete the affected file(s) by holding down the SHIFT key while pressing the DELETE key for Windows-based systems.”

    Would those info professionals not know how to delete?
    Much more hysteria at the link !
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  9. #529
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    Default Browse the leaks

    Thanks to an Australian pointer:
    This website Dazzlepod has already revolutionised the way you can access, comment on and search the cables.
    Link:http://dazzlepod.com/cable/
    davidbfpo

  10. #530
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stan View Post
    From the folks at the Danger Room...

    Much more hysteria at the link !
    Still can't figure out why there is more hysteria about Assange than there was about Hanoi Jane. The idiots at Justice still haven't figured out what crime Assange has committed while aiding and abetting the enemy is clear cut.

  11. #531
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMA View Post
    Still can't figure out why there is more hysteria about Assange than there was about Hanoi Jane. The idiots at Justice still haven't figured out what crime Assange has committed while aiding and abetting the enemy is clear cut.
    Hey JMA,
    Just my opinion as always

    At least Jane Fonda openly expressed regret for her misgivings, albeit much later.

    Let's be fair, there wasn't an internet in 72 and there certainly wasn't much in the way of State cables to leak either.

    If, and a big IF at that, one person dies due to Assange's meddling, he will definitely pay big and rightfully so.

    The post from Danger Room is however a cop out for DOD. I say burn the SOBs that view and store leaked classified material. We made a deal with enlistment; so it's guilty by default or ignorance, and ignorance of the law is no excuse.

    Regards, Stan
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  12. #532
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stan View Post
    Hey JMA,
    Just my opinion as always

    At least Jane Fonda openly expressed regret for her misgivings, albeit much later.

    Let's be fair, there wasn't an internet in 72 and there certainly wasn't much in the way of State cables to leak either.

    If, and a big IF at that, one person dies due to Assange's meddling, he will definitely pay big and rightfully so.

    The post from Danger Room is however a cop out for DOD. I say burn the SOBs that view and store leaked classified material. We made a deal with enlistment; so it's guilty by default or ignorance, and ignorance of the law is no excuse.

    Regards, Stan
    OK, so it took Hanoi Jane 16 years to apologise. So lets give Assange 15 years to apologise otherwise Justice can create a crime to nail him with. Deal?

  13. #533
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    Default oh really.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41241414...s_in_security/

    The unverified contention is that there's no link. I call bull#### on this.

    Manning made statements to Adrian Lamo that contradict this. Assange has contradicted himself multiple times on the same subject, and there's the whole ftp site they set up just for Manning that's been documented as well.

  14. #534
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    Quote Originally Posted by anonamatic View Post
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41241414...s_in_security/

    The unverified contention is that there's no link. I call bull#### on this.

    Manning made statements to Adrian Lamo that contradict this. Assange has contradicted himself multiple times on the same subject, and there's the whole ftp site they set up just for Manning that's been documented as well.
    Who cares? Wikileaks has confirmed to the world outside the US what they always suspected about US foreign policy. Wikileaks has now made it possible for US citizens to learn about the actions of those who "act in their name". Now the world waits to see if the US population will do anything about it or... just change to the next sports channel and ignore the whole thing.

  15. #535
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    Default With friends like these...

    U.S. officials backed rebels planning Egyptian uprising in 2008: WikiLeaks

    Even as they were officially supporting Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, American officials were secretly helping dissidents interested in using social media to overthrow his regime, a secret dispatch from the U.S. embassy in Cairo has revealed.
    ...and we learn this through Wikileaks.

  16. #536
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stan View Post
    Hey JMA,
    Just my opinion as always

    At least Jane Fonda openly expressed regret for her misgivings, albeit much later.

    Let's be fair, there wasn't an internet in 72 and there certainly wasn't much in the way of State cables to leak either.

    If, and a big IF at that, one person dies due to Assange's meddling, he will definitely pay big and rightfully so.

    The post from Danger Room is however a cop out for DOD. I say burn the SOBs that view and store leaked classified material. We made a deal with enlistment; so it's guilty by default or ignorance, and ignorance of the law is no excuse.

    Regards, Stan
    Hi Stan, I am quite frankly not in the least bit concerned what happens to Manning or indeed Assange... but I am very pleased that this stuff has been released into the public domain.

    Sure beats having to wait 30 odd years for the release through the Freedom of Information Act (or equivalents around the world) to find out exactly who got up to what and where. As soldiers have and are being held accountable for their actions on the battle field so should the #*@&#@ who worked in the State Department and the Brit Foreign and Commonwealth Office.

  17. #537
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Hey JMA,
    Sorry, I missed your post on cutting a deal for Assange.
    I may need to confer with a legal entity herein as there will be some hefty profits in the balance

    Quote Originally Posted by JMA View Post
    Hi Stan, I am quite frankly not in the least bit concerned what happens to Manning or indeed Assange... but I am very pleased that this stuff has been released into the public domain.
    I have mixed feelings about everything being dumped onto the public domain, but since I don't link to Wikileaks (nor am I authorized to) my opinion on the matter is skewed.

    The most recent releases in the Estonian press and responses by government officials have been positive, and those opinions were nothing "newsworthy" nor were they huge secrets. Sadly, my British and Swedish friends laughed hysterically at the bar last night over recently viewed leaks and I must admit, it's starting to sound like an adult version of kindergarten.

    Quote Originally Posted by JMA View Post
    Sure beats having to wait 30 odd years for the release through the Freedom of Information Act (or equivalents around the world) to find out exactly who got up to what and where. As soldiers have and are being held accountable for their actions on the battle field so should the #*@&#@ who worked in the State Department and the Brit Foreign and Commonwealth Office.
    Having worked around State personalities for over two decades, I'm only too well aware of the ease in which they share their unfounded opinions. All I can do (and did way back when) is shake my head. My final protest on the dark continent came when (then) February's People Magazine arrived and had a picture of Jack Nicholson on the cover with "You Don't Know Jack !" Having just lost another argument over what was really happening outside and the subsequent submission of that cable, I taped the cover of Jack on our door in the hallway
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  18. #538
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Default WikiLeaks nominated for Nobel Peace Prize

    From the folks at FT.com

    Snorre Valen, 26, a Norwegian musician and politician, said he chose to nominate WikiLeaks for promoting human rights and freedom of speech.

    Some observers did not rate WikiLeaks’ chances of winning.

    “To claim that [Mr Assange’s] actions have in some way promoted ‘fraternity among nations,’ to invoke the famous line in Alfred Nobel’s will, would be far-fetched, if not altogether inaccurate,” Scott London, a US journalist and Nobel Peace Prize specialist, told the AFP news agency.
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  19. #539
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    To claim that [Mr Assange’s] actions have in some way promoted ‘fraternity among nations,’(...)
    I don't see how Aung San Suu Kyi did that.

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    Default Mmm Swedish Pancakes

    http://www.viceland.com/int/v18n2/ht...cripts-707.php

    Fully work safe URL. Mmm pancakes!!

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