Results 1 to 20 of 37

Thread: Is one man's terrorist really another man's freedom fighter?

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Council Member Dayuhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Latitude 17° 5' 11N, Longitude 120° 54' 24E, altitude 1499m. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    3,137

    Default

    I wonder whether Mr Netanyahu would have considered the Irgun or the Stern Gang to be "freedom fighters" or "terrorists"... I seem to recall them blowing up non-combatants on a number of occasions.
    “The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary”

    H.L. Mencken

  2. #2
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Durban, South Africa
    Posts
    3,902

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dayuhan View Post
    I wonder whether Mr Netanyahu would have considered the Irgun or the Stern Gang to be "freedom fighters" or "terrorists"... I seem to recall them blowing up non-combatants on a number of occasions.
    The question asked on this thread was:

    Is one man's terrorist really another man's freedom fighter?

    I assume by your question you suspect - in the case of Netanyahu - he may see it that way.

  3. #3
    Council Member Dayuhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Latitude 17° 5' 11N, Longitude 120° 54' 24E, altitude 1499m. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    3,137

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JMA View Post
    The question asked on this thread was:

    Is one man's terrorist really another man's freedom fighter?
    Yes, exactly. It's often overlooked that if we're talking about "one man's" terrorist and "another man"s" freedom fighter we're talking about perceptions: what that one man perceives as a terrorist may be perceived by another as a freedom fighter. Whether those perceptions are objectively accurate or subjectively justifiable is of course a question open to debate, but it's a different question.

    Any given evaluation of whether ends justify means is often highly dependent on the extent to which the person doing the evaluating identifies with or approves of the ends under discussion.

    Quote Originally Posted by JMA View Post
    I assume by your question you suspect - in the case of Netanyahu - he may see it that way.
    Yes, I suspect that the assessment of who's a terrorist and who's a freedom fighter used by Mr Netanyahu - one man - may be quite opposite from that adopted by, say, Khaled Mashaal - another man. I'm not making any effort to assess whose definition is right or wrong or better or worse, just pointing out that "one man" and "another" may in fact assess that equation quite differently. Whether either assessment is objectively accurate or subjectively justifiable is another question altogether.
    Last edited by Dayuhan; 09-30-2012 at 10:14 PM.
    “The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary”

    H.L. Mencken

  4. #4
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    17

    Default

    Fuchs,

    Do you have a source for your "Freiheitskmpfer" thing? I've put together 99% of my argument and am about to post it here, and for some reason I enjoyed that little factoid, and I'd like to slip it into my introduction

    - Mac

  5. #5
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    17

    Default

    Gentleman, this is the piece I've just finished putting together. Still got a bit of editing and work to do, but it's 11pm and I've got the flu

    My sources are in brackets.

    I'm actually quite uncomfortable about how this turned out. I originally had a very rough and ready document which amounted to about 4,000 words, but I'm required to cut it down to 1,500 for this piece. I'm not sure I did the right thing in cutting out a lot of my case study (Chechnya) and some side points, because what I'm left with is pretty much just a re-hash of Ganor and Hughes' work, and that bothers me.

    Also, Fuchs, I included your little factoid, because I really liked it.

    As I said when I started this thread, I initially thought the difference between terrorism and freedom fighting was simply tactic vs strategy. This piece reflects that, but it's now being called means vs ends.

    I also decided that the whole terrorism vs freedom fighting thing was bollocks, and that they were apples and oranges. It should realistically be Terrorism vs Guerilla Warfare, both of which can take place under the wider umbrella of national liberation.

    Feel free to tear me to shreds (Or at least give it a try)

    - Mac

    (It's posted below, there is a character limit per post in this forum)

  6. #6
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    17

    Default

    Terrorism, Guerilla Warfare & Freedom Fighting

    An issue that has plagued the study of counter-terrorism for decades has been the cliché comparison “One man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter”. The comparison suggests that the difference between the two groups is the eye of the beholder.

    There are certainly elements of perspective that play into the debate. The words “terrorist” and “freedom fighter” are after all only words, and their meanings are still a matter of perspective and are reasonably difficult to fully capture. Indeed, the German term for freedom fighter, “Freiheitskämpfer” has a different meaning in the German language than it does in English.

    Despite the inherent ambiguity in defining terrorism, especially when compared to freedom fighting, there is a strong argument that the difference can be quantified, and that there are in fact very real differences between the two groups. Counter-terror experts have had some degree of success in defining both terrorism and freedom fighting, and even the original cliché can be dissected and criticized.

