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Thread: Pakistan: Inter Services Intelligence Directorate (ISI) - a collection

  1. #21
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    Default More questions..

    Something is going on IN Pakistan, but what? and why now? http://www.brownpundits.com/2012/02/...istan-council/

    Moderator's Note

    The link failed and website has a notice:
    Brownpundits was parasitized by cialis adds. Have to reinstall. Will do so in the next few days. -Razib
    Last edited by davidbfpo; 02-04-2012 at 10:10 AM. Reason: Add Note

  2. #22
    Council Member davidbfpo's Avatar
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    Default Pakistani intelligence: the very first years

    Hamid Hussain our regular contributor has written a short paper 'The Beginnings – Early Days of Intelligence in Pakistan' and is attached.

    Fascinating to see an Australian soldier played such a role; the Notes do have a link to his on-line biography. I was aware that a British General Gracey served as the first Army CinC, but not that an Australian general was Chief of Staff.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    davidbfpo

  3. #23
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    Default The Pakistani Godfather: The Inter-Services Intelligence and the Afghan Taliban 1994-

    The Pakistani Godfather: The Inter-Services Intelligence and the Afghan Taliban 1994-2010

    Entry Excerpt:



    --------
    Read the full post and make any comments at the SWJ Blog.
    This forum is a feed only and is closed to user comments.

  4. #24
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    Default Pakistan: Inter Services Intelligence Directorate (ISI) - An Analytical Overview

    Last edited by davidbfpo; 04-10-2013 at 10:35 AM. Reason: Copied here

  5. #25
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    Default U-Boats and ISI: what!

    The SWJ article linked above, by two Swiss authors, led to Carl commenting:
    This is quite an excellent monograph and I congratulate the authors. It does two very good things.

    First, it gathers together and presents in one place an overwhelming body of evidence confirming Pakistani perfidy. It is sort of a one stop shop when looking for references and evidence of murderous double dealing by the Pakistani government.

    Second, the authors don't mince words. The "Pakistani establishment" takes American money and uses it to support people who kill American and NATO troops, blowing off their legs and genitals among other things. They kill Americans. And without Pakistani help, Taliban & Co could not be in the favorable position they are now in. I wish we could be so plain spoken.
    That we have allowed this to go on for a decade will forever be a puzzlement to historians. It is as if Western Approaches Command had had liaison officers from the U-boat Waffe attached to and working closely with them to coordinate activities and distribute Lend-Lease aid (to the U-boat Waffe); and Churchill kept wondering why the merchantmen continued getting sunk.
    Pakistan and ISI often appear in posts, not always in South Asia threads, but the U-Boat comparison is - well - powerful.
    davidbfpo

  6. #26
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    I rarely comment on this stuff but I posted once a rather similar comment which I want to reframe.

    To me it seems that the ISI suffers from a clear case of groupthink and institutional imperative. They seem to be so impressed by the way they are playing the US&Co that they focus all their energy to do so while they are arguably harming their countries 'true' interest very much. In short they do the wrong thing in such a smart&successful way that they must be congratulating how clever they are. We will see if the slipped dogs of civil war can still be controlled...
    ... "We need officers capable of following systematically the path of logical argument to its conclusion, with disciplined intellect, strong in character and nerve to execute what the intellect dictates"

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    Speech at the Kriegsakademie, 1935

  7. #27
    Council Member carl's Avatar
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    Default

    David:

    We could carry the analogy further with the U-boat Waffe liaison officers giving up an Italian submarine occasionally, Coastal Command VLR Liberators (the disruptive technology of the day) going after Russian subs in the Baltic and maybe Brooke making public pronouncements about how good a buddy Doenitz was.

    I really think what we have been doing in Af-PAK, for 12 YEARS (!), is as mad as the impossible to conceive analogy I presented.

    We know and have known how insane this situation has been for years. The monograph does an excellent job of pulling all the open source evidence together. The problem may be that we may never see official documents confirming how bad the situation has been. Computer files may be a lot easier to 'disappear' than paper. The powers that be have a huge incentive to erase official evidence about how their impregnable personal pride, naivete and arrogance has played right into the hands of the grifters in 'Pindi, and how that has resulted in the deaths of hundreds and hundreds of Americans and thousands and thousands of Afghans.

    Firn: The thing that interests, and enrages, me is our behavior. The feudal elites/Pak Army/ISI are destroying their country for their own short term benefit and nothing can stop them now. Ironically I think, us being such fools has robbed Pakistan of any chance it may have had. If we had stopped their game 10 years ago they may have been discredited and maybe Pakistan would have had a chance. Not now though. The thing with the game they run on us is they run it on us. It can only work on such titanic fools such as the American elites. Nobody else has the proper combination of narcissistic pride and ignorance. It is no accomplishment besting a fool but they won't remember that and will have very great trouble because the guys in their neighborhood are no fools.

    But like I said, the thing that interests me is our behavior. It is beyond reason.

