And who ... other than the Germans - would have believed Putin anyway?Originally Posted by OUTLAW 09
More photos of a Russian BRT-80 and Russian MANPADs which had Russian Army documents on them indicating they had been "checked out" of their Russian Army installations complete with Russian military stamps and signatures and military unit designations.
Ukrainian SBU released as well the photos/passports of three Russian citizens who they are claiming are GRU personnel responsible for the Odessa fire on 2 May that Russia demanded be investigated which it seems now involved Russians---Russians have sine dropped the demand for an investigation from their daily press releases.
So much for Putin's "enhanced Border security efforts".
http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukra...os-352718.html
And who ... other than the Germans - would have believed Putin anyway?
At least according to the 'neutral' Swiss NZZ 'the Germans', at least the vast majority, especially in the media and politics are especially distrustful of Putin and his actions. There are of course some who differ, mostly payed mouthpieces, useful idiots and fringe lunatics but it seems to be a relative small minority.
It is also worth to point out that Germany seems to take the sanctions and arms sales quite a bit more serious then for example the French. Overall it is no surprise at all that there are quite a bit of differences and no government and no company likes to pay the price of sanctions. The size of the miltary contracts of the Mistral ships for example dwarfs the other military business deals done (and partly cancelled) with the Kremlin, so there is more at stake.Von alledem ist einiges ganz gut beobachtet. Tatsaechlich haben sich die Demarkationslinien des politischen Kampfes in den letzten Jahren deutlich verschoben. Das alte Links-Rechts-Schema taugt nichts mehr. In der linksalternativen «Tageszeitung», in deren Redaktion lange viele Altachtundsechziger sassen, finden sich mindestens ebenso scharfe Artikel gegen Putin wie in der einst konservativen, heute ideologisch solide eingemitteten «Frankfurter Allgemeinen Zeitung». Groessere Publikationen, die Putin und Russland unterstuetzten, gibt es in der deutschen Medienlandschaft tatsaechlich keine, sieht man ab von Russia Today, dem Gegenstück zu CNN, BBC und Euronews, der Zeitungsbeilage «Russland Heute», der erfolgreichen Video-Agentur Ruptly und natuerlich der Stimme Russlands. Die offizielle deutsche Politik reproduziert diese Einseitigkeit. Von den Bundestagsparteien vermag lediglich die Linke Sympathien für den Kreml aufzubringen und auch das nur halbherzig. Die Gruenen, einst links, alternativ und allem Autoritaeren abhold, sind die erbittertsten Gegner Putins. Dessen Freunde verschaffen sich mit einer Flut von Leserbriefen und auf dem Internet Gehoer, doch ins Establishment dringen sie nicht vor. Die Auseinandersetzung um die Ukraine ist ein Streit zwischen der Elite und Wutbuergern geworden, zwischen «denen da oben», die korrupt sind und sich von den Amerikanern haben kaufen lassen, und den Klarsichtigen, Ehrlichen, aber bedauerlicherweise nicht Herrschenden.
Last edited by Firn; 06-20-2014 at 03:55 PM.
... "We need officers capable of following systematically the path of logical argument to its conclusion, with disciplined intellect, strong in character and nerve to execute what the intellect dictates"
General Ludwig Beck (1880-1944);
Speech at the Kriegsakademie, 1935
That military supply and fitting documents are just the most recent threads in the carpet of Russias war against Ukraine, making it's patterns stand out clearer.
Heavy weapons have been sent in by Putin in still rather limited numbers, it seems, we will see if their numbers get increased by the Kremlin. The most likely explanation are considerable losses among the relatively lightly armed Russian-led forces operating inside Ukraine suffered against an opposition which has increasingly used more firepower. So far it seems there has been only quite limited success to recruit Ukrainian nationals, with Putin having to send in more overtly Russian formations. I wrote a long time ago that the Ukrainian forces might be overall badly trained, poorly equipped, wrongly led but they exist and are increasingly making it harder for the enemy which has attacked their country.
It is a rather fluid situation indeed, with more blood getting spilled each day Putin's war continues. He is certainly not making lots of friends in Ukraine, even if sweet Mariachi songs and friendly chants praise him.
Last edited by Firn; 06-20-2014 at 04:21 PM.
... "We need officers capable of following systematically the path of logical argument to its conclusion, with disciplined intellect, strong in character and nerve to execute what the intellect dictates"
General Ludwig Beck (1880-1944);
Speech at the Kriegsakademie, 1935
You forgot to mention that the majority Ukrainian soldiers (who are either conscripts or contract soldiers) participating in COIN are not going to die for "Poroshenko's yacht", and the only reliable and highly motivated troops available for Kiev are the National Guard made of die-hard Ukrainian Nazi, that's why it took entire month and several thousand of foot solders in the field to chase off a handful of separatists from small town Krasny Liman, for example.
"Ukropians" amassed from 10,000 to 30,000 of regulars with armor, artillery and airpower against no more than 3,000-5,000 militias (well, probably 20% of them are hardened Soviet veterans and even Russian serviceman on duty) equipped with no more than infantry weapons - and still they have no major success.