    There is no shortage of reasons why terrorism requires an internationally recognized definition of terrorism. In the modern world, terrorism is a globalized issue, and as such it must be dealt with on an international scale. If we are to develop and implement an international strategy, there must be agreement on what we are dealing with – a definition of terrorism. Until there is an internationally accepted definition of terrorism, operational results will be far and few between (Ganor).

    Developing a definition of terrorism will assist in multiple phases of dealing with terrorism. The first phase involved defining terrorism for the purposes of legislation and punishment. Legislation requires a definition to distinguish terrorism from ordinary crime. A definition is necessary for legislation designed to curb terrorism and assistance to terrorism, as well as setting sentences for terrorists or for confiscating their financial resources and supplies. The second phase involves international cooperation, where an internationally accepted definition of terrorism is required to ensure effective cooperation between states, as well as discouraging links between states and terrorist organizations. The third phase involves public relations and terrorism, where universal definitions of terrorism can not only undermine indigenous support for the terrorist organization, but also legitimizes offensive action taken against terrorists. Importantly, an internationally accepted definition of terrorism also creates a universal distinction between freedom fighters and terrorists, and allows for legitimate action taken by freedom fighters or guerillas in the name of national liberation. (Ganor)

    The use of the “terrorist” label is often applied as most suitable for meeting an individual or group’s political purposes, or for meeting individual’s personal preconceptions on the matter (Hughes). States can deny the political motivation of rebellious groups through the use of criminalizing terms such as “gangs”, “thugs” and “terrorists”, all of which undermines legitimate resistance. The leader of the communist resistance to the British in Malaya stated:
    When we worked with the British during the Japanese occupation and killed people—essentially in Britain’s interests—we were neither bandits nor terrorists. Indeed, we were applauded, praised and given awards. Thus, you only became a terrorist when you killed against their interests.” (Chin Peng)

    On a more personal level, there have been recent psychological studies that support the idea that terrorism is mostly cognitive in nature. Although political violence is a very real occurrence, terrorism itself as a concept is a social construction that occurs in the general population. When people apply labels, they are applying their own personal perceptions of those who partake in terrorism (Montiel). It was found that the “Terrorist” label implies an individual who is motivated by revenge and hatred, targets the innocent, refuses political negotiations and is considered the “evil villain”. (Kennedy). On the other hand, the “Freedom Fighter” label implies a person who stands passionately committed to national liberation; hits legitimate military targets only, and is often viewed as a hero or a martyr. (Harre)
    The problem with states using the definition of terrorism in a highly selective and politicized manner is that it undermines the credibility of the term “terrorist” (Hughes). This is why modern academic definitions of terrorism tend to analyze the means of violence, rather than the justifications for, as the factor in deciding whether or not the act is illegitimate. In a similar vein, modern academics agree that the immediate target of a terror attack is secondary, and is only a vehicle for communicating a threat to a primary target elsewhere.

    There have been multiple attempts by individuals, organisations and states to justify the means in terms of the end (Waltzer). The Arab League has previously argued that violent conflict in the name of “liberation and self-determination” cannot be terrorism, but violent conflict against existing regimes or monarchies will be considered criminal assaults. Syria has made equally ambiguous and insincere statements – it will not assist terrorist organisations, but openly supports “national liberation movements”. (Ganor) These attempts to justify the means in terms of the end emphasize not only the idea that states use the term “terrorist” as a political tool, but also the cliché that “one man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter”, and that terrorism hinges on the perspective and motivations of the one doing the defining. However, terrorism cannot be allowed to be a means towards national liberation. When a national liberation group chooses terrorism as it’s means, the aim of their struggle can no longer be used to justify the use of terrorism. (Ganor) (Netanyahu)

    It will be necessary to accept that the world is not entirely black and white. Although terrorism and freedom fighting are different things, a national liberation organisation can also participate in terrorism, and the concepts of terrorism and freedom fighting are not mutually contradictory. There will be cases where an organisation or movement will contain elements of both, and there is a certain area of uncertainty. So far, this uncertainty has not been properly addressed. Most definitions of terrorism fail to properly capture the dynamic nature of terrorism as an instrument and tool within the wider context of armed conflict and resistance. (Hughes)

    The inability for the international community to agree upon a definition of terrorism is posing a serious issue. One popular definition proposed by Boaz Ganor states “terrorism is the intentional use of, or threat to use violence against civilians or against civilian targets, in order to attain political aims”. This definition is based on three principle elements. The first is the essence of the action. Under Ganor’s definition, if the action does not involve violence or the threat of violence, it cannot be defined as terrorism. The second element is the requirement for the goal of the action to be political in nature. In the absence of a political aim, the action cannot be defined as terrorism. The third element is the targeting of civilians, emphasizing the deliberate rather than accidental targeting of civilians. This is what distinguishes terrorism from other forms of violent conflict.

