Matters Blackwater (Merged thread)

[goesh]

- another book in the making either way -

[Uboat509]

So, according to this article Blackwater has committed virtually every possible heinous crime known to include, apparently child prