Results 1 to 16 of 16

Thread: U.S. Embassy employees fearful over Green Zone attacks

  1. #1
    Council Member tequila's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    New York, NY
    Posts
    1,665

    Default U.S. Embassy employees fearful over Green Zone attacks

    Maybe it's just me, but I found the whining in this piece somewhat amazing. Are these people unfamiliar with the concept of "war zone"? Some of the problems with PRT staffing come into better light, perhaps?

    U.S. Embassy employees in Iraq are growing increasingly angry over what they say are inadequate security precautions in the heavily fortified Green Zone, where recent mortar and rocket attacks have claimed the lives of six people, including two U.S. citizens.

    <snip>

    One of the U.S. officials expressed anger that embassy employees were told not to talk to reporters.

    "They want to say everything is fine. But if I'm asked I'm not going to lie," he said. "It's my life and it would be my grave and it would be my body flying back to my family."
    Last edited by SWCAdmin; 05-15-2007 at 12:24 PM. Reason: That's a copyrighted work. Read it all at the link.

  2. #2
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Estonia
    Posts
    3,817

    Default I hear violins playing !

    Nice post Tequila !

    n spite of the attacks, embassy employees complain, most staff members still sleep in trailers that one described as "tin cans" that offer virtually no protection from rocket and mortar fire. The government has refused to harden the roofs because of the cost, one employee said.
    At least they have sandbags. My last embassy assignment they bitched about light deprivation and all ended up with 'happy lights' on the USG tab. Now these folks want to sleep in hardened bunkers. Go figure. Will they get happy lights down there in those unfavorable environmental conditions? Maybe we could pump fresh air in. FYI, When it comes to the Embassy supporting ‘other-than-State’ employees in country (read the US Military), nothing is funded. Time to suck it up !

    Embassy employees have been ordered not to talk about security concerns or precautions with reporters, but three State Department employees in Baghdad discussed the issue with McClatchy Newspapers. All three asked not to be identified for fear that they'd lose their jobs.
    Hello ! When you enter into certain occupations, whether it be in government, law, military, etc., you DO sacrifice certain freedom of speech rights. That's been true of any military of any age, including American ones. Welcome aboard

    Unlike the U.S. military, U.S. Embassy employees are volunteers and can ask to leave if they feel unsafe at any time.
    And that they know how to do extremely well.

    "I can't sleep, I can't eat," another official said. "My life should be worth more than achieving this government's agenda."
    Jeez, this is truly upsetting. Didn't he get a contract when he joined State

    Two of the people who spoke with McClatchy said the conditions also have affected experienced diplomats' willingness to serve in Baghdad and that the holes are being filled by young and inexperienced volunteers and contractors.
    Hmmm, the slots in Paris and Vienna must be taken

  3. #3
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Rancho La Espada, Blanchard, OK
    Posts
    1,065

    Default Reminds me of...

    This one reminds me of Panama in 1987 and 1988. BTW, all US military (as we all know) are volunteers and FSOs can be ordered to take a post involuntarily if there are not enough volunteers. Still, far too many DOS employees are, in fact, whiners.

  4. #4
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    The Land of The Morning Calm
    Posts
    177

    Default

    DoS whines more than anyhting I have seen in my life.

  5. #5
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Estonia
    Posts
    3,817

    Default

    Hi John !
    Good point, but his/her statement is fairly clear among other things:

    "I can't shake my fist at Uncle Sam and say, `Why am I here?'" one official said. "We're all volunteers."
    Quote Originally Posted by John T. Fishel View Post
    This one reminds me of Panama in 1987 and 1988. BTW, all US military (as we all know) are volunteers and FSOs can be ordered to take a post involuntarily if there are not enough volunteers. Still, far too many DOS employees are, in fact, whiners.

  6. #6
    Council Member sullygoarmy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Fort Stewart
    Posts
    224

    Default

    I was at the Embassy in March when the attacks started to pick up again. A rocket landed right at the fountain in front of the palace. We came back from Adnon Palace and the area was taped off with a bunch of pogues taking pictures of the crater to send back home!

