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Thread: Ukraine: Russo-Ukr War (June-December 2015)

  1. #2341
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    http://tass.ru/en/politics/821434

    Russian EU envoy: West and Russia involved in active information war


    September 16, 11:31 UTC+3

    BRUSSELS, September 16. /TASS/. Russia and the West are now engaged in the active phase of information war, and Moscow is winning, Russia’s envoy to the EU Vladimir Chizhov has told TASS in an interview.

    The diplomat said the fact that the success is on the Russian side raises fears in the West.

    "If we speak impartially, then the information war elements have been always present. And now taking into consideration the general political situation, of course, it is more active than earlier," Chizhov said.

    "For many years and decades, we were inferior in this battle both due to efficiency and the ability to use technical means. Now our information space has become much more attractive for the consumers of information in the West," the diplomat said.

    Russia’s journalists and media managers hold the credit for this, but there are also other objective reasons behind this process: the Western audience needs the alternative viewpoint, Chizhov said.

    "This demand creates a niche where our TV channels and news agencies are acting more and more successfully," he said.

    "I’m not saying that everything is ideal, there is still a long way to go, but the Russian mass media are acting more and more successfully. The fact that our opponents dislike this is rather natural," Chizhov added.

    The EU has no consensus on the prospective response to Russia’s information warfare, Chizhov said. The Baltic states have already asked for money to finance the Russian-language TV channel.

    "In this context, Finland, their closest neighbor which used to be a sponsor not so long ago, said: "You should have thought before closing the Russian-language mass media outlets."

    Finland has a Russian-language TV channel and six radio stations, he said.

    The EU has announced that a team of specialists would start working in September to "counter misinterpretation of information on the EU policy" in the Russian-language media space.

    The target audience is the Eastern Partnership countries - Armenia, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Georgia, Moldova and Ukraine. The European Parliament calls this body a counter-propaganda group.

  2. #2342
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    http://khpg.org/index.php?id=1442437137

    Russia holds western separatist congress while imprisoning Russian ‘separatists’

    16.09.15 | Halya Coynash

    Russia’s endorsement of “the right of nations to self-determination” begins beyond its borders, including those that it has arbitrarily redrawn. A congress of separatists from around the world is due to take place in Moscow on Sept 20, with participants’ travel costs paid for by the Anti-Globalization Movement of Russia whose only disclosed income is from a Kremlin-patronized fund. The news comes in a week that has seen Tatar leader Rafis Kashalov imprisoned for supposed ‘calls to separatism’ and Darya Polyudova standing trial on similar charges. In both cases the charges pertain to criticism of the regime and of Russia’s occupation of Ukrainian Crimea and war in Donbas.

    RBC.ru has drawn attention to the planned congress of separatists from other countries, the second international congress organized by the Anti-Globalization Movement. The stated aim of the event is to create “an international working group coordinating the actions of independence fighters from around the world”. The invitation states that in the clash between two fundamental tenets of international law – the inviolability of state borders and the right of nations to self-determination, the members of the congress support the latter.

    According to the organizers, such a congress is taking place for the first time at a time when issues pertaining to the gaining of independence by small ethnic groups and territories are ever more immediate. Anti-Globalization Movement leader Alexander Ionov refused to give RBC details about the participants expected on Sept 20. He claimed this was for security reasons and that western countries might try to stop delegates leaving for Moscow. The movement’s website mentions various ethnic groups and territories, including the Texas Nationalist Movement, a secessionist organization sporting their own ‘republic’; the Uhuru Movement, described by Wikipedia as a radical political organization centred on the principles of Pan-Africanism; the Irish Sinn Fein which began as the political wing of the Irish Republican Army or IRA, and others. Not one ethnic group or territory within the Russian Federation is mentioned, despite the latter having 185 different ethnic groups including those, for example, in Chechnya who are demanding full independence. Last year many delegates from indigenous groups in Russia were prevented or obstructed when they tried to attend the UN Conference on Indigenous Peoples. Russia also put pressure on the organizers to stop them inviting Crimean Tatar leaders Mustafa Dzhemiliev and Refat Chubarov whom Russia banned from their homeland shortly after annexing Crimea.

    Friends in high places

    Two ‘honourable’ members of the Anti-Globalization Movement are named, with their photographs given: Syria’s highly-controversial but Russian-supported President Bashar Hafez al-Assad and Iran’s and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, the no less contentious Iranian President until 2012.