Your tale ofis wishful thinking.overtly Russian formations
Last edited by mirhond; 06-20-2014 at 09:54 PM.
Haeresis est maxima opera maleficarum non credere.
One point by Russian military journalist, I'd like to share with mirhond.
http://starshinazapasa.livejournal.com/798724.htmlЭкспорт ненависти
June 20th, 10:51
Основной вид военной поддержки, которую Россия оказывает Донецку и Луганску - это геббельсовщина.
Если бы Россия не экспортировала на Украину такие потоки вранья и ненависти, никакой войны на Востоке не началось бы вообще.
Боевики и оружие - это, конечно, очень важная статья импорта, но все же - вторичная.
А основопологающая - геббельсовщина.
Стрелков с Бесом могли возникнуть и начать захватывать администрации только потому, что была накачка телевидения про "Правый сектор", который теперь - после Майдана - уже точно придет и перережет всех русских. Без этого никакие зеленые человечки были бы невозможны.
And here you can find the list of those modern day Russian heroes.
http://b0ltai.wordpress.com/2014/05/...#1086;к/
Last edited by kaur; 06-20-2014 at 10:41 PM.
And mirhond you seemed to have overlooked my comment which pointed to a Russian fascist group by name that made they arrival announcement in eastern Ukraine three days ago.
So Russian fascists are what better or worse than Ukrainian fascists?
Come on mirhond---that is a tired record you all keep repeating concerning Nazi's---I thought the victorious Rad Army destroyed them in 1945?---but wait why are they then still existing in Russia?
Answer--Russia does not have fascists---but wait they actually do--so who is lying you or Putin?
See --Russia claims to want and need the OCSE-- BUT wait is it not Russian Cossacks that kidnapped an entire OCSE team including one Russian---come on mirhond you have got to get better.
By the way you failed to respond to the pictures of Russian military equipment "checked out by someone in Russia" that is in the Ukraine complete with Russian Army documents---BUT wait the Ukrainians are Nazi's so the documents and equipment are wait fakes?
come on mirhond you all have to get better at this.
mirhond--let me see if I understand your dislike of Ukrainian Nazi's or as you say "fascists" BUT wait these are Russian "fascists".
so mirhond are you saying Russian "fascists" are the good guys and Ukrainian "fascists" are the bad guys.
You being a Russian I would have believed you would be against even Russian "fascists"?
So mirhond what is actually your position on this question---but hey I know it already---you will not respond.
So mirhond---if your right about the Ukrainian fascists---so this is then your story is some Ukrainian "fascists" did what ---drive to this Russian military unit and "paid" some corrupt Russian and I will use your own previous words when you talked about the T64s kaur pointed out to you BUT back to the story about this "corrupt" Russian Technical SGT.
So this fascist Ukrainian who drove god knows where the Russian Army unit was located and then paid what 100 USD for this BTR 80 to this "corrupt" Russian Army member and then somehow "drove" this BTR 80 on Russian highways fueling I guess at the local gas stations (not being seen I assume as well) from somewhere in Russia and "somehow" crossed the Russian border which the Russian Army/Putin "claims" they have "enhanced the border security on" and then drives it to eastern Ukraine to there only have it "taken" from him by Ukrainian "freedom fighters" that are actually disguised Russian Cossacks or Russian Chechens....right......?
Wow mirhond a great story if it is true but again as always Russians do not lie---right........
Same story I guess for the MANPADs as well---come on mirhond get a better story line going as the old one has worn itself out.
Follow rules, please, and do bother to translate your posts to English. I've sent you PM with an answer why your quotation is BS
@Outlaw I don't read your posts.
Last edited by mirhond; 06-21-2014 at 09:58 AM.
Haeresis est maxima opera maleficarum non credere.
mirhond, nice to see you back after short pause, that begun after exposure of Russsian Grad in Ukraine. mirhond, no comment?
I hope that interested readers managed Google translate Russian journalists article "Export of hate". This man fought has conscript in I Chechen war and has covered following Russian wars. Mirhond didn't like Babchenko's point and it seems that he is under Russian TV influence himself, if I consider his Russian wordings and Russian latest statistics
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/a...ws/502258.htmlHalf of all Russians consider television to be the most reliable source of information for domestic and international news coverage, a recent study of the Russian media environment has shown.
The study published Tuesday by independent pollster Levada Center found that 50 percent of Russians — and 65 percent of Muscovites — trust television more than any other news source.
After television, which is largely state-controlled, the most reliable sources of information were considered to be "friends, relatives and neighbors," followed by news websites, newspapers and radio, according to the Levada Center's latest findings.
Combined with the practically total control of the Kremlin over this media is a surprise there are indeed Russians who oppose it's wars and oppression. Especially if one can observe that even those who have access to foreign media and communities, mostly through the internet and thanks to their language skills sometimes follow the Kremlin line down to the single memes like Nazi this and fascist that. Of course now we know much more about the considerable lenghts to which Putin's men go to spread lies and hatred as well as to tighten their grip on the Russian portion of the net.
