Syria in 2016: an exchange on what to do

[OUTLAW 09]

mwe12...now that you have a clean and concise definition of "genocide and complicit"....

Genocide.........???

AND what about that so called Obama "red line" in the use of chemical attacks?

Video...
Footage
#Assad used GAS vs. rebels in Muadamiyat during the #GenevaPeaceTalks yesterday
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1T4AWKtoHU …
Barrel bombs used and barrel bombs loaded with chlorine......were used as a mix.

78 killed and over 100 injured....ALL civilians...not a single fighter among the group...BTW...

AND that is not "genocide" by international law?

[mwe12]

Barrel bombs used and barrel bombs loaded with chlorine......were used as a mix.

Nice to see Pallywood at work.

AND that is not "genocide" by international law?

Nope.

AND when IS attacks anti Assad forces the Russian fly CAS for them...care to explain that??? OR when anti Assad forces attack IS the Russians also fly CAS for them........wonder why

They are not flying CAS for ISIS. Russia is killing both ISIS and JAN/FSA/IF. Dropping bombs on one side or the other when they are fighting each other is totally above board. The trash taking itself out.

Let's see all US led air s rikes are cleanly and clearly targeting IS.

And Russia is clubbing all the anti-Assad groups with cluster bombs and 1000lb bombs, interesting division of labor. Nothing saying in the law saying that you have to use guided weapons. Rather cheaper from an accounting standpoint to level the building where terrorists are meeting with 1000lb bombs and ballistic missiles than to be all that worried over the fate of the person making coffee for them.

Let's see...right now by bellingcat 97% of those 14,000 sorties have been not against IS BUT against anyone who fights against Assad....

And the SOHR, another anti-regime source, puts it at 965 ISIS and 1233 non-ISIS terrorists, even if you assume all the alleged civilians were with JAN/IF/FSA/whoever that's still not 97%. It does sound better I guess if one is crying over poor-AQ to say Russia is picking on them and the Muslim Brotherhood.

The US led effort has killed a confirmed 25,000 and the number of civilians killed as "collateral damage" is far far far far far less that the current Russian killed rate of say 1400 on the low end. AND the US is punishing SOF members for accidently targeting a hospital...97 have been hit by Russia in over 100 days and no one is punished......

Different equipment, different doctrine on usage of heavy weapons in urban areas and different public back home. Just so happens in this case the terrorists are dealing with a nation which is prepared to flatten houses they are meeting in, regardless of the risk to people serving dinner.

SO if the US President physically "knows all of this" and if you deny he does not then the US is in serious trouble......if he knows all of this AND yet undertakes nothing......absolutely nothing......no public statements, nor interviews on the subject, no international press conference, no UNSC demanded meetings on the subject, no direct phone calls to Putin other than the lame Kerry "asking" pretty please for Russian FM Lavrov to end the bombings.....

The US has expressed alarm.

Thankfully we as a nation are not required to do more, nor do the voters wish to ride to the aid of a band heavily made up of the same types of terrorists we lost civil liberties over. Wasn't public support when Assad allegedly used chemical weapons and sure isn't now with a Russian air group blasting terrorists.

WHEN legally he falls under the 1948 Convention for "complicity" and is liable for war crimes....even if he does nothing...

Nope. Our leadership would be fine legally if they star around eating ice cream and watched the VKS airstrikes and made explosion noises while watching the impact.

mwe12... my friend and what is occurring in Syria "ain't genocide...get real my friend".....

It's a civil war, where one side holds up among the civilian population and the other doesn't mind the bad press in getting at the rebels and their infrastructure, then throw in one-off massacres by both sides and this is not a genocide by any stretch. This isn't Rwanda or Nazi Germany. The term genocide gets so wildly overused it runs the risk of losing any meaning.

Trolling is easy, critic is easy, cut and paste is easy...... being an American outside the US is great as it gives you a total different look on life other than the Trump view........

I'll keep my American view on stuff thank you. You should probably come back and talk to some actual Americans, you are out of step with the public on everything from supporting AQ to wanting America to put Islamists into power. As I said, enjoy being on the losing side.