    (David: I like my analogy but I am not sure how many people get it on this side of the pond. There may not be many people familiar with the Battle of the Atlantic anymore.)
    Last edited by carl; 04-10-2013 at 02:25 PM.
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    Default Spotlight: Secret Pakistan - Double Cross (Part 1)

    Just by chance I found this documentary and watched it on T.V. tonight. Nothing new for those who been following the conflict. They interviewed a number of witnesses on both sides of the story to add credibility to their story on ISI's support for the Taliban and Al-Qaeda. Part 2 looks interesting, suspect it play next week.

    I don't know if this is available online or not. (Added: not downloading in the UK alas).

    http://www.linktv.org/programs/secre...n-double-cross

    Filmed largely in Pakistan and Afghanistan, this two-part documentary series explores how a supposed ally stands accused by top CIA officers and Western diplomats of causing the deaths of thousands of coalition soldiers in Afghanistan. It is a charge denied by Pakistan's military establishment, but the documentary makers meet serving Taliban commanders who describe the support they get from Pakistan in terms of weapons, training and a place to hide.

    Part 1 of Secret Pakistan investigates signs of duplicity that emerged after 9/11 and disturbing intelligence reports after Britain's forces entered Helmand in 2006.
    Last edited by davidbfpo; 01-04-2014 at 03:08 PM. Reason: Add italics text

  9. #29
    Council Member Dayuhan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidbfpo View Post
    Fascinating to see an Australian soldier played such a role; the Notes do have a link to his on-line biography. I was aware that a British General Gracey served as the first Army CinC, but not that an Australian general was Chief of Staff.
    I believe the same General, Dougles Gracey, commanded the British expeditionary force that took control of Saigon at the close of WW2, and played a pivotal role in the restoration of French rule. He had a hand in a fair bit of history, though I don't suppose we should blame him for the outcomes.
    “The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary”

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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dayuhan View Post
    I believe the same General, Dougles Gracey, commanded the British expeditionary force that took control of Saigon at the close of WW2, and played a pivotal role in the restoration of French rule. He had a hand in a fair bit of history, though I don't suppose we should blame him for the outcomes.
    Dayuhan,

    Yes General Gracey took his Indian Army division to Saigon in 1945, which IIRC has a mention / debate elsewhere here and it is a complicated period of history. The division then went to the Dutch East Indies (to become Indonesia) and had its toughest ever fighting against the nationalists, with some unofficial Japanese help (deserters and weapons) at the port of Surabayu (?). There is a good book on the Saigon episode, The First Indo-China War by Peter Dunn, pub. 1985 (which has disappeared from my bookshelves) and on:http://www.amazon.com/First-Vietnam-...5879757&sr=1-4
    Last edited by davidbfpo; 01-04-2014 at 02:18 PM.
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  11. #31
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    Default ISI's new boss: the 2nd most powerful Pakistani

    Owen Bennett-Jones, a BBC SME on South Asia, has a short article reviewing Pakistani national security as ISI gets a new Director:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-29903400

    He starts with:
    When he takes over the intelligence service ISI, Lt Gen Rizwan Akhtar will become one of the two most powerful men in Pakistan, answerable only to the army chief.
    Moderator's Note

    This thread has been re-named to reflect the merging of three threads and that it is a collection on ISI (ends).
    Last edited by davidbfpo; 11-07-2014 at 11:24 AM.
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  12. #32
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    Default

    When he takes over the intelligence service ISI, Lt Gen Rizwan Akhtar will become one of the two most powerful men in Pakistan, answerable only to the army chief.
    I don't think that this the case. Both Army chief and ISI director are independently powerful and neither report to each other. Case and point, Kargil fiasco and the 1999 coup.

    Ziauddin has served as Director-General of Pakistan's premier intelligence agency ISI. He was nominated for the post of Pakistan Army chief on 12 Oct 1999 by then-Prime minister Nawaz Sharif after the dismissal of General Pervez Musharraf, who had begun a coup against the government.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ziauddin_Butt



    Also, here's a discussion between Hamid Mir and Indian journalists. Couldn't find the relevant section so I am posting it here.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMn6otJ0VP4

  13. #33
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    Default Insight on ISI's Director-General

    This passage is taken from a long, five page commentary (on the main thread for the Pakistani Army, see Post 120 on:http://council.smallwarsjournal.com/...?t=8282&page=6 )

    General Rizwan Akhtar was commissioned into the 4th Frontier Force Regiment. He is considered a good officer by his peers. His career is also typical of senior officers reaching Lieutenant General rank with usual command, staff and instructional appointments. He commanded the 27th Infantry brigade of the 7th Infantry Division from 2005-07. However, all North Waziristan formations were essentially restricted to their posts and there were no offensive operations. The Army was busy cleaning the South Waziristan and the swamps of North Waziristan were rapidly filling with alligators of all shapes and hues. The Army high command was simply reacting to events on the ground with the result that it lost the support of local population in tribal areas. In 2011-12, he was GOC of the 9th Division operating in South Waziristan. He was Director General (DG) of the Sindh Rangers in 2012-14 and involved in the clean-up operation against criminal elements in the city of Karachi. In October 2014, he was promoted to Lieutenant General rank and appointed DGISI. In 2005 as Brigade commander in North Waziristan, he prepared a detailed report about the threats emanating from North Waziristan and response options. In 2008, while at the US Army War College at Carlisle Barracks, Pennsylvania, Rizwan wrote his course paper on the U.S.-Pakistan trust deficit and the war on terror. He made several recommendations on how to bridge the gap in trust between Pakistan and the USA. Now as DGISI, his position enables him to address both these issues – only time will tell how successful he will be in this endeavor.
    davidbfpo

