Gendarmerie / Paramilitary Policing (again)

[Fuchs]

I have a problem with the notion of "occupation force." Specifically, I disagree with the idea that "... the occupation and stabilization will take years and the responsibility for that operation falls squarely on the Army ..." I think we are better off thinking in terms of the people of a given country being responsible for their own rebuilding, with some outside assistance as long as it's welcome.

Along those lines, isn't that the mission (or part thereof) for MPs and Civil Affairs?

Gendarmerie ~ MP

[J Wolfsberger]

Gendarmerie ~ MP

In some countries yes, in others, including the U.S., no.

[TheCurmudgeon]

In some countries yes, in others, including the U.S., no.

This would be new to us. The MPs we have don't really have this capability. MP's are trained to conduct most their policing operations on the military. They are not trained as a civilian police force. Plus you are looking at a huge structure. I recently read an article on mission requirements in the event that North Korea collapsed. The author was estimating between 180,000 and 312,000 soldiers for security operations (Humanitarian relief and Policing). Obviously in this case the South Koreans would be the lead, but it gives you an idea of the size of a force that would be required in a large scale military occupation.

[Steve Blair]

Checking for "constabulary" might give you more results. That's usually what the US has attempted in post-conflict situations.

[Stan]

This would be new to us. The MPs we have don't really have this capability. MP's are trained to conduct most their policing operations on the military. They are not trained as a civilian police force. Plus you are looking at a huge structure. I recently read an article on mission requirements in the event that North Korea collapsed. The author was estimating between 180,000 and 312,000 soldiers for security operations (Humanitarian relief and Policing). Obviously in this case the South Koreans would be the lead, but it gives you an idea of the size of a force that would be required in a large scale military occupation.

You know we have been trying to convert infantry KATUSAs and regular GIs into MPs at the MDL since the late 70s and it doesn't work. Riot control is one thing, but controlling the civilian population under more peaceful situations turned ugly in a big way.

We've also tried to convert our ground forces into humanitarian tools in the POTUSs kit bag and we all know that Army dogs do not do hugs and kisses well at all.

We are trained to destroy things and we have a handle on that. We also have UN orgs out the jinjiang doing the baby hugging stuff, so why are we trying to do something only the French are famous for ?

Gendarmes and Guard Civil are only notorious for robbing people. Do we need such a label with all our other blunders in front of the Euro bros

Leave that Sierra to the French and Africans

[carl]

Stan:

Since 1898, at one time or another, we've occupied Cuba, the Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico, Haiti, the Philippines, Korea, Japan, Iraq, Afghanistan, Italy, Germany and probably a bunch of places I haven't thought of. The point of the article that I linked to above is occupation is something the military does, often; so it would be wise for it, specifically the Army, to think about how to do it well.

[J Wolfsberger]

The point of the article that I linked to above is occupation is something the military does, often; so it would be wise for it, specifically the Army, to think about how to do it well.

As an alternative, why not establish a completely separate American Gendarmerie? Maybe put it under control of the State Department, and limit its TOE to lightly armored vehicles and small arms.

[Steve Blair]

As an alternative, why not establish a completely separate American Gendarmerie? Maybe put it under control of the State Department, and limit its TOE to lightly armored vehicles and small arms.

Ya mean sorta how they used to use the Marines?

[carl]

As an alternative, why not establish a completely separate American Gendarmerie? Maybe put it under control of the State Department, and limit its TOE to lightly armored vehicles and small arms.

Well I suppose you could do that if you ran out of Marines and had a whole bunch of extra money and manpower to spare waiting around. It is easier if you have the forces that took the place do the job, as they have so often in the past. Given our history, it is as much part of the military's job as taking the place.