    RBC reports that the Movement has been registered as a regional NGO since March 15, 2012. Its head Alexander Ionov is also a member of the presidium of ‘Officers of Russia’. That is headed by Anton Tsvetkov, head of the security commission of Russia’s Civic Chamber, and includes Josef Kobzon, the singer under international sanctions for his active support for Russia’s annexation of Crimea and aggression against Ukraine.

    This ‘regional NGO’, it transpires, is willing to pay participants’ travel and accommodation costs. Ionov told the journalists that their funding comes from donations and from government grants, and that these are supposedly sufficient to cover at least one international conference a year (this is, in fact, the second).

    RBC could find no information about the government grants in the relevant databases. The NGO does, however, regularly take part in the ‘National Charitable Fund’ competition, and has twice received grants – last year for 1 million roubles; this year for 2 million (as of Sept 16, both grants would come to around 45 thousand USD).

    RBC explains that the National Charitable Fund was created at the end of 1999 at the initiative of Vladimir Putin (then Prime Minister). Its stated aim is to provide funds supporting military servicemen and the development of military-patriotic projects. It has various sponsors and is under President Putin’s patronage.

    RBC points out that the cost of renting a hall in the President Hotel is 45 thousand roubles on a Saturday or Sunday. The final press conference will be held on Monday, Sept 21 at a venue where halls cost between 20 and 30 thousand roubles for 1-4 hours. The return flights for participants coming from the USA, Latin America and European countries will also not be cheap.

    The previous conference under an anti-war banner was held in December 2014. The nature of the event, and the shared view as to villains and heroes can best be gauged from the report by Joe Lombardo, one of five participant members of the United National Antiwar Coalition [UNAC]. As well as their own presentations, they heard addresses from “a number of leaders from Novorossia (the area declared independent by the people of Eastern Ukraine), including Oleg Tsarev, the speaker of the Parliament of Novorossia and Alexander Kofman, the Minister of Foreign Affairs of the Donetsk People’s Republic.”

    Lombardo explains how that spoke at length to “one of the fighters for the defence forces in Donetsk”, who is not named. This person told him that he had originally been a Euromaidan protester, but that “it became clear to him that neo-Nazis were playing a leadership role and were fomenting anti-Russian sentiment. He eventually left Kiev and joined the defence forces in the East.”

    The Declaration produced condemns “the crimes and murders perpetrated against the people of Novorossia” and “strongly condemns political repression, particularly in countries that have positioned themselves as democratic nations.” It asserts that “events in Yugoslavia, Iraq, Libya, Syria and Ukraine demonstrate the predatory foreign policy of the US and its NATO allies” and speaks of the US government’s “depressing statistics in the field of human rights.”

    The ‘depressing statistics’ reported by all international human rights NGOs, as well as by the Russian Memorial Human Rights Centre regarding human rights violations in Russia were not mentioned.

    It can be assumed that the defenders of self-determination on Sept 20 will also find nothing to say about the trial of Tatar leader Rafis Kashalov and the 3-year sentence passed on Sept 14. Kashalov was found guilty of ‘hate speech’ and ‘calls to separatism’ over critical comments on his social network page about Putin and Russia’s invasion and annexation of Crimea (all posts can be assessed here). They will doubtless also ignore the trial which has just begun of Kuban activist Darya Polyudova, who is also charged with having made ‘calls to separatism’ on April 4, 2014. According to the prosecutor, “acting out of hatred for the political regime in the Russian Federation”, and intending to carry out public appeals to carry out extremist activities, she held a single-person picket with a placard which she then posted on the Internet. It read: “Not war against Ukraine, but revolution in Russia! Not war, but revolution!”

    Polyudova is one of three Krasnodar residents who tried to hold a peaceful march in support of ‘federalization for Kuban’ in September last year. She spent a considerable amount of time in detention, and the other two fled to Ukraine, expecting similar treatment. All have been placed on Russia’s Federal List of Terrorists and Extremists.

    Russia’s demand for Ukraine’s federalization, or at least ‘decentralization’, has been in stark contrast to its treatment of those in Siberia and Kuban who tried to hold marches only in favour of greater autonomy. Polyudova could pay for this with a period of up to 5 years imprisonment, others have ended up in exile.

    None of this is new. In Soviet times, there were plenty of communists who would be put up in good Intourist hotels and could be relied upon to slam oppression and discrimination in the USA, while finding everything in the Soviet Union exemplary. The former KGB agent now in the Kremlin and patron of the National Charitable Fund surely remembers that period well. He and his cronies, as well as the militants the Kremlin is funding and controlling in eastern Ukraine, have long shed the ideological coating, but use exactly the same techniques. Depressingly they still find takers.

