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Thread: Ukraine (closed; covers till August 2014)

  1. #1321
    Council Member mirhond's Avatar
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    "Discipline" in the Ukrainian army.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=wwQIC37VVuI

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=QQZnJ8ZinpA

    Rookies have something to say to their superiors.
    I could translate it, but I don't think it's neccessary, it's mostly "Get the fu(K out" ranting. Videos speak for itself.

    Donbass militia claimed to capture a group SBU officers.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Onoxc7E7LO0
    Faces are covered, the whole thing looks like Bravo Sierra (thanks to Stan for a new mot ) but, who knows, may be these guys are real saboteurs.
    Last edited by mirhond; 04-28-2014 at 08:07 AM.
    Haeresis est maxima opera maleficarum non credere.

  2. #1322
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    John McCain with Charlie Rose

    The first 20 odd minutes is on Ukraine.

  3. #1323
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    Stopping Russia Starts in Syria

    Anne-Marie Slaughter writes:

    Obama took office with the aim of ending wars, not starting them. But if the US meets bullets with words, tyrants will draw their own conclusions. So will allies; Japan, for example, is now wondering how the US will respond should China manufacture a crisis over the disputed Senkaku Islands.

  4. #1324
    Council Member carl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mirhond View Post
    "Discipline" in the Ukrainian army.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=wwQIC37VVuI

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=QQZnJ8ZinpA

    Rookies have something to say to their superiors.
    Discipline or lack thereof in the Ukrainian Army isn't what Russia should be concerned about. Russia should be concerned about the enthusiasm of potential Ukrainian irregulars and insurgents, potential enthusiasm for plugging occupying Russian troops.
    "We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene

  5. #1325
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    Head of pro-Russian forces in Eastern Ukraine Igor Strelkov is experienced FSB officer. This morning there was intensive discussion about Igor Strelkov's backround in Russian social media. Some active people found out that Strelkov is active member of one military history forum, where he also posted his short military career. Those military units will say nothing to outsiders, but after some search you can find that the numbers are connected to FSB subunits. One of the units has some period served also in Chechnya.

    http://shgid.fmbb.ru/viewtopic.php?p...ighlight=#2983
    http://russia.bestpravo.ru/fed1998/data06/tex20098.htm
    http://forum.yurclub.ru/index.php?ap...ttach_id=68629
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  6. #1326
    Council Member mirhond's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carl View Post
    Discipline or lack thereof in the Ukrainian Army isn't what Russia should be concerned about. Russia should be concerned about the enthusiasm of potential Ukrainian irregulars and insurgents, potential enthusiasm for plugging occupying Russian troops.
    There are no evidences of "occupying Russian troops" in the first place.

    Hardcore regime-fighter and make-believe mediator Khodorkovski is not welcome among common folk,
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YlRS5ZMd6w
    (the message is plain and simple: "Get out")

    but local mafia boss Renat Akhmetov is not so biased.
    http://24tv.ua/home/showSingleNews.d...436993&lang=ru
    "We talked and his position is clear - Donbass is Ukraine" said Khodorkovski.
    Haeresis est maxima opera maleficarum non credere.

  7. #1327
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Mirhond,

    Quote Originally Posted by mirhond View Post
    There are no evidences of "occupying Russian troops" in the first place.
    I don't think Carl was saying there are occupying Russian troops, but, rather, that once there are, there would be a concern with Ukrainian irregulars involved in social upheaval.

    It is in fact what sparked young Estonian irregulars from 97 to present day.

    However, Vova knows how to use his miilita both at home and abroad.

    This part of the world only responds to one thing.... The stick and no carrots, and vodka
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  8. #1328
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    This site claims that Strelkov's last service place is military unit 36391, which is FSB anti-terrorist unit, that should fight against international terrorism.

    Последнее место службы (в/ч 36391) - это Управление по борьбе с международным терроризмом 2-й Службы ФСБ России.
    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/830579.html

    It seems to me that Russia is now terrorism exporter like during Soviet time. Was it called state sponsored terrorism? Defence minister Shoigu may claim that military units by the Ukrainian border have left back to barracks and it may seem that situation has been deescalated (there will be no conventional war), but my humble opinion is that special services have set up insurgency in neighboring country. Russian media has brainwashed audience, there are many weapons available, networks of people have been mapped etc. There are plenty of levers to play with violent and nonviolent methods against central government in Kiev. Intensity of operations will be dictated according to political events calendar in Ukraine.
    Last edited by kaur; 04-29-2014 at 10:45 AM.