So again if we revisit say JaN that you place in the same grouping as IS/AQ and want they all killed.....just as Putin/Assad does.....

JAN is in that grouping.

UP TO TODAY 1 Feb 2016 JaN has not killed a single American and has no US "blood on their hands".

They are part of AQ. That's quite enough. Outed yourself for supporting a group which murdered three-thousand Americans.

It's a shame and a disservice to the victims that we are not blasting those "crazy JAN kids" and their allies to bits.

If you check your profile and comments..and compare it to his profile and comments..no basic difference is there....??

Thanks but no thanks.

AND yes I am getting monetized by the thousands of Euros....and just what does Russia pay you BTW??

- explains a lot.

BTW there I fly easily to the US...why I have proven my "loyalty" to the US more times than you have had birthdays......and that my friend sits deep in the computers....getting the computers to change that fact...very hard.

In the future tell the customs people or airplane passengers how great of guys JAN are. Bottom line it's past a fringe position.

Years of basically one-sided propaganda, which is still ongoing, about how great of guys these terrorist are (even the idiotic cat story) and covering up for their AQ links, and still the public doesn't want to help the take power or even take in economic migrants. Really a remarkable case of the intended beneficiary of the propaganda being so rotten that AJ and the MSM couldn't cover it from the public.

[OUTLAW 09]

Nice to see Pallywood at work.



Nope.



They are not flying CAS for ISIS. Russia is killing both ISIS and JAN/FSA/IF. Dropping bombs on one side or the other when they are fighting each other is totally above board. The trash taking itself out.



And Russia is clubbing all the anti-Assad groups with cluster bombs and 1000lb bombs, interesting division of labor. Nothing saying in the law saying that you have to use guided weapons. Rather cheaper from an accounting standpoint to level the building where terrorists are meeting with 1000lb bombs and ballistic missiles than to be all that worried over the fate of the person making coffee for them.



And the SOHR, another anti-regime source, puts it at 965 ISIS and 1233 non-ISIS terrorists, even if you assume all the alleged civilians were with JAN/IF/FSA/whoever that's still not 97%. It does sound better I guess if one is crying over poor-AQ to say Russia is picking on them and the Muslim Brotherhood.



Different equipment, different doctrine on usage of heavy weapons in urban areas and different public back home. Just so happens in this case the terrorists are dealing with a nation which is prepared to flatten houses they are meeting in, regardless of the risk to people serving dinner.



The US has expressed alarm.

Thankfully we as a nation are not required to do more, nor do the voters wish to ride to the aid of a band heavily made up of the same types of terrorists we lost civil liberties over. Wasn't public support when Assad allegedly used chemical weapons and sure isn't now with a Russian air group blasting terrorists.



Nope. Our leadership would be fine legally if they star around eating ice cream and watched the VKS airstrikes and made explosion noises while watching the impact.



It's a civil war, where one side holds up among the civilian population and the other doesn't mind the bad press in getting at the rebels and their infrastructure, then throw in one-off massacres by both sides and this is not a genocide by any stretch. This isn't Rwanda or Nazi Germany. The term genocide gets so wildly overused it runs the risk of losing any meaning.



I'll keep my American view on stuff thank you. You should probably come back and talk to some actual Americans, you are out of step with the public on everything from supporting AQ to wanting America to put Islamists into power. As I said, enjoy being on the losing side.



JAN is in that grouping.



They are part of AQ. That's quite enough. Outed yourself for supporting a group which murdered three-thousand Americans.

It's a shame and a disservice to the victims that we are not blasting those "crazy JAN kids" and their allies to bits.



Thanks but no thanks.



- explains a lot.



In the future tell the customs people or airplane passengers how great of guys JAN are. Bottom line it's past a fringe position.