  3. #2343
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    More proof Russian leadership is all over the map without a clear concept since most of their attempts to get back to business as ususal is not working………..
    Russian Embassy, UK ✔ @RussianEmbassy
    Rus EU envoy: Business as usual between Russia and EU now impossible and undesirable. pic.twitter.com/zEIiXHpf0Q

    Great article on huge gas field find off #Egypt coast. #Italy - #Russia relationship cooling
    http://www.jamestown.org/single/?tx_...d#.VfpQYN-qpBc

    “As Putin plays for time, time is also working against him, especially on the economic front,” says Kennan's Pomeranz http://j.mp/1VYhiJV

    The newest russian "aidconvoy" is on its way to #Donbas, over 100 trucks. https://twitter.com/unian/status/644375683024732160

  4. #2344
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    Further evidence that US politicians have no earthly idea about foreign policy and this includes the current WH.

    On the topic of #Russia: "Number one, they have to respect you," #Trump says. "I would talk to him. (Putin) I would get along with him."

    Yuri Bezmenov: Psychological Warfare Subversion & Control of Western Society https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gnpCqsXE8g

    Russian Prosecutors Claim Terrorism in Dagestan Is Increasing, Governor Says It Is Declining
    http://www.jamestown.org/single/?tx_...be4eac715bf929

  5. #2345
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    It is interesting that three journalists from the BBC where placed on a sanctions list by the Ukrainian State Security Service—AND the entire journalist world was up in arms –it has to be a bad mistake—

    THEN it was revealed that all three where able to travel into and out of the Russian occupied zones via Russia SOMETHING that BBC seems to have overlooked.


    SO from the point of view of the Ukrainians they entered the Ukraine illegally end of story. Noticed the rants by the global journalists has gone silent when they learned about the illegal entries.

    Freedom of speech doesn't give me the right to slander someone, but some journalists think freedom of press gives them the right to do it.

    I question the motives of journos who rage over Freedom of Press bc of UA ban, but they said nothing when Ukr POWs were interrogated on Utube!

    What I understand journs ban has nothing to do with media: either they travel to Crimea from Moscow or 're taken for observers.Stupid mistake

    Not a single Western journalist reports or complains about crimes committed by Russian government https://twitter.com/halyapuff/status/644451092240142336
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 09-17-2015 at 11:46 AM.

  6. #2346
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    NOW does everyone fully see the West has lost the informational war??

    EU's effort to fight Kremlin propaganda is hindered by lack of funding and support http://www.politico.eu/article/eu-ru...kremlin-media/ … pic.twitter.com/9O4ra0ePej

  7. #2347
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    Tactical Tech ✔ @Info_Activism
    Seven years of malware linked to Russian state-backed cyberespionage
    http://arstechnica.com/security/2015...yberespionage/ … pic.twitter.com/MD9cZeXiqE

    Russian strategy: temporarily calm E #Ukraine to avoid West arming Ukr in retaliation for #Syria buildup?

    Russian FM totally surprised by the rollover of EU sanctions—lashes out—BUT where are they to find new markets when even the Chinese market disappeared on them????

    RussianMissionEU @RusMission_EU
    Deputy FM #Meshkov to @rianru: "If sanctions hysteria continues, Russia will have to shift its foreign economic relations to other regions"

    More Russian disinformation and or outright lies----
    Kremlin's sabotage of Polish-Ukrainian relations
    http://english.pravda.ru/news/world/...ry=/y5BdTlltTW

  8. #2348
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    Am seeing lately more video footage coming out of the 2014 Maidan period--video depicts brutality.


    Just-released video of Berkut massacring @5channel reporter and cameraman during Maidan. Very brutal https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjmPdoTGZoU

  9. #2349
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    From the world of Russian altered state of reality:

    Russian Propagandist "Montenegro´s accession to NATO is a crime towards Russia"
    https://twitter.com/edvlimonov/statu...43423152410625

    Begs the question ---crime against what......??????

  10. #2350
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    Russia is attempting to pull off the soft annexation of eastern Ukraine while all are looking at Syria----

    Plotnitsky said that the occupied part of the #Luhansk region begins integration with Russia
    http://novosti.dn.ua/details/259800/

    THIS is a clear, concise and deliberate violation of Minsk 2 by Russia--Putin feels he can get away with it as the Us and Europe are busy now in Syria and having a refugee problems cause by him.

