Victory in Iraq

[slapout9]

Dave, a few days ago(week or so) you recommended the westhawk blog and to read all it. Did you read his Plan to win? What do you think of it?

[RTK]

Dave, a few days ago(week or so) you recommended the westhawk blog and to read all it. Did you read his Plan to win? What do you think of it?

Here's the plan

I disagree with 85% of it. It's the "turtle" approach in some parts, edging to the brink of extremely stupid in others. Here's some lowlights that I could pick out.

1. Advisors turn into combat liaisons for logistics, intel and fire support. Yeah, like I'd want that job.

2. Advisors don't interfere with planning operations. Kinda steals away the purpose of even being there.

3. Al Anbar and Baghdad get offered up for a massive show of force on the Iranian border - with no task or purpose.

4. The police and IA training point threw me for a loop. Most of the academies I saw last year *were* being run by Iraqis to Iraqi standards. I understand we run some academies, but most of the big ones are run by the government already.

5. By abandoning counterinsurgency, it's like the kid who puts his fingers in his ears, yells really loud, and tells you his not listening to you. It's too late for that. Counterinsurgency operations are the primary task and purpose in theater. Defeat of insurgents is the decisive point. This proposal makes no mention of the new decisive point, key tasks, or endstate.

6. The argument that moving tons of combat power to the Iranian border would "intimidate the Iranians" is utter nonsense. It would likely piss them off and perhaps escalate things to a position we need them not escalate to.

7. US forces quit patrolling in the cities and towns. Again, what's the task and purpose, then, of the forces remaining? QRF to the logistic liaison?

As for Keane's proposal: I know quite a few people who worked on that. It Tal Afarizes Baghdad. It works. I've seen it happen. And judging from the names I saw on the last page and those I know well, the OPLAN has probably already been written to include the BUILD part that another blog felt was lacking entirely. After working with some of them, I know that's a good plan and could easily see it work.

My major question to it, however, is why not have a test run of it in Ramadi, which is a haven of its own but far easier to isolate, not to mention smaller?

[slapout9]

RTK, thanks for responding. I didn't know if anybody would. I was for the Keane plan the first time I saw it. Couple of comments from an LE standpoint.

1-I don't think Iraqi Police have standards.

2-In the end if we are going to stay we have to go to B'Dad and clean it out and restore some basic security and sanity to the place. There is no other way to do it. You have to deal with those assholes and I mean lead pipe,blow torch and ranger hatchet personal combat I gonna seriously kick you ass once and for all. No more shooting or bombing or head chopping. We have to get respect! then you can do that huggy wuggy nicey stuff, but until we show who is in charge nothing is going to change.

Later

[RTK]

RTK, thanks for responding. I didn't know if anybody would. I was for the Keane plan the first time I saw it. Couple of comments from an LE standpoint.

1-I don't think Iraqi Police have standards.

2-In the end if we are going to stay we have to go to B'Dad and clean it out and restore some basic security and sanity to the place. There is no other way to do it. You have to deal with those assholes and I mean lead pipe,blow torch and ranger hatchet personal combat I gonna seriously kick you ass once and for all. No more shooting or bombing or head chopping. We have to get respect! then you can do that huggy wuggy nicey stuff, but until we show who is in charge nothing is going to change.

Later

Agreed. Additionally, and I know this invades upon another divisive thread somewhere on here, Baghdad is, at the least, key terrrain. At the most, it's the decisive point. Either way, it must be dealt with.