Homosexuality and Military Service (Merged thread)

[motorfirebox]

However if the basis of atheism is an evolutionist/materialist worldview, it is illogical and anachronistic for atheists to be compassionate, moral, or advocates of human rights. These things, that worldview implies, just serve as roadblocks to the ultimate survival of the fittest and contribute to excess population that consume resources and stress the environment. Stalin, Hitler (though probably more correctly rejector of the Judeo-Christian foundation of Western Civilization that a pure materialist atheist) and Mao were logically consistent atheists; Dawkins and Hitchens are not.

Well, that's one view of atheism, but it's not the only one and it's certainly not the only logical one. It's just as reasonable to decide that what makes humanity 'fit' is our ability to form resilient societies, and conclude that the ultimate expression of humanity's fitness is an inclusive society that promotes the welfare of every participant.

Re: Slavery. Please point me towards a place in the New Testament that advocates for slavery as an institution?

Off the top of my head? Ephesians 6:5-9. It doesn't advocate slavery, but that wasn't Deus Ex's claim. What this passage says is exactly what Deus Ex said: it tells slaves to obey their masters, and tells masters how to treat their slaves. It doesn't tell masters to release their slaves.

If this is the case because homosexuality is consensual and adult sexual expression, on what grounds can there be legal prohibitions on consentual adult incest (especially if the adults make themselves incapable of bearin children), polygamy, bestiality, prostitution etc.

I did address this earlier. Regarding incest, two things--one, I'm not sure such relationships can necessarily be counted as consensual given the amount of influence family members can have on each other; there are rules against fraternization in the military for reasons similar to this. Second: Abraham married his half-sister, a union God explicitly blessed. Just throwing that out there.

Why should someone not be allowed to serve their country just because of what they love (on their plate)?

Because it would inherently negatively impact combat readiness. Homosexuality does not inherently have an effect on combat readiness.

Motorfirebox -On a probably much too personal a level though, I'll ask - do you object to Christianity because you doubt its truth or because "walking the talk" might cause you change your lifestyle? Disregard if I'm crossing the line.

I don't object to Christianity at all. I think it's great--for other people. Personally, I don't care very much about whether or not God exists, so to pursue any religion beyond that basic apathy would be silly for me.

And likewise, I'm enjoying the debate.