Tony Blair and tackling radical Islam (merged thread)

[slapout9]

Curmudgy,
All politicians are dangerous because they want power over lots of people and once they get power all they ever seem to want is more power but whenever a politician changes his primary view to one that goes completely against his former views there just might be an awakening taking place and some small amount of truthfulness coming out.

After all President Reagan was a Democrat before he woke up.

[TheCurmudgeon]

Curmudgy,
All politicians are dangerous because they want power over lots of people and once they get power all they ever seem to want is more power but whenever a politician changes his primary view to one that goes completely against his former views there just might be an awakening taking place and some small amount of truthfulness coming out.

After all President Reagan was a Democrat before he woke up.

I don't believe Blair "saw the light of reason", I think he saw the opportunity for a headline and to rewrite his legacy.

"Radical" anything is generally bad. Radical Christians kill abortion doctors and homosexuals. He is not saying anything particularly helpful, only fueling an already existing belief that the problem is Islam.

... and to tie into our other conversation on COIN, part of the distrust of Islam is the result of the social/psychological dynamics of in-group/out/group identity. More sociology coming at yah ....

[Bob's World]

At the root of the crisis lies a radicalised and politicised view of Islam, an ideology that distorts and warps Islam’s true message.

Tony Blair

No, Mr. Blair, you are so focused on the sizzle that you can't see the steak.

At the root of instability in the region he describes are national systems of governance long used to governing in any way they see fit that are unable or unwilling to make the minor evolutionary adjustments of governance necessary to get into synch with newly empowered and rapidly evolving populations. That is the steak. The sizzle is those relative handful of advocates who are employing a radicalized version of Islam to motivate people to illegal political action to force those changes; and who are also willing to employ acts of terrorism to advance their organizaitonal causes.

Layered over this are systems of external foreign policies that directly affect the governance of the region as well; and those foreign systems have proven to be every bit as unwilling or unable to refine for the realities of the world we actually live in today.

It is easy to blame some small group of violent, illegal actors and the extreme message they employ - but this is about a failure of politics and policies in regard to the governance of the people writ large - not the extreme positions and actions of a few.

Tony was wrong when he was the PM, and he is still wrong today.

[carl]

Slap:

The importance of Mr. Blair's speech lies in the fact that a bone-fide member of the international elite is willing to say what is obvious and increasingly so, this is a matter of religion and we have to recognize that and take a side. As he said the religious part is a fight within Islam between the takfiri jihadist killers and the those Muslims who are willing to live and let live. The Muslims will primarily determine who wins that one but that is where our having to pick and take a side comes in. We can't determine which side will win but we can have some influence on the outcome, if we try. We will have no influence at all if we don't try and that is where the picking the side part comes in.

So good for Tony, and astute of Tony too. He anticipated the exact nature of the criticisms he would receive in his speech. The speech is an encouraging sign. If one prominent member of the international elite is able to see the sun in the sky there are probably others who are starting to notice the heat on their faces and that they are squinting a lot.

Who knows? Maybe they have been reading Zenpundit.

[Fuchs]

You seriously used the expression "bona fide" in the context of Tony Blair?
The man is a proved liar and warmonger.

[carl]

Yep, I do. He is a bone fide member of the international elite. He gets covered and he can raise money for things he wants to raise money for. And he will get into places and be able to talk to people that we will never ever see or talk to. Whether you like it or not, he gets into the right parties and we don't.

So that's why his speech is important.

[slapout9]

Yep, I do. He is a bone fide member of the international elite. He gets covered and he can raise money for things he wants to raise money for. And he will get into places and be able to talk to people that we will never ever see or talk to. Whether you like it or not, he gets into the right parties and we don't.

So that's why his speech is important.

carl,
Your are right to. He is a true 1%er and he is speaking out like he should instead of cowering to Radical Islam. What we need is a Anglo-American Spring to counter the Arabic spring Go Tony!