  14. #34
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    Default CIA-ISI a good relationship that lasted for a short period

    Taken from a short obituary of Major General Ihtisham Zamir Jafri, who passed away in Rawalpindi on 04 May, 2015, by hamid Hussain (SWC contributor):
    His most important assignment was when he was Deputy Director of Internal Security wing of Counter Intelligence (CI) section of Inter Services Intelligence (ISI) from 2001 to 2003. In the aftermath of 11 September, 2001, relation between ISI and CIA was revived on an urgent basis. Ihtisham as DDG Internal Security played an important role in the capture of many high profile foreign terrorists. He was clear in his mind about the threat faced by Pakistan and at that time period ISI was operating in full gear against al-Qaeda. Robert Grenier was then CIA station chief of Islamabad. Deputy station chief was an old Afghan hand with firsthand knowledge of the region and he made a great team with Ihtisham. All the technical data collected by CIA from a variety of sources about specific targets was shared with ISI team in Islamabad. This was then passed on to the provincial heads of ISI in each province. Local intelligence teams further investigated initiated surveillance and then conducted raids to arrest culprits.

    This good relationship that lasted for a short period was due to the fact that at that time United States was only interested in al-Qaeda and focus was only on foreign fighters. Any local fish caught in the net were simply handed over to Pakistanis to take care of them while foreigners were transported o Bagram air base with onward journey to Guantanamo Bay prison. American foot print in Afghanistan was limited to few dozen CIA paramilitary and Special Forces troops and Haqqani network and Lashkar-e-Taiba were somewhere in future. In his memoirs, Grenier didn’t use Ihtisham’s name due to personal security risk but now that Ihtisham has left the world, he doesn’t need to be anonymous. Grenier used a pseudo name of “Imran Zaman” using initials of I for Ihtesham and Z for Zamir.
    davidbfpo

  15. #35
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    Default CIA-ISI relationship after Abbottabad

    In this excerpt from The Great War of our Time: The CIA's Fight Against Terrorism, former CIA deputy director Mike Morell describes the relationship with Pakistan after the US raid on Osama Bin Laden.
    davidbfpo

  16. #36
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    Default New book: Faith, Unity, Discipline: The ISI of Pakistan

    A retired Indian intelligence officer has reviewed a new book on ISI by a German author: Faith, Unity, Discipline: The ISI of Pakistan by Hein G. Kiesslin.

    Near the start:
    ... which takes an incisive look into the organisation’s functioning. In Kiessling’s book, the ISI appears as a motley group of fractious and rapacious operatives with shifting domestic and foreign loyalties, whose motto swings between bluster, blackmail, acquiescence and perfidy. The ISI itself will not claim that Kiessling is a hostile writer. He lived in Quetta and Islamabad for 13 years from 1989 to 2002. For the book, Kiessling interviewed most former ISI chiefs..
    Link to the review:http://thewire.in/80819/delving-into...gs-of-the-isi/

    Being published by Hurst (UK) it is on:https://www.amazon.co.uk/Faith-Unity...SI+of+Pakistan

    The publishers have two glowing reviews, one by Bruce Reidel (who has been cited here before IIRC):http://www.hurstpublishers.com/book/...ty-discipline/
    Last edited by davidbfpo; 11-19-2016 at 10:38 PM. Reason: 26,386v
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  17. #37
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    Default Department 'S': a new book by Steve Coll

    The sub-title of a book review in 'The Guardian':
    This sequel to Ghost Wars might well become the definitive account of the CIA and America’s secret wars in Afghanistan and Pakistan
    Here is a sample passage:
    Directorate S, from which the book gets its title, lies buried deep in the bureaucracy of the ISI (Inter-Services Intelligence), Pakistan’s spy agency. Ensconced thus, the directorate works to “enlarge Pakistan’s sphere of influence in Afghanistan”. It goes about this task, Coll explains, by supplying, arming, training and generally seeking to legitimise the Taliban, the AK-47 toting terrorists who took over Afghanistan in 1992, stringing up decapitated corpses in town squares and shoving women into the confines of their homes. Nobody paid much attention then, and perhaps never would have, had the Taliban not become host to Osama bin Laden.
    Link:https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...e-coll-review?
    Last edited by davidbfpo; 01-27-2018 at 09:12 PM. Reason: 52,093v 26k up since last post
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  18. #38
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    Default Moderator's pointer

    There are two reviews of a new book on the Indian-Pakistani intelligence relationship and wider issues on the Pakistani Military thread. See:http://council.smallwarsjournal.com/...777#post211777
    davidbfpo

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