    Preliminary elections" held in russian occupied #Makiivka http://novosti.dn.ua/details/259797/
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 09-17-2015 at 11:57 AM.

  11. #2351
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    Really unusual news about Putin and Finland. How does he own property in Finland if Russian President???????

    Russia complains over 'gay bar' on president's plot in Finland http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...t-plot-finland … pic.twitter.com/Xh0XgCQhgf

  12. #2352
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    I had mentioned countless times during the early days of the Russian annexation of Crimea that Russia was in full violation of the INF--AS well as the OSCE agreements to destroy Russian armored vehicles.


    http://www.rferl.mobi/a/27250064.html

    Impasse Over U.S.-Russia Nuclear Treaty Hardens As Washington Threatens 'Countermeasures'

    WASHINGTON -- Russia risks provoking "military and economic countermeasures" if it continues to stonewall over a U.S. accusation that it violated a bedrock of nuclear arms control, the United States' lead arms-control negotiator says.

    The comments by Rose Gottemoeller, undersecretary of state for arms control and international security, highlight the seriousness that the U.S. administration has attached to the alleged violations of the 1987 Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces (INF) Treaty. Last year Washington formally accused Moscow of being "in violation of its obligations."

    Gottemoeller told RFE/RL in an interview that Russia had been engaged in a "fishing expedition" to learn "what precisely we know and how we obtained that information" instead of trying to resolve the dispute.

    "We don't make determinations on arms-control violations lightly," Gottemoeller said. "So I want to make clear that this violation is not a technicality or a mistake as some have suggested. We are talking about a missile that has been flight-tested as a ground-launched cruise-missile system to these ranges that are banned under this treaty."

    Russia has denied the accusation, and in turn said Washington was at fault for missile-defense projects in Eastern Europe.

    NOTE: This is a typical Russian response in order to flip the arguments and turn them away from the original discussion--typical Russian Orwellian doublespeak--when it is used then you know Russia is avoiding, lying or distorting--they are doing so often they do not even realize even social media sees through it..

    The INF treaty, the first to outlaw an entire category of already-deployed weaponry and allow for physical on-site inspections, is considered by many historians as a pivotal event in European security and arguably the life of the Soviet Union.

    Its fraying comes with relations between Russia and the West at post-Cold War lows, marked by tensions over Moscow's forcible annexation of Crimea and other actions in Ukraine and U.S. concern at apparent efforts by Russia to strengthen its foothold in Syria. Russia has also raised the profile of its military activities in and around Europe, while the United States has announced the deployment of advanced fighter jets and heavy weaponry to Central and Eastern Europe.

    No Will To Confront Moscow?

    Like many agreements, the INF treaty spells out a dispute-resolution procedure, called the Special Verification Commission (SVC).

    But since Washington first formally leveled its accusations, there has been no meeting of the commission; the last time it convened was October 2003. More perplexing, or even worrisome in the eyes of many experts, some with long government experience, is that there has been no effort to convene it.

    "The United States isn't making a huge issue about it because it doesn't know what to do about it," says James Acton, a physicist and head of the Nuclear Policy Program at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace.

    "The willingness to go toe to toe with the Russians seems like something the White House doesn't want to do," says Thomas Karako, a former staff member of the U.S. House Armed Services Committee, now with the Center for Strategic and International Studies. "Russians don't think we're serious. They think they're going to get away with it."

    Long-Running Concerns

    The way the U.S. administration sees it, there is little doubt about the facts.

    "Despite providing the Russian government with extensive points on these matters, it's more than enough information in our view for the Russian government to pinpoint the missile system of concern," Gottemoeller said. "The Russian Federation repeatedly asks for additional information. In our view, they're seeking to find out what precisely we know and how we obtained that information. It's a fishing expedition."

    The 1987 agreement, signed by Ronald Reagan and Mikhail Gorbachev, eliminated an entire class of missiles: nearly 2,700 intermediate-range ballistic and cruise missiles, the majority of them Russian. It also was the first to allow for intrusive on-site inspections.

    The deal did not concern sea- or air-launched intermediate-range missiles.

    According to two arms control experts, U.S. intelligence began detecting what the administration says were indications of treaty violations as far as back as 2010, and possibly earlier, and began raising the issue with Moscow in 2013, quietly, but at high levels.

    U.S. officials also began briefing some European allies, though it was the annual U.S. compliance report published in July 2014 that set off alarm bells in many European capitals.
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 09-17-2015 at 12:16 PM.

