Contractors Doing Combat Service Support is a Bad, Bad Idea

[Cavguy]

The better comparison is to how firefighters live while on duty: during that time they all take turns at the stove and the sink. None of them quit because that is part of their jobs and lives. In fact, as far as I can tell, they quite enjoy it -- it builds camaraderie amongst the personnel, they know the importance of a good meal, etc.

I might also point out that, until recently, such self-support was the norm in the army. Troops arranged themselves in messes, were given food, and prepared it themselves. Again, from what I've read, most enjoyed this setup.

The fact of the matter is that even for the trigger puller at the pointiest end today, most time is not spent engaged in combat. Most of the time is spent in a variety of tasks that are akin to housekeeping duties -- ie, not things for which anyone signed on the dotted line.

Finally, if folks enlisted knowing that this was the set-up, their expectations would not be a problem.

Regards,
Jill

Jill, lots of respect for you and your husband.

Most Infantry, Armor, Artillery, and engineer guys have zero desire to become CSS types.

Where you get the idea that combat guys helped in the mess is beyond me - KP was eliminated in the AVF by 73, and as Uboat said, we have had specialized cook sections since (and during) WW II.

Sometimes junior combat arms guys are detailed to BN support platoons, where they often work in the fuel/ammo resupply platoon under soldiers who have that MOS. Their PL is usually a combat arms type as well, though that is changing in the modular units. Often each staff section has combat arms augmentees, such as the S1 (personnel) and S4 (supply) sections to round out the supply types.

Officers and NCO's in the army do get "B" type billets, we just don't call it that. Post command, a CPT may work as an observer/controller, reserve component trainer, ROTC instructor, recruiter, branch school instructor, trainer/mentor, senior staff (generating force), or a host of other options.

Most E5's and above get an assignment in the training base as instructors or as recruiters at some point. Most E7's wind up in RC training, garrison staffs, senior instructors, drill sergeants, observer/controllers etc. after their PSG time. It works because in each they apply their combat lessons in the generating force.

Officers also rotate through staff assignments between troop duty - I was a BN S1, AS3, and S4, and BCT asst S3 (twice). Now I have my "B" job here at Leavenworth in the COIN center, applying my 29 months of OIF time to better the army.

I don't see what is to be gained by making combat guys pull KP, wash laundry, or any other service that outweighs the above. Ken and Uboat are also right - some jobs (like being a NCO cook - really a DFAC manager) are actually highly trained specialties. A good mess daddy is a true treasure, and I wouldn't want it any other way. I had additional duty as the Food Service Officer for awhile, and it's eye opening how complex it can be. Same with most other support MOS's.

The fact that we use contractors is a value decision that we can contract our short term need for lots of food service in Iraq, and don't need it in garrison. as I explained to SFC Hoh in another thread - it can be long term cheaper for the military.

Regarding your complaints about the fobbits getting steak and lobster and the guys in the COP's not, that's just whining. I venture I've spent as much time in COP's or remote locations as anyone else, and it's just the nature of the beast. You can't mermite lobster to COP's because it becomes unsafe in the 4-6 hours between it being cooked and delivered via LOGPAC to the field. We usually got steak though. The selection was much more limited than on the FOB, but hey, what do you expect? My guys did enjoy their platoon rotation back to the fob for maintenance/rearm/refit, where they enjoyed the bounty provided for about 48h every two weeks.

My company got 1 hot daily during OIF 05-07 in our COP, occasionally two, brought out by my 1SG and HQ det daily. Guys on the FOB got 3x hots a day. Lots of people here can talk about the M-M-M and M-M-A from OIF1. I know of no one who would prefer to do that again. (WOW! General Tso chicken! for breakfast!)

You seem to be deginerating the army guys as whiners, but you're doing just that regarding your perceptions from your husband. You seem to percieve injustice or poor leadership because CSS types live better than the line dogs. That's just reality, and all combat arms soldiers know it. We also may bitch about it occasionally, but I haven't met a motivated combat arms soldier who would trade it for the steak and lobster life. In fact, my soldiers during their rotations back generally got off the FOB whenever possible, and back to the COP where the tip of the spear stuff was done. The only time they complained was when they heard someone on the fob complain about some luxury not being available. Generally, most FOB soldiers know they have it well, and don't speak such things around those not living there. (Could bring a beating!)

I also served in MNF-W under I and II MEF during the latter half of my last OIF rotation, and the MLG guys had it good while the regimental guys and TT's out in sector lived spartan. It's simply the fact of life in the military, and not only in the army. I really don't see what is gained by your proposal, and strongly disagree that it's unique to the army.

Niel