  9. #1329
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    FSB antiterrorist guy is involeved in kindnapping of OSCE observers with diplomatic passports. No comments.

    Igor Strelkov – whom Ukraine's intelligence service describes as a wanted terrorist – made his first public appearance in the rebels' de facto capital. In an interview with Russian channels, he described the captured military representatives as "Nato spies". Strelkov said there was little prospect of them being freed unless Kiev's pro-western government traded them for jailed pro-Russian activists.
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...ure-nato-spies

    What a joke!

    Lavrov said Moscow was committed to implementing an agreement struck in Geneva on April 17 between Ukraine, Russia, the United States and the European Union to ease tensions in Ukraine and disarm illegal groups but accused Washington of distorting it with "one-sided demands".
    http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...A3O0I420140425

  10. #1330
    Council Member Firn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaur View Post
    FSB antiterrorist guy is involeved in kindnapping of OSCE observers with diplomatic passports. No comments.

    What a joke!
    Pretty Putinesque, if you ask me. At least he is cutting in Russia's flesh as well as long as he continues to wound weak Ukraine. The impact on the European economy as a whole is so far obviously very limited. A giant, even if weakened, doesn't feel much if a weakling kicks a nearby dwarf.

    Investors' Fear Crimps Russian Borrowing

    Usually prolific borrowers on global markets, Russian companies are finding their funding lifeblood cut off by banks and asset managers who fear their investments will get caught up in the standoff between Moscow and the West.

    With military tensions running high between Russia and Ukraine and a looming threat of tough Western economic sanctions, it is getting harder for companies to issue bonds or obtain loans — a situation that could eventually threaten some of them with default.
    So far the balance sheet looks still fairly strong but the Russian fires of war are buring Russian capital and growth. It is still early days, early weeks. We will see how much the Russian economy will suffer.

    BTW: Crimea Makes Economic Crisis Worse

    Instead, it seems that authorities are competing with each other to see who can do the most harm to the economy. One top Russian official proposed selling off the country's dollar and euro reserves without explaining how they would be replaced. Perhaps he would prefer the yen and yuan. But a quick look at the currencies preferred by the central banks of other countries is enough to show that they are far less reliable. Maybe he feels Russia should keep its money in gold.

    For every difficult and complex situation, leaders should respond with better and more responsible economic policy — and not just make matters worse.
    Personally it seems that most of the silly threats haven't been enforced. Most likely because some of the smarter guys have been able to make their case that those threats were, well, silly. But while almost all the silly stuff hasn't materialized not much has been done to help the Russian economy.
    Last edited by Firn; 04-29-2014 at 01:37 PM.
    ... "We need officers capable of following systematically the path of logical argument to its conclusion, with disciplined intellect, strong in character and nerve to execute what the intellect dictates"

    General Ludwig Beck (1880-1944);
    Speech at the Kriegsakademie, 1935

  11. #1331
    Council Member davidbfpo's Avatar
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    An open source RUSI briefing on the deployment of Russian and Ukrainian military forces:https://www.rusi.org/downloads/asset...SIBRIEFING.pdf
    davidbfpo

  12. #1332
    Council Member Fuchs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaur View Post
    FSB antiterrorist guy is involeved in kindnapping of OSCE observers with diplomatic passports. No comments.
    Well, the Ukraine has sovereignty in the area so basically everything the guy does there is illegal.

    Still, those OSCE observers were 'probably' not really OSCE observers.

  13. #1333
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Maybe Gerhard will get Vova to do something. Or, Vova will get Gerhard to make him smarter

    BERLIN–Former German chancellor Gerhard Schroeder celebrated his 70th birthday with Russian President Vladimir Putin in St. Petersburg on Monday evening, as the U.S. and European Union stepped up sanctions against Moscow over its handling of the Ukraine crisis.
    If you want to blend in, take the bus

  14. #1334
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    No. Gerhard Schroeder was called to lick his boss' boots.