Years of basically one-sided propaganda, which is still ongoing, about how great of guys these terrorist are (even the idiotic cat story) and covering up for their AQ links, and still the public doesn't want to help the take power or even take in economic migrants. Really a remarkable case of the intended beneficiary of the propaganda being so rotten that AJ and the MSM couldn't cover it from the public.

mwe12.....you and 9/11...blinds you...nothing but cut and paste but true knowledge of the world around you is distinctly missing......reflects you never have physically participated in the so called war on terror......and or in the two wars that never needed to be fought that cost you and me 5T USDs and over 7K KIAs and ten of thousands wounded.

cut and paste, cut and paste.....nothing more nothing less.....waste of time to continue.

again trolling nothing else outside of platitudes.....

especially the following which actually reflects your true narrative.......

I'll keep my American view on stuff thank you. You should probably come back and talk to some actual Americans, you are out of step with the public on everything from supporting AQ to wanting America to put Islamists into power. As I said, enjoy being on the losing side.

some actual Americans.....when you have fought for the US in three of the last four wars and trained 44 BCT staffs many of them going to AFG the fourth war and when you have served the IC in multiple different places of this world in the name of the US and when you have been wounded defending the US...then my friend you can talk about who and or is not "American"

platitudes do not replace knowledge and experience and you are missing both.

that you do not see that is interesting to say the least.

last comment here as it is a waste of my time......as you absolutely know nothing of the ME......

[OUTLAW 09]

mwe12...here is your largest deficit in this conversation and thus you are simply trolling.

When you can in detail explain to me in naturally more than one sentence what is a secular Muslim, what is a Salafist, and more importantly what is a Takfirist...and more importantly where do they touch each other and how do they cross over each other...BTW using theKoran and then what is their respective views on the Sunni form of government for each of them.

Then taking that approach apply it to the current Syrian Sunni environment ...especially the JaN side of the house which yesterday was approached by the opposition and suggested they abandon AQ.

Then and only then can you actually get into a conversation...anything else is platitudes and trolling....

Here is your second problem...you were born way past the era of this statement...."one mans' terrorist is another man's freedom fighter......" THEN apply that to the three Islamic religious directions.

Once you work your way through that then we can turn to Shiaism and their "Islamic Revolutionary" theology.

BUT more important is the reading of say at least three critical studies on Syria and the geo political importance for the entire ME.

[OUTLAW 09]

mwe12...think about this statement as it pertains to your comments.....

"Religious radicals come in all shapes, colors and sizes these days and they all "claim God"........."

I just heard Ted Cruz's first words on his Iowa caucus win: "To God goes the glory."
That's Republican mwe12 for "Allahu Akbar!"

BTW if you had been paying attention ......all three of the great religions build on each other and take from each other......so are Ted Cruz Republicans "closet Islamists".....maybe......

[Windows97]

When you can in detail explain to me in naturally more than one sentence what is a secular Muslim, what is a Salafist, and more importantly what is a Takfirist...and more importantly where do they touch each other and how do they cross over each other...BTW using theKoran and then what is their respective views on the Sunni form of government for each of them.

Then taking that approach apply it to the current Syrian Sunni environment ...especially the JaN side of the house which yesterday was approached by the opposition and suggested they abandon AQ.

So if the Nazis turned around and said "hey, you know what, the SS is a different organisation! Nothing to do with us!" You would accept their argument? What unites all the organisations you mention? Hair splitting over the minor tactical or political strands of their respective legitimating ideologies ignores the common wellspring.

Here is your second problem...you were born way past the era of this statement...."one mans' terrorist is another man's freedom fighter......" THEN apply that to the three Islamic religious directions.

What do you mean here? What do you mean by the three Islamic directions?

Once you work your way through that then we can turn to Shiaism and their "Islamic Revolutionary" theology..

Islam as a whole is best described as a revolutionary theology. Ithna ashari shia'ism of the official Iranian variety is the only one that adheres to a syncretistic fusion of third world liberation theology+marxism and traditional Shi'a narrative themes (thanks largely to Talk Shariati and Jala Ali-Ahmad). Ithna ashari Shi'a in Iraq (especially Najaf) do not traditionally follow the official discourse of Qom (I.e., the doctrine of Velayat-e-faqih, which many outside Iran actually consider a dangerous innovation) unless it is politically expedient. The other branch's of shi'ism such as the zaydi wouldn't even call themselves associates of the ithna ashari. So, again what the hell are you talking about?