    There are many different methods used by freedom fighters to accomplish their goals, with terrorism only being one of those methods. Under the wider category of non-conventional conflict, guerilla warfare is the legitimate counterpart of terrorism. I would suggest that as national liberation/freedom is an end rather than a means, that comparing terrorism to freedom fighting is a poor comparison to be making. The real comparison should be between terrorism and guerilla warfare – both means utilized by freedom fighters in pursuit of their goals. Guerilla warfare is described as “a prolonged war of attrition, with progressively increasing violence, blurred limits, a fluid line of contact, emphasizing the human factor. In the course of war, guerilla combatants become regular military forces until victory is attained and one side is defeated” (Harkabi). The definition by Laqueur focuses on the asymmetric nature of the conflict; “Guerilla warfare is a form of warfare by which the strategically weaker side assumes the tactical offensive in selected forms, times and places. Guerilla warfare is the weapon of the weak”. Even though terrorism and guerilla warfare are often strongly intermingled, their methods are distinctly different. Guerillas are noted to have the weaker side in an asymmetric conflict, usually with inferior numbers, ad-hoc weaponry and fewer strategic capabilities. However, they can and often do fight according to the laws of armed conflict, taking and exchanging prisoners, as well as respecting the rights of non-combatants. On the other side, terrorists place no limits on the means used, and tend to employ widespread assassination and the use of terror tactics upon the indigenous population. (Schmid, Jongman & Stohl)
    - Mac
    Last edited by McArthur; 10-02-2012 at 10:30 AM.

  7. #7
    Council Member Dayuhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Latitude 17° 5' 11N, Longitude 120° 54' 24E, altitude 1499m. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    3,137

    Default

    The whole idea of comparing a tactic to an objective still seems a bit to me like... apples and oranges doesn't quite cover it. Apples and baseballs, perhaps.

    I find it interesting, though in no way surprising, that states often adopt definitions of terrorism that exclude state terrorism. The eye of the beholder is a potent device.
    “The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary”

    H.L. Mencken

  8. #8
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    17

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dayuhan View Post
    The whole idea of comparing a tactic to an objective still seems a bit to me like... apples and oranges doesn't quite cover it. Apples and baseballs, perhaps.
    I hope I made it clear that this is exactly the stance I am trying to take...

    I am suggesting the national liberation is an objective, and both guerilla warfare and terrorism are methods of achieving that objective.

    - Mac

  9. #9
    Council Member jcustis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    SOCAL
    Posts
    2,152

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dayuhan View Post
    I wonder whether Mr Netanyahu would have considered the Irgun or the Stern Gang to be "freedom fighters" or "terrorists"... I seem to recall them blowing up non-combatants on a number of occasions.
    Yeah...the Independence narrative gets sketchy at times, but Jews did target a multi-use facility (King David Hotel) that contained a variety of civilians as well as military HQs. That the Irgun gave a warning of the pending bomb is immaterial.

    Jewish political leadership at that time did step back--publicly--from the attack, but the record is full of gray areas. The wiki entry on the bombing I've read before is interesting as it notes that at the 60th anniversary, a commemorative plaque of sorts was put up (with Netanyahu in attendance) that continued to try to put the blame on casualties with the British.

    The various "paramilitary" groups continued to use the full range of terrorist TTPs (bombing, arson, assassination) to advance their agenda, and they meet the definition for sure. I suppose Netanyahu would cede the notion that yes, they were terrorists, but he would muddy the definition by harping on the justification...attempting to blur the line in the process. In fact, I can recall him quoted as such before.

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 7
    Last Post: 02-04-2017, 12:09 PM
  2. Fiasco at the Army War College?
    By SWJED in forum Military - Other
    Replies: 73
    Last Post: 01-24-2009, 08:06 AM
  3. Freedom in the World 2009: Freedom Retreats for Third Year
    By Rex Brynen in forum International Politics
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 01-12-2009, 10:33 PM
  4. Replies: 9
    Last Post: 03-10-2008, 06:24 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •