Russia and the US

[Brian Hanley]

Hey there. Don't go all soft on the new guy so soon. I'll get lazy.

Personally, I think some of the best lobbying we could all do right now is to grant Russia most favored nation status and grant Russian Federation Citizens automatic right to enter the USA without a visa and work. Set up a special mutual passport recognition, but make it unilateral if Putin doesn't like it.

There'll be some criminals, but most of them get over here anyway, they just bribe people at embassies. Costs about $50K to wash a record over there and convince key people to put the stamps on. (I've heard reports of as low as $10-$15K, but if they're true, somebody has an employee over a barrel.)

I think it would force Putin to accept the treaty and it would be very popular in Russia, and help us develop business ties more than anything else ever could. That is the only lever I can see that will pry the Kremlin away from its present course.

[Stan]

Hey Brian !

Personally, I think some of the best lobbying we could all do right now is to grant Russia most favored nation status and grant Russian Federation Citizens automatic right to enter the USA without a visa and work. Set up a special mutual passport recognition, but make it unilateral if Putin doesn't like it.

I might be inclined to most favored nation status, but visa-free entry would literally equate to opening Pandora's Box on this end of the world. The long-awaited Schengen Visa policy is already a quagmire promising little benefit in exchange for Russians to freely tramp across Europe.

There'll be some criminals, but most of them get over here anyway, they just bribe people at embassies. Costs about $50K to wash a record over there and convince key people to put the stamps on. (I've heard reports of as low as $10-$15K, but if they're true, somebody has an employee over a barrel.)

Jeez, I hope that's not going on at US Embassies. Washing one's record of mafia-relation is one thing (eliminates the host nation MFA from declining the visa request), but 'selling' a US visa for 15K seems highly unlikely.

There's an interesting Russian opinion here regarding Putin's visit to Tehran.

Solution of the Iranian nuclear issue is in Tehran and Washington, not in Moscow

[Brian Hanley]

Aside from that nagging little demographic problem...

Having spoken to Pakistanis in Moscow talking about Russia as the land of wide open opportunity I'd not worry my head about that. We have our own demographic problem, and we have "solved" it the same way. Illegal immigrants. In Russia, most are happy. Russian cops are happy to have more bribe money. Russian workers are happy to have people they can feel better than for a change, maybe even be able to afford a maid or a gardner. Illegals are happy to be out of "fookin' Pakistan." Just like here with south of the border...

I might be inclined to most favored nation status, but visa-free entry would literally equate to opening Pandora's Box on this end of the world. The long-awaited Schengen Visa policy is already a quagmire promising little benefit in exchange for Russians to freely tramp across Europe.
...

What Pandora's box? So the FSB could do a little S&T spying slightly more easily. Big deal. so we have more pretty Russian girls who like to cook for their husbands? So sad. So we have legions of well educated white folks wanting to attain the American dream and work their asses off. Now that's a problem. You got me.

The Europeans are doing that for three benefits. A. Low cost labor and immigrant blood that doesn't come from the Muslim world. (They're seriously worried - no kidding.) B. Money from Russians who come to Europe to deposit money in banks that won't go belly up next week. Then they go home. This helps European banks with deposits, and it helps stabilize Russia by allowing the middle class to be protected from Kremlin currency manipulation. C. To develop interlocking business ties with Russia so that Russia will be less difficult in the coming years of ascendancy.

Jeez, I hope that's not going on at US Embassies. Washing one's record of mafia-relation is one thing (eliminates the host nation MFA from declining the visa request), but 'selling' a US visa for 15K seems highly unlikely.

There, there. Seriously, it happens all the time. Ever wonder how those Visas got granted that weren't even filled out properly for the 9-11 boyz? Yes, it does. As I said, usually the price is around $50K, but it goes lower. At least the US embassy doesn't have sales reps hawking space in the diplomatic pouch. Many countries do. I was offered a couple bucks a kilo to transport whatever I wanted to the USA in Pakistan's diplomatic pouch. The Germans pouch has a corner on art and antiques, that sort of thing.

Think about the attitude of the foriegn service officers being assigned to Iraq. They gots yer basic bad attitude, they gots their college compadres making more than they are, it's a setup.

It's too bad I wasn't allowed to communicate with embassy audit. But yes, Virginia, there IS a santa claus in the foriegn service!

[nichols]

There, there. Seriously, it happens all the time.

Brian,

Are the FSOs working in conjunction with the FSNs? I just ran this past my wife, there are a lot of checks and balances to prevent this from happening.

[Stan]

Gotta agree with an old Africa hand there.

I've only served in 7 Embassies during 23 years of active duty, so pardon my lack of experience herein

Just exactly how does one sell a US Visa ?

[Ken White]

and gets a rubber stamp made, buys some odd paper and sets up shop...

[Stan]

and gets a rubber stamp made, buys some odd paper and sets up shop...

Actually, the days of the rubber stamp are older than Christ when he was just a Corporal (in the Army, Nichols )

The application approval process is at best arduous and no one individual can rubber stamp you to the USA. The 'foils' that are printed are a royal pain in the Alpha to handle, and are so sensitive they often tear when applying them.

I've done both full tours and various TDYs in places like Tbilisi where Brian was, but life in the fish bowl is often more secure, with or without an MSG, than the common person thinks.

I fully concur with Nichols. This situation regardless of how long ago and where it took place, should be immediately reported.

[nichols]

It's too bad I wasn't allowed to communicate with embassy audit. But yes, Virginia, there IS a santa claus in the foriegn service!

Brian,

Skip embassy audit, you need to report this to DS at the very least. Your background in anti terrorism dictates this gapping hole in our security needs to be plugged ASAP.

If you need some POCs, send me a PM. One of my buddies works at State, I'll pass this thread on to him if you want.

S/F

Paul

[Stan]

Brian,

What Pandora's box? So the FSB could do a little S&T spying slightly more easily. Big deal. so we have more pretty Russian girls who like to cook for their husbands? So sad. So we have legions of well educated white folks wanting to attain the American dream and work their asses off. Now that's a problem. You got me.

I'm not at all concerned about additional FSB wannabes getting visas. They are not the likely ones to set up OC and prostitution rings in CONUS, they're too busy killing their former FSB agents and (ahem) spying. Suffices to say, that things have changed exponentially since your time in Georgia. I'm only 3 hours from St. Pete, and have observed first hand who and what makes the border crossings (legally or otherwise). As for all those pretty girls running to the States, well that's just naive to conclude. Better to observe the current Nashi forums all over Europe nearly identical to Kim's concept, only these Nashi are volunteering and procreating for Putin. We're a long, long way from those patriotic days of merely sleeping/spying for the Motherland.

The Europeans are doing that for three benefits. A. Low cost labor and immigrant blood that doesn't come from the Muslim world. (They're seriously worried - no kidding.) B. Money from Russians who come to Europe to deposit money in banks that won't go belly up next week. Then they go home. This helps European banks with deposits, and it helps stabilize Russia by allowing the middle class to be protected from Kremlin currency manipulation. C. To develop interlocking business ties with Russia so that Russia will be less difficult in the coming years of ascendancy.

A. Been to Germany lately ? Those are not cheap Russian laborers.
B. You got me there. Even the nouveaux riche here don't do banks. Strickly cash transactions, no trails that lead home.
C. I feel you adequately answered this one earlier. There's no such animal as interlocking business relationships or ties with Russia. They break every deal and business arrangement at will.