    When you are still having pool parties, "Baghdad Idol" and selling embassy t-shirts at the pool, its no wonder that people are getting killed in the attacks. As must as I hate to say it, on one hand the attacks on the green zone are a good reminder what those troops are experiencing every day. I cannot imagine the complaining going on by the civilians that they have to wear body armor and a kevlar when outside. Again, guess what our troops do nearly every day.

    Thanks for the article. I sent it to two buddies TDY over in the palace. They'll get a good laugh out of it I'm sure!
    "But the bravest are surely those who have the clearest vision of what is before them, glory and danger alike, and yet withstanding, go out to meet it."

    -Thucydides

  7. #7
    Moderator Steve Blair's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Montana
    Posts
    3,195

    Default

    They remind me of "combat correspondents" who whine whey they get shot at...
    "On the plains and mountains of the American West, the United States Army had once learned everything there was to learn about hit-and-run tactics and guerrilla warfare."
    T.R. Fehrenbach This Kind of War

  8. #8
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    39

    Default Objectivity

    If we do not listen we should not be surprized at inadequate results.

    The DOS guys are saying (though admittedly in a whine) that the lack of security is affecting their performance and staff quality. And if you want better work from them someone needs to address at least some of these issues. Commitment, Cash, and Good People is more likely to get better results. Hardly a unique sentiment in American government service.

    Finding people who will actually do all they can with all that they have in difficult circumstances is an unfortunately rare commodity.

  9. #9
    Council Member Tom Odom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    DeRidder LA
    Posts
    3,949

    Default Venus, Mars, and Leadership

    I am reminded of Women are from Venus, Men are from Mars as applied to the embassies in Kinshasa and Kigali. Kinshasa practiced whining as an art form; the lead item in every country team meeting, regardless of circumstances centered on ways to increase COLA or hardship pay or both. Kigali was just the opposite; we bunked in embassy offices or in embassy housing without regards to the niceties of life. We reopened the club but did so in a way to serve the entire international community. The difference between the two places was leadership.

    I would say that applies in Baghdad as well; senior leaders in State, USAID, and other agencies need themselves to get out there and spend some time on the ground, as in days and weeks, not high profile it for a couple of hours and back on the jet.

    Tom

  10. #10
    Council Member Ironhorse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    DC
    Posts
    96

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MASON View Post
    If we do not listen we should not be surprized at inadequate results.

    The DOS guys are saying (though admittedly in a whine) that the lack of security is affecting their performance and staff quality. And if you want better work from them someone needs to address at least some of these issues. Commitment, Cash, and Good People is more likely to get better results. Hardly a unique sentiment in American government service.

    Finding people who will actually do all they can with all that they have in difficult circumstances is an unfortunately rare commodity.
    Superb point, Mason. But I do think there is a lot of selectivity on which of the "some of these issues" need to get addressed. Maybe some of the ones you're thinking about. Certainly not some of the ones you are likely to hear from high on the wish list of many of the whiners.

    The lack of security is affecting EVERYONE'S performance. But we do have the chicken and the egg issue where a lot of things that the non-military departments are "responsible" for are essential to the presence of enough security. It is not a military horse bringing up the security cart. Foreign "Service" and Government "Service" need to have a little more Service, and a little less sense of Entitlement in them.

    I do not go completely for the "get hard and stop your snivelling" line. There is a certain special privilege of suffering and roughing it that comes along with the military. I do not think the pol/econ guys should be manning the MG team in their off duty hours. But I can not tolerate the self-righteous sense of entitlement that comes with most OCONUS government employees, Foreign Service and otherwise. They can sure as hell bunk up as in Tom's Kigali example.

    While there are examples to the contrary on either end, I think the expectations that many of us have of the good NGOs should hold more sway for our expectations of our non-military government. We are less likely to fault MSF, CARE or Red Cross for pulling out of a hairy security situation, I think in part because when they do roll back in they're willing to take a few incoming rounds, be alone and unafraid, do their good work, and most significantly to rough it a bit. You know, without putting in a work request to the GSO to have the refirgerator shelves adjusted, or an absurd COLA and snivelling about the drapes on a 60 day tour with a 50&#37; differential/hazard pay.

