South China Sea and China (2011-2017)

**davidbfpo** · 06-08-2011

In a BBC report on the PRC's aircraft carrier is a small map of the South China Sea and the disputed islands (my IT skills preclude placing it here):http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-13692558

The dotted line showing China's claims do make one pause for thought.

**slapout9** · 06-08-2011

Don't worry about the south china sea look what they want to do in Boise,Idaho.

http://endoftheamericandream.com/arc...of-boise-idaho

**carl** · 06-08-2011

Slap:

That story is a little breathless, the implication being the thousands of Chinamen are going to be establishing an enclave in Idaho, sort of the Shanghai legations reversed. I'll believe it when I see it. If the Chinese want to build businesses and facilities in Idaho, essentially giving us money, let 'em at it. The Idahos won't care who signs the paycheck as long as it doesn't bounce.

The story also contains this quote:

"The borrower is always the servant of the lender, and now China is buying up America."

That is true unless you get into really big money, then the situation is reversed. Or so says Donald Trump.

**slapout9** · 06-08-2011

Originally Posted by carl

Slap:

That story is a little breathless, the implication being the thousands of Chinamen are going to be establishing an enclave in Idaho, sort of the Shanghai legations reversed. I'll believe it when I see it. If the Chinese want to build businesses and facilities in Idaho, essentially giving us money, let 'em at it. The Idahos won't care who signs the paycheck as long as it doesn't bounce.

The story also contains this quote:

"The borrower is always the servant of the lender, and now China is buying up America."

That is true unless you get into really big money, then the situation is reversed. Or so says Donald Trump.

Carl, maybe you are right but what I thought was most interesting was the concept of a self sustaining city.....what exactly does that mean? Invasion by we(China) have a better idea on how to run things.

**AdamG** · 06-09-2011

China warned Asian neighbors Thursday to stop searching for oil near the disputed Spratly Islands and vowed to assert its sovereignty over the potentially petroleum-rich territory in the South China Sea despite rival claims.
China and the Philippines have swapped diplomatic protests over the islands, with Filipino officials accusing Chinese forces of intruding into Manila-claimed areas...

http://www.newsday.com/business/chin...1.2942569?qr=1

**Backwards Observer** · 06-10-2011

The newly youthful (26!) Lee Kuan Yew comments (article seems partly Engrish translation):

Former Prime Minister of Singapore Lee Kuan Yew, 26, said that the U.S. is able to counterbalance the growth of China as the sole full strength, so keeping the U.S. interest in the region is very important.

Lee Kuan Yew is on the “Future of Asia” at the annual meeting to clarify this point. Asia-Pacific Annual Conference brings together the country’s political leaders and business leaders.

He said, the key is to keep American interest in the Western Pacific region.

His hundreds of entrepreneurs, academics and students, said: “You can beat Japan, South Korea, ASEAN, even with Taiwan and India, but you can not compete in China. It is too big. Only the United States and its advanced technology to counterbalance China. “

Lee - Only the United States and its advanced technology to counter China - China News - June 5, 2011.

**Ray** · 06-12-2011

US not coming to PH aid vs China

The United States yesterday said it will not side with any party in the Spratlys conflict, which is to say that the Philippines’ most powerful ally will not be coming to its aid should its spat with China escalate into a shooting war.

The US Embassy made this clear yesterday in reaction to a Malacañang statement earlier yesterday expressing confidence that Washington would honor its commitment under the two countries’ Mutual Defense Treaty to come to the aid of a beleaguered ally.

“The US does not take sides in regional territorial disputes,” the US press attaché Rebecca Thompson said in an e-mailed statement when contacted for comment to deputy presidential spokesperson Abigail Valte’s invoking of the 60-year-old MDT.

Thompson said the US was “troubled by incidents in the South China Sea in recent days that have raised tensions in the region” and that Washington opposes “the use or threat of force” by any of the countries with rival claims to the Spratly islands.

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/14118/u...h-aid-vs-china

This would upset those who have any strategic relationship or Defence Pact with the US and none would like to enter such agreements in future.