When you stick to fact instead of hashtag ramblings you make sense. When you start ranting it looks like you've drunk the koolaid bub. Maybe try decaffeinated? Or camomile tea.

[OUTLAW 09]

mwindows97 suddenly appears after registering in 2015 and 4 posts.....after mihond and mwe12 we seem to have three trolls in the SWJ database, anticipated actually more.

windows97..now that you have impressed me with you somewhat not so correct fro text book copied shia comments...try finally answering the comment what is the difference between secular, salafst and takfiri Sunni's...

and when you finish that explain to us the shia revolutionary islam of 1979 and the green crescent of 1979.

then let's discuss the recent 1979 revival of shiaism......meaning their definition of government vs the sunni definition of government

btw windows97 you also cut and past as does mwe12 so probably the same commenter just two different logons.......

[OUTLAW 09]

mwindows97 suddenly appears after registering in 2015 and 4 posts.....after mihond and mwe12 we seem to have three trolls in the SWJ database, anticipated actually more.

windows97..now that you have impressed me with you somewhat not so correct fro text book copied shia comments...try finally answering the comment what is the difference between secular, salafst and takfiri Sunni's...

and when you finish that explain to us the shia revolutionary islam of 1979 and the green crescent of 1979.

then let's discuss the recent 1979 revival of shiaism......meaning their definition of government vs the sunni definition of government

btw windows97 you also cut and past as does mwe12 so probably the same commenter just two different logons.......

windows97 you seem to as did mwe12 and mirhond...you seem to ignore direct questions another indicator of a troll.

[mwe12]

some actual Americans.....when you have fought for the US in three of the last four wars and trained 44 BCT staffs many of them going to AFG the fourth war and when you have served the IC in multiple different places of this world in the name of the US and when you have been wounded defending the US...then my friend you can talk about who and or is not "American"

None of that changes the fact that JAN is a part of AQ. Sorry bro whatever life experience you claim to have doesn't transform AQ and their allies into a bunch of good guys. Serious you spend hours a day on the internet railing about how that coward Obama needs to save a bunch of terrorists from evil Putin.

When you support JAN as being a bunch of sometimes crazy kids, congratulations you are on the permanent fringe. Cutting past all the high minded rants about civilians; you think JAN are a bunch of swell guys that America needs to help out.

mwe12.....you and 9/11...blinds you...nothing but cut and paste but true knowledge of the world around you is distinctly missing......reflects you never have physically participated in the so called war on terror......and or in the two wars that never needed to be fought that cost you and me 5T USDs and over 7K KIAs and ten of thousands wounded.

A deflection for the fact that you support JAN and other Islamist terrorist groups.

Well I guess if Pakistan can have "good" and "bad" Taliban you can have "good" and "not as good" members of AQ.

When you can in detail explain to me in naturally more than one sentence what is a secular Muslim, what is a Salafist, and more importantly what is a Takfirist...and more importantly where do they touch each other and how do they cross over each other...BTW using theKoran and then what is their respective views on the Sunni form of government for each of them.

On my way to the office please just post your stock explanation with randomly capitalized and bolded words explaining why the MB are really a bunch of great guys.

I just heard Ted Cruz's first words on his Iowa caucus win: "To God goes the glory."

And when he crashes airplanes into buildings and slits the throats of people of different religions solely because of their faith then you might start to explain to me that he is a great guy.

Then taking that approach apply it to the current Syrian Sunni environment ...especially the JaN side of the house which yesterday was approached by the opposition and suggested they abandon AQ.

They joined AQ and have stayed in it. An organization which murdered thousands of Americans one morning. They are brigaded with other the Islamists. That is quite enough.

No conspiracy of Russian agents here, your cause is just rotten. There is no genocide, Putin kills more terrorists than civilians, nothing in the law says Putin can't keep killing non-ISIS terrorists, the American people don't like the Syrian rebels, and you my friend cannot try to appeal to some expert status to justify saying America needs to ride to the rescue of AQ.

Putin has thankfully saved us from the "experts" who have failed us for generations by putting dumping his own nation into this quagmire.