    Tracing Russian Economic Assets – and Targets for More Sanctions

    Gazprom has special influence in Germany thanks in no small part to its employment of Social Democratic ex-chancellor Gerhard Schroeder as chairman of Nordstream, a Gazprom subsidiary operating a pipeline to the Baltic states. Schroeder has been questioned in Germany for his close association with Putin and Schroeder’s defense of the Russian overlord in the Crimean annexation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stan View Post
    Maybe Gerhard will get Vova to do something. Or, Vova will get Gerhard to make him smarter

  15. #1335
    Council Member carl's Avatar
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    It always amazes me how politicians come so cheap.
    "We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene

  16. #1336
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMA View Post
    No. Gerhard Schroeder was called to lick his boss' boots.
    ... operating a pipeline to the Baltic states
    Actually, if and when the pipeline ever completes its 1200+ kilometer journey, it will cut off all transit countries.
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  17. #1337
    Council Member Firn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carl View Post
    It always amazes me how politicians come so cheap.
    At least the likes of Schroeder. I'm almost surprised that Berlusconi isn't there, but then again it is Schroeder's not Putin's birthday.

    A friend, a good friend...

    They even dance in front of a gas station.

    BTW: Did anybody notice that their business is called 'Cuckoo', after the famous brood parasite which happens to lay his eggs into foreign nests?
    Last edited by Firn; 04-29-2014 at 06:26 PM.
    ... "We need officers capable of following systematically the path of logical argument to its conclusion, with disciplined intellect, strong in character and nerve to execute what the intellect dictates"

    General Ludwig Beck (1880-1944);
    Speech at the Kriegsakademie, 1935

  18. #1338
    Council Member Stan's Avatar
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    Default Boots on the ground, but what next

    At least they found a charismatic CPT to do the interview.

    When asked "what's next in your plans here" he fessed up not really knowing.

    They at least like the Estonian version of German pig and potatoes for lunch

    Video: Täna Ämarisse saabunud USA sõdurid näitavad liitlaste pühendumust
    Translation

    Video: USA soldiers arrived today at Ämari military airfield to show their members our commitment.
    Last edited by Stan; 04-29-2014 at 06:22 PM. Reason: Link to pig and tatters
    If you want to blend in, take the bus

  19. #1339
    Council Member AdamG's Avatar
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    Moscow has voiced concern over an "unprecedented" increase in US and Nato military activity near Russian borders, amid an escalating crisis in Ukraine.

    Russia's defence minister condemned "provocative" US and Nato comments.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-27200078
    A scrimmage in a Border Station
    A canter down some dark defile
    Two thousand pounds of education
    Drops to a ten-rupee jezail


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  20. #1340
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaur View Post
    Head of pro-Russian forces in Eastern Ukraine Igor Strelkov is experienced FSB officer. This morning there was intensive discussion about Igor Strelkov's backround in Russian social media. Some active people found out that Strelkov is active member of one military history forum, where he also posted his short military career. Those military units will say nothing to outsiders, but after some search you can find that the numbers are connected to FSB subunits. One of the units has some period served also in Chechnya.

    http://shgid.fmbb.ru/viewtopic.php?p...ighlight=#2983
    http://russia.bestpravo.ru/fed1998/data06/tex20098.htm
    http://forum.yurclub.ru/index.php?ap...ttach_id=68629
    kaur---all this means is that the Russian Foreign Minister, the Duma President, Putin, the Russian Defense Minster, and the FSB/GRU Chiefs cannot be lying as they all are stating there are no active duty Russian troops inside the Ukraine-(they never do mention what if they are Reservists)--or at least this is what Interfax, TASS, RIA/Novosti, Russia 24 and Russian TV is saying almost every day that they are saying---and you do understand that the Russia media and the Russian elites never lie.

    But again it is the same Russian media that utters the word Nazi/Right Sector (means the same thing) more times daily than the entire German media has used the word Nazi in the last 30 years---there is an old saying---repeat something seven times and one starts to believe it---it is a left/right brain thing.
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 04-29-2014 at 08:53 PM.

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