**Backwards Observer** · 06-12-2011

Originally Posted by Ray

This would upset those who have any strategic relationship or Defence Pact with the US and none would like to enter such agreements in future.

You would probably know better than me, but my guess is that this is most likely to upset those who may see their relationship with the US as a 'let's you and him fight' arrangement viz Johnny Chinaman. US sleight of hand is probably best employed offstage in the opening acts of these affaires de coeur. I don't think the US willingness to go Deus Ex Machina on people's asses is really in doubt if it should come down to projectile flinging. Things may be different from what I imagine, however.

**Dayuhan** · 06-12-2011

Originally Posted by Ray

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/14118/u...h-aid-vs-china

This would upset those who have any strategic relationship or Defence Pact with the US and none would like to enter such agreements in future.

This is nothing at all new... the dispute is old and the US position is as well. The US considers the Spratlys to be disputed territory, not an integral part of the Philippines... which makes sense, because deciding these disputes is not in any way up to the US. Given this, Chinese military action in the Spratlys is not regarded as an attack on the Philippines and would not trigger the mutual defense pact. Again, this has been the US position for ages, and comes out every time the issue comes up, as it has done periodically for decades.

There's a big difference between being willing to protect allies from actual attack on their territory and taking a blanket position of support that actually encourages allies to take an unnecessarily bellicose stance that could provoke a conflict that would benefit nobody. I don't see that kind of common sense as a disincentive to anyone who wants a mutual defense relationship with the US.

**Ray** · 06-12-2011

US, Philippines to hold war games amid tension in South China Sea

The United States and the Philippines are set to hold naval exercise amid heightened tension in Western Philippine Sea following allegations of intrusion by Chinese Naval personnel in the Philippine-occupied area of the disputed Spratly Islands.
Philippine military authorities said though the the joint naval exercise has nothing to do with the reported Chinese incursions in Philippine territories, according to Armed Forces spokesman Commodore Jose Miguel Rodriguez.

Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/articl...#ixzz1P4zY6msy

Thar she Blows!

**Ray** · 06-12-2011

US Eyes Singapore Base

June 6, 2011

The US Navy will establish a new presence in Singapore as a staging location for its latest class of warship.

Defence Secretary Robert Gates announced plans for the presence during his visit to Singapore last week.......

According to the Singaporean Defence Ministry, those steps include deploying to Singapore ‘one or two’ of the new Littoral Combat Ships current under construction in the United States. The 400-foot-long, high-speed warships, optimized for shallow-water operations, would be the first US military vessels permanently stationed in the tiny Southeast Asian country, although the Navy for many years has maintained a support facility there.

http://the-diplomat.com/flashpoints-...ingapore-base/

**AdamG** · 06-12-2011

Vietnam has raised the stakes a little more in its current row with China, calling on the United States and others to step in and help find some kind of resolution.

http://the-diplomat.com/china-power/...-foreign-help/

**Backwards Observer** · 06-13-2011

Originally Posted by carl

I don't mind getting high sounding even if others roll their eyes when I do,

Carl, I don't know about high sounding or eye rolling, but at least you're willing to come on the council and engage with people who may not agree with you. There's plenty of them that spout off on the Taiwan issue that don't.

**slapout9** · 06-13-2011

So what's Vietnam, the Philippines,Taiwan,and Malaysia done for the United States lately? I just saw on the news that some Congressman went to Iraq and told their president that since things are going so well over there now they can start paying us back for the war like President Bush said they would. He was asked to leave Iraq! Point being we don't get any respect in the world because we are willing to fight and pay for others people's problems. If China wants to drill of the coast of VIETNAM

for oil....hey good for them!

**carl** · 06-13-2011

Slap:

It is not what those countries have done for us lately, it is what they can do for us in the future. Take a look at the map, if we told those countries to go pound sand, they would be forced to make an accommodation with China, most certainly including basing rights for them and none for us. That would make it impossible, impossible to prevail in any kind of conflict with China. That being the case, Japan and South Korea would be forced to go over and the Aussies would mandate Mandarin studies from the second grade onward. And that would just be the beginning.