  13. #2353
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    Soviet colonel #Russia Stanislav Petrov saved world fr Nuclear War https://www.yahoo.com/movies/s/russi...062250867.html … & #Putin wants to start it pic.twitter.com/8m08Yt4azM

  14. #2354
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    OSCE ODIHR-HCNM report identifies widespread human rights violations in Crimea since its occupation and annex by Rus

    http://www.osce.org/odihr/182526

  15. #2355
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    ATO spox: SBU officers detained colonel, officer of Military counter-Intelligence, for bribery

    Col. Motuzyanyk: Two flights of enemy UAVs were recorded within the military operation area near Mariupol

    ATO spox: Yesterday, 3 hostile armed provocations with use of small arms took place near Kriakivka & Sanzharivka villages

    Col. Motuzyanyk: Ukrainian Armed Forces did not incur any casualties; no single UA serviceman was wounded in action in last 24 hours

    Tymchuk: The so-called ("DPR") Motorized Infantry Brigade "1 AK" deployed in Horlivka, was reinforced by 120 people
    https://m.facebook.com/dmitry.tymchu...ed_medium&_rdr

  16. #2356
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    Quote Originally Posted by OUTLAW 09 View Post
    It is interesting that three journalists from the BBC where placed on a sanctions list by the Ukrainian State Security Service—AND the entire journalist world was up in arms –it has to be a bad mistake—

    THEN it was revealed that all three where able to travel into and out of the Russian occupied zones via Russia SOMETHING that BBC seems to have overlooked.


    SO from the point of view of the Ukrainians they entered the Ukraine illegally end of story. Noticed the rants by the global journalists has gone silent when they learned about the illegal entries.

    Freedom of speech doesn't give me the right to slander someone, but some journalists think freedom of press gives them the right to do it.

    I question the motives of journos who rage over Freedom of Press bc of UA ban, but they said nothing when Ukr POWs were interrogated on Utube!

    What I understand journs ban has nothing to do with media: either they travel to Crimea from Moscow or 're taken for observers.Stupid mistake

    Not a single Western journalist reports or complains about crimes committed by Russian government https://twitter.com/halyapuff/status/644451092240142336
    BBC journalists removed from sanctions list BUT social media brings up a great point----

    UK journos live in Moscow sin 1991? What "neutral" can they report about Ukraine fr Moscow? Let BBC base in Kyiv.

  17. #2357
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    Russian FM states that Poland has declared war on Russian monuments--

    Ru MinDef summoned military attachs of Poland on demolition of the monument to Chernyahovsky http://liveuamap.com/en/2015/17-sept...9999995&zoom=8 via @RT_russian

    Since when does a war monument become Russian territory?

    Russian Foreign Ministry marks the day of Soviet invasion into Poland by accusing Poland of starting a war on Soviet monuments
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 09-17-2015 at 01:45 PM.

  18. #2358
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    Border Guard Service: 2 enemy drone flights were recorded yesterday near Mariupol.
    http://dpsu.gov.ua/ua/about/news/news_8643.htm

    Militants Do Not Pull Back Heavy Weapons – #OSCE
    http://ukraineunderattack.org/en/352...pons-osce.html … pic.twitter.com/Qj6X1DLQ85

    More Russian FM altered state of reality---the Ukrainian sanctions has nothing absolutely nothing to do with Minsk 2 and everything to do with Russian annexation of Crimea and Russian invasion of eastern Ukraine.

    Russian MFA: Kyiv Sanctions undermine Minsk agreements http://liveuamap.com/en/2015/17-sept...nsk-agreements … #Ukraine pic.twitter.com/fmgXDS6HWE via @RT_russian

  19. #2359
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    Why Russia keeps trying to score points on this topic is beyond me as they fully have the Ukrainian answer as to why they do not talk to the Russian supported occupation mercenaries---they were never legally elected under Ukrainian law as simple as that.

    But Russia still tries to earn propaganda points----

    Russian MFA: Kyiv refuses to do dialogue with Donbas http://liveuamap.com/en/2015/17-sept...-dialogue-with

  20. #2360
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    Russian TASS article yesterday claimed Russia is winning the information war with the West and with a 700M USD a year budget one would think so.

    BUT then this today--faking the numbers??????

    Question More?
    Leaked docs purport to show that RussiaToday hugely exaggerates its viewership

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...t-ratings.html … pic.twitter.com/Ia4rVUBCY0

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