This is however no news anymore and should not be the point of this post. What is much more interesting and difficult to gather is how large and deeply rooted or small and shallow the popular support for the Putin's war is in areas and cities of the two-three oblasts is. Of course part of the reasons for the armed violence and the fake referendums by the local puppets was to avoid the potential embarassement of a regular elections with the 'wrong' outcome which would have helped to roughly determine the level of support at that point.
Perhaps later.
... "We need officers capable of following systematically the path of logical argument to its conclusion, with disciplined intellect, strong in character and nerve to execute what the intellect dictates"
General Ludwig Beck (1880-1944);
Speech at the Kriegsakademie, 1935
I suggest that Putin has been 'playing' the Germans along to let them believe there was no need for the sanctions against Russia which would be painful for Germany as well. He has succeeded in this which tells the world a lot about the real strenghts and weaknesses of Germany and the leadership of Frau Merkel.
Russia has nothing to fear from Germany.
see mirhond that is the difference between your blogging for the FSB and myself--I read every word and every misstatement you make and record them thus the ability to go back and even "quote" you.
see mirhond nearly everything you "rant" about has turned out to be falsehood which you cover over by using the words Nazi's or fascists if a comment is directed towards you and it is not your "truth".
Surprisingly you remain "quiet" when actual photos of Russian equipment and Russian army documents are displayed but then again you would state they are Ukrainian "fakes"---right mirhond?
By not responding makes it easier for me to post actual Russian documents, Russian photos and Russian passports to indicate your falsehoods without you making false statements and posting totally unrelated photos to divert from the truth.
No need to respond as I will keep posting the other side of the story that you do not like to hear.
Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-21-2014 at 02:14 PM.
so mirhond the over 289 wooden caskets containing dead Russians being transferred at night into Russia so no one an see the caskets is what a "victory" ----- come on mirhond at least admit the Russian mercenaries at taking loses from none professional contract soldiers---they seem to be shooting straighter than the Russian mercenaries are these days.
That would not be a falsehood so just maybe "the Ukrainian fascists" you always rant about are better that you are willing to admit?
Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-21-2014 at 02:16 PM.
Maybe we can get mirhond to comment on the firefight yesterday between the Ukrainian Border Security Forces in the evening who first protected the civilians who were crossing and then under heavy fire moved to the Russian side of the border and together with Russian Border Security fired back on the Russian mercenaries.
Now mirhond---- that is really a strange turn of events-- Ukrainians and Russians firing back at what Ukrainian "separatists, federationists or outright Russian fascist mercenaries".
AND mirhond what was so "important" for the Russian mercenaries to risk a major firefight with two Border Security Services? ---- seems they were attempting to move something "out" of the Ukraine and "into" Russia---must have been more dead Russians that no on is suppose to see?
http://inforesist.org/en/militants-a...-were-wounded/
mirhond---you do not need to reply--here is another set of Russian passports from a Russian mercenary hired by the FSB to kill Ukrainian military for a fee.
SBU has a video of his statements --but again you do not need to watch it as they are "fakes" in your world.
Out of 90 foreign mercenaries recently captured 13 were Russians including FSB and GRU officers.
But in your world mirhond the SBU are all Ukrainian "fascists" using again your own words.
http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukra...eo-352834.html
mirhond---appears that not all the eastern Ukrainians "want" to be "liberated" by the Russian mercenaries.
http://inforesist.org/en/terrorists-...onetsk-region/
mirhond--falsehood or fact---appears Russian military has military vehicles and Russian solider wearing Ukrainian military insignias "inside" Russian territoty---how can that be?
Russia has accumulated tanks with Ukrainian identifying insignia on the border with Ukraine, possibly for provocations, the spokesman for the information center of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine (NSDC), Volodymyr Chepovy, has said.
"Military hardware, including tanks with Ukrainian identifying insignia, as well as servicemen dressed in Ukrainian Armed Forces uniforms, were seen in the Russian Federation near the village of Millerovo, Kuibyshev district, Rostov region," he said at a briefing on Saturday.
He said that this could be aimed at "committing provocations in Ukraine or even in Russia."
Putin is playing nice game!
http://euobserver.com/foreign/124706BRUSSELS - EU countries have threatened to impose more sanctions on Russia if it does not help to stop violence in the run-up to the Ukraine treaty signature on Friday (27 June).
Foreign ministers in Luxembourg on Monday endorsed Ukraine’s unilateral ceasefire and urged Russia to “adopt effective measures to stop the continued flow of illegal fighters, arms and equipment over the border into Ukraine, [and] to use its influence on the separatists to stop the violence and lay down their arms”.
Like coincidence Ukrainian and Russian exported rebels decided to start negotiations that continue till the day of meeting of EU leaders
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/...07b_story.htmlKIEV, Ukraine — Pro-Russian separatists in eastern Ukraine agreed Monday to a four-day cease-fire and to further negotiations with the government, a move that could help quell a conflict that has paralyzed the nation and defer further E.U. and U.S. sanctions against Russia.
I think that we can say already today, that EU leaders decide that situation has been deescalated and there will be no next level sanctions.
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