  11. #11
    Council Member tequila's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    New York, NY
    Posts
    1,665

    Default

    World's Biggest Embassy May Not Be Big Enough - Washington Post.

    For all those who keep whining about how the government can't do anything right, we're happy to report that the massive New Embassy Compound in Baghdad, the biggest U.S. embassy on earth, is going to be completed pretty much as scheduled in August.

    The bad news is that it appears it's not going to have enough housing for all the employees who'll be moving to the 27-building complex on a 104-acre tract of land -- about the size of the Vatican, two-thirds the size of the Mall -- within the Green Zone ...

    There are 1,000 Americans working at the embassy, and Crocker is looking to downsize, but we hear he's having trouble finding even 100 to toss overboard. Also, there are about 200 non-U.S. workers brought in from around the region who are replacing Iraqi staff because it is too dangerous for the Iraqis, who live outside the fortified Green Zone, to work for Americans ...

    Crocker's home in the NEC -- which one source said was about 16,000 square feet -- is expected to be ready. Ditto deputy chief of mission Daniel Speckhard's cottage, which is a cozy 9,500 square feet. In addition to office buildings, the complex, located on the banks of the Tigris River, will have a pool and gym and a 17,000-square-foot commissary and food court building.

    The NEC will also have its own water supply, power plant and waste-treatment facility so it doesn't have to rely on the Iraqis for essential services.

    All this for only $592 million. Well, that was the original price tag.

  12. #12
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    39

    Default results fall to the average

    Tom nailed it

    It is leadership!

    I really think the high rotation rate of personel in and out of theatre hurts us more than we know and more than we want to admit. Particularly in the leadership area but it is true across the spectrum of assignments. The arbitrary rotation of leaders and their staff preclude maximizing good leaderships effect on the out come. Experience is spread so thin across the force its effect is minimized. Effectively you end up with a 7 month or 1 year force, Not a force designed to face an adaptive enemy over a 7 or 10 year conflict with a politically defined end of one sides capitulation.


    One of the jobs of leaders is to sort out the real issues from the whiny noise and clarify for people he or she leads and for those that support them what must be done to complete particular missions and in the longer term what will succeed in campaigns.

    Effectively people are sent on limited missions and the leadership defining the campaigns are retiring or are reassigned according to an arbitrary schedules. The long term results are unfortunately mediocre and predictable. Nothing decisive Politically or Militarily is achieved.

  13. #13
    Council Member marct's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    3,682

    Default

    Hi Tequila,

    Quote Originally Posted by tequila View Post
    I have to wonder if anyone else has noticed the similarity between this homely little embassy and some of Saddam's constructions? Not that anyone would ever equate the two...

    Marc

    Ps. I don't suppose that AQ influenced the design? Nah, not possible....
    Sic Bisquitus Disintegrat...
    Marc W.D. Tyrrell, Ph.D.
    Institute of Interdisciplinary Studies,
    Senior Research Fellow,
    The Canadian Centre for Intelligence and Security Studies, NPSIA
    Carleton University
    http://marctyrrell.com/

  14. #14
    Council Member sullygoarmy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Fort Stewart
    Posts
    224

    Default

    I flew over the NEC back in March on my way to Victory from the IZ. Still going to be a HPT for insurgent mortars/rockets just like the embassy compound is. Here are two pics from our helicopter as we flew by. The first is of the actual compound, the second of the contractor living area working on the NEC.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    "But the bravest are surely those who have the clearest vision of what is before them, glory and danger alike, and yet withstanding, go out to meet it."

    -Thucydides

  15. #15
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    39

    Default no argument there but the noise is loud

    Response to last Iron horse post

    In certain organizations there are things acceptable to complain about like things which are the understood responsibility of another organization. When the volume goes up though I wonder if the problem is actually an internal issue which will have repercussions if said out loud.


    Just a thought
    Last edited by MASON; 05-16-2007 at 02:04 PM. Reason: clarify out of sequence post

  16. #16
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,188

    Default

    16K sq. feet of living space for the boss and 9.5k for the XO ??? Hmmm, Marc's query rings a bell with me

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •