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  1. #1
    Council Member jcustis's Avatar
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    David, was there an executive summary to the review that could be summarized here? I imagine that it probably blows some sunshine in some regards and has sire warnings in others, like most of them do, but I am curious nonetheless.

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    Council Member davidbfpo's Avatar
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    Default CIMIC: Afghan Local Police

    Jon,

    The CIMIC report's conclusion hopefully answers your quest:
    The ALP is the latest attempt to establish a local defence force to help foster security throughout Afghanistan. The force is designed with particular recruitment and vetting procedures that are intended to keep local strongmen and former insurgents from infiltrating the ALP. However, the implementation of these procedures in rural village environments throughout Afghanistan has proven and will continue to prove difficult. Deploying this arbakai-based force throughout Afghanistan is a challenge. A long-standing tradition of arbakai exists only in certain parts of the country, and attempting to appeal to local population groups by establishing militias under the guise of a traditional structure is problematic. To date, some, though not all, communities have met local police efforts with distrust and scepticism, potentially exacerbating the pre-existing divide between the state and the citizenry in parts of the country. However, there are signs that this incarnation of a local police force is having some success in combating insurgents ultimately providing improved security for rural communities. Despite these successes, descriptions of misconduct by local defence initiatives are common. Navigating the blurry line between legitimate community safe-keepers and rogue militias will prove a major challenge and priority for the ALP and its overseers in the Afghan MoI and international community.
    My summary: an idea that might work well and is beset with difficulties.
    davidbfpo

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    Council Member 120mm's Avatar
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    Arbakai/ALP I think is one of the least understood and most abused concept by pundits.

    The base of the problem is the insane concept of a National Police force. There is no good example of a functioning national police force in the world, that is not involved in enforcing tyranny. None. The centralized control of the ANP means that they are largely irrelevant to localities. It takes the Minister of Justice to approve filling a truck with fuel, and if he is on vacation his Deputy cannot sign the paperwork, the district ANP just sit and do nothing for lack of fuel.

    The only effective police forces NEED to be locally generated and responsible to their localities.

    Currently, none of the ALP are being paid, because the good folks in GIRoA are apparently stealing all their pay and sending it out of the country. In addition, the Afghans do not understand the program, and/or are using it to their own ends, because the US and ISAF lacks the will to actually enforce conditions on the money we give the the criminal filth that runs Afghanistan

    Arbakai pretty much singlehandedly pushed Taliban out of those districts in the north of Afghanistan, and because they are not Pashtun butt-buddies of Karzai and his fellow criminals who run GIRoA, those districts are being allocated either little or no ALP. This is after those Arbakai have been by and large promised positions AS ALP. One of the selling points of ALP from the beginning was to bring a certain amount of those Arbakai under government control and forcing them to answer to the government. Now you have lots of armed men who haven't been paid for 9 months wandering the countryside, getting money through usher, which is basically demanding money from people they meet. While I'm on the concept of usher, who in hell is supposed to pay for security? The population, which is fundamentally communistic and socialist in viewpoint, seems to think they don't have to pay for anything and the government/foreigners will magically provide for security, jobs and all sorts of things. Why NOT force the people to pay for their own damned security? The Taliban taxes them in the same fashion, so it is basically a wash for the populace.

    Problem is, Karzai IS the government, and there is no real democracy. As long as Karzai appoints his fellow criminals to provincial, district and city positions, there is no real hope for security. Real security involves local people determining who the mayor of their city, district and province are, and making them answerable to maintaining security.

    This means that so-called "warlords" are going to dominate localities. And power will be taken from the overcentralized nightmare of criminals that include and surround Karzai. The question I ask then, is "So what?" There is no doubt in my own mind that local criminals will do a much, much better job of running localities than centralized criminals in Kabul. Afghanistan NEEDs warlords right now, on the local level. They sure as hell do not have a central government to speak of. I also think that building local governments, with the acquiescence of local power brokers will minimize the probability of the upcoming Civil War that noone wants to talk about.

    Funny thing about so-called "warlords". If they are Pashtuns in the south, they are "tribal leaders". If they are Tajik or Uzbek in the north, they are "warlords." I for one am getting sick and tired of the Pashtun plurality (NOT a majority, and if there ever were to be a census, I would bet they are actually a TRUE minority) being coddled and kowtowed to. Currently, the Pashtun plurality is living in the past and have wrapped themselves with an undeserved mantle of entitlement and really not contributing anything to Afghanistan.

    Time to divide this critter into it's constituent parts, and if they can make Federalism work at a later date, fine. Also time to quit funnelling money to the central government, imo.

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    Council Member 120mm's Avatar
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    It's also time for the effeminate, neutered Eurotrash and hypersensitive overeducated Northeast US intellectuals get over their fear of the term "militia".

    Militias have been instrumental in true nationbuilding since the beginning of time.

    Afghanistan is like medievel England; Robber barons and militias were a phase necessary to advance the society to where it is today. If Afghanistan is to have any hope at all of suceeding long term, and I am not sure it does do to geographical issues, it will have to move out of this phase on it's own.

    I do not think it is possible to force a country into a mold such as we are currently attempting.

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    Council Member Infanteer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 120mm View Post
    The base of the problem is the insane concept of a National Police force. There is no good example of a functioning national police force in the world, that is not involved in enforcing tyranny. None.
    Perhaps our definitions of "National Police Forces" differ, but in Canada we have the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, a national body that handles federal, provincial and municipal policing.

    As for the rest of your post, couldn't agree more. From my experience, the Afghan village is the beginning and end of politics. There are a few trans-village officials, such as the mirow, a man selected by all villages affected by a specific waterway to manage it on behalf of all of them, but that's about it.

    Village-based policing is definately the ideal solution, with a force such as the ANA between the villages to keep the peace as villages, even side-by-side, are often of a different qawm and may or may not get along. A small mentoring force for these ANA will bolster their abilities and keep them honest.

    A large, mechanized Western Army sprinkled about the area, drawing insurgents like moths to a flame, is most definatly not the solution. Have a small Fire Brigade in KAF on hand to deal with things when the roof gets blown off.

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    Council Member 120mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Infanteer View Post
    Perhaps our definitions of "National Police Forces" differ, but in Canada we have the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, a national body that handles federal, provincial and municipal policing.

    As for the rest of your post, couldn't agree more. From my experience, the Afghan village is the beginning and end of politics. There are a few trans-village officials, such as the mirow, a man selected by all villages affected by a specific waterway to manage it on behalf of all of them, but that's about it.

    Village-based policing is definately the ideal solution, with a force such as the ANA between the villages to keep the peace as villages, even side-by-side, are often of a different qawm and may or may not get along. A small mentoring force for these ANA will bolster their abilities and keep them honest.

    A large, mechanized Western Army sprinkled about the area, drawing insurgents like moths to a flame, is most definatly not the solution. Have a small Fire Brigade in KAF on hand to deal with things when the roof gets blown off.
    Just to clarify, are you telling me there is no other municipal or higher police force than the RCMP? That the RCMP is out writing parking tickets and directing traffic on city streets?

    How about when someone is killed or something is stolen in Montreal? Does the RCMP do the investigating and arresting?

    Every country has "some" form of National Police. RCMP works well, I am told, in the less inhabited areas, but I was unaware they were doing the day to do street cop work in other parts of Canada.

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    Council Member Infanteer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 120mm View Post
    Just to clarify, are you telling me there is no other municipal or higher police force than the RCMP? That the RCMP is out writing parking tickets and directing traffic on city streets?

    How about when someone is killed or something is stolen in Montreal? Does the RCMP do the investigating and arresting?

    Every country has "some" form of National Police. RCMP works well, I am told, in the less inhabited areas, but I was unaware they were doing the day to do street cop work in other parts of Canada.
    The RCMP will do all policing to fill any void that exists.

    In, say, Ontario there is a provincial police force that handles all provincial policing and a city like Toronto will have its own municipal force as well.

    But, the province of British Columbia has the RCMP do much of its provincial and municipal policing. Aside from a few cities with their own municipal forces (which you can count on your hands) the RCMP is the sole policing agency for a Province of 4,000,000 people. They police areas ranging from small villages in the north to large urban cities like Burnaby and Surrey that are close to 1 million residents.

    So yes, in many areas, they are out investigating murders, writing traffic tickets and handling motor vehicle accidents.

  8. #8
    Council Member 120mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Infanteer View Post
    The RCMP will do all policing to fill any void that exists.

    In, say, Ontario there is a provincial police force that handles all provincial policing and a city like Toronto will have its own municipal force as well.

    But, the province of British Columbia has the RCMP do much of its provincial and municipal policing. Aside from a few cities with their own municipal forces (which you can count on your hands) the RCMP is the sole policing agency for a Province of 4,000,000 people. They police areas ranging from small villages in the north to large urban cities like Burnaby and Surrey that are close to 1 million residents.

    So yes, in many areas, they are out investigating murders, writing traffic tickets and handling motor vehicle accidents.
    And they are doing so for lack of population density, right? And they report directly, in a stovepiped organization to a single minister of RCMP?

    My point is, the ANP is run in an extremely stovepiped organization, on a centralized national level that CANNOT work. Yet we, the international community continue to syphon money to this ineffective and corrupt organization and then throw up our hands when it comes to oversight because "it's their country".

    How about we tell them to fix their ####, because it's "our money". Huh?

    The time has come to force them to decentralize, and to democratize at the lower levels or to just pull the heck out, especially our money.

    The current government cannot work. In no way shape or form. And it's time to stop wasting blood and treasure until they make real steps to instituting a form of governance that CAN work.

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