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    Default German literature on COIN in Afghanistan

    Currently writing a dissertation on the evolution of COIN in Afghanistan and I'm looking for articles about the German experience of COIN from their first deployment to now. Having difficulty finding a lot of stuff in English, so if anyone knows of any good articles or even books that cover the German approach to COIN. Also I was wondering what serving German military personnel thought about the American presence in their areas, did they see it as undermining their hard work or were they glad to see them.
    Last edited by davidbfpo; 06-01-2011 at 09:53 PM. Reason: Moved to RFI thread for greater prominence, PM to author

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    http://www.bundesregierung.de/Webs/B...chrichten.html is somewhat dated, but might have something
    interesting.

    Marco seliger had some interesting pieces in German in "The Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung" and "Loyal".
    Maybe he can point you to English versions of these articles.
    His contact info can be found at http://www.reservistenverband.de/php....php?menu=0415

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    Fuchs and UWEW, thanks to the both of you, sent of emails.

    I'm as much interested in personal experiences. I'm friendly with a few people who've just come back from the most recent Op Herrick and I'm hoping to get a chance to speak to them, no idea if they'll be in my home town the same time as I am. I'd quite like to know what anyone who's served in Afghan has thought about the grand strategy and how it translates on the ground. So if anyone wants to share their experiences or knows of any good articles, please go ahead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TDB View Post
    Fuchs and UWEW, thanks to the both of you, sent of emails.

    I'm as much interested in personal experiences. I'm friendly with a few people who've just come back from the most recent Op Herrick and I'm hoping to get a chance to speak to them, no idea if they'll be in my home town the same time as I am. I'd quite like to know what anyone who's served in Afghan has thought about the grand strategy and how it translates on the ground. So if anyone wants to share their experiences or knows of any good articles, please go ahead.
    When you find out what the Afghanistan Grand Strategy is please be sure to let me know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JMA View Post
    When you find out what the Afghanistan Grand Strategy is please be sure to let me know.
    http://www.isaf.nato.int/mission.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuchs View Post
    It reads:

    Mission
    In support of the Government of the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan, ISAF conducts operations in Afghanistan to reduce the capability and will of the insurgency, support the growth in capacity and capability of the Afghan National Security Forces (ANSF), and facilitate improvements in governance and socio-economic development in order to provide a secure environment for sustainable stability that is observable to the population.
    That I read as the military mission. I would like to see the political Grand strategy... if they have one.

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    Sure. They want to wait till the mission is accomplished.

    A Grand Strategy doesn't need to be good or at least sane to exist.


    The German government clung to this paper mission of ISAF for years. Their strategy is indeed to sit it out and let 4k troops rot in AFG.

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    Maybe I can help you out with my 2008 BA dissertation 'Politics over Firepower: Assessing Germany's Role in Counterinsurgency Efforts in Afghanistan, 2002-2007'. Just need an address I can send it to.

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    Quote Originally Posted by m2r View Post
    Maybe I can help you out with my 2008 BA dissertation 'Politics over Firepower: Assessing Germany's Role in Counterinsurgency Efforts in Afghanistan, 2002-2007'. Just need an address I can send it to.
    PM sent, thanks very much.

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    Default German approach to COIN

    I'm not an academic, but I have extensive street level COIN and CT experience in CENTCOM as a US Soldier. I am currently attached to a German unit in Afghanistan.

    I have also been a first hand observer of many of the dynamics and events discussed in this Spiegel article, and can attest to the truthfulness and accuracy of its content.

    http://www.spiegel.de/international/...766857,00.html

    I have made a lot of mental observations. Feel free to email me if I can help with anything.



    Quote Originally Posted by TDB View Post
    Currently writing a dissertation on the evolution of COIN in Afghanistan and I'm looking for articles about the German experience of COIN from their first deployment to now. Having difficulty finding a lot of stuff in English, so if anyone knows of any good articles or even books that cover the German approach to COIN. Also I was wondering what serving German military personnel thought about the American presence in their areas, did they see it as undermining their hard work or were they glad to see them.
    Last edited by Alsultani; 06-10-2011 at 12:57 PM. Reason: adding additional thoughts

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alsultani View Post
    I'm not an academic, but I have extensive street level COIN and CT experience in CENTCOM as a US Soldier. I am currently attached to a German unit in Afghanistan.

    I have also been a first hand observer of many of the dynamics and events discussed in this Spiegel article, and can attest to the truthfulness and accuracy of its content.

    http://www.spiegel.de/international/...766857,00.html

    I have made a lot of mental observations. Feel free to email me if I can help with anything.
    The propaganda war is being lost it would seem. The first part of that article is truly shocking, you can't fight against public opinion like that. Actually speechless. Thanks for the offer, I will probably contact you as and when questions emerge in my mind. If anything I would prefer the opinion of someone on the ground, more often than not it gives you a better understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TDB View Post
    The propaganda war is being lost it would seem. The first part of that article is truly shocking, you can't fight against public opinion like that. Actually speechless. Thanks for the offer, I will probably contact you as and when questions emerge in my mind. If anything I would prefer the opinion of someone on the ground, more often than not it gives you a better understanding.
    Sadly (Italian) ex-comrades who have done tours in Afghanistan tell similar stories about wild running rumours with similar massage. The biggest problem of ISAF is that it is foreign. Even the best intent and the sweetest candy can not change that fact and for most in doubt the interpretation is always against you. It is maybe even against you in 'no doubt' situations.

    As the article states the political elite protected and financed by those foreigners does also play the blame game for quite some time now. At least the Western population won't have to fear a bloody political overtake when a Day X kicks off in Afghanistan.
    Last edited by Firn; 06-10-2011 at 09:55 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firn View Post
    Sadly (Italian) ex-comrades who have done tours in Afghanistan tell similar stories about wild running rumours with similar massage. The biggest problem of ISAF is that it is foreign. Even the best intent and the sweetest candy can not change that fact and for most in doubt the interpretation is always against you. It is maybe even against you in 'no doubt' situations.

    As the article states the political elite protected and financed by those foreigners does also play the blame game for quite some time now. At least the Western population won't have to fear a bloody political overtake when a Day X kicks off in Afghanistan.
    Too true, Karzai is playing a dangerous game though. He fails to realise that he holds no real power over the weak state. I dare say that the ANA and ANP are only loyal to their paymasters (though I use the world loyal with my tongue placed firmly in my cheek) and from what I've read they very rarely get paid on time. I forsee a military coup, if not before ISAF leave. The question will be, what will ISAF do. Will they rally to the defense of Karzai or will they see it as an opportunity to get a fresh face in power. If he continues to play the blame game he runs the risk of annoying the very people he's relying on to stay in power.

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    Do the German forces have a say in how, when and why spec ops capture/kill missions are run in their area?
    "We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene

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    Quote Originally Posted by carl View Post
    Do the German forces have a say in how, when and why spec ops capture/kill missions are run in their area?
    I very much doubt it, JSOC operates outside of ISAF command doesn't it? This is a massive issue, as was seen in a documentary which aired on channel 4 on monday, these operations can have a massive impact on the general management of COIN, you can only bend something so much before it breaks, by which I mean the good will of the people. The fact that public opinion is swiftly turning against the foreign forces is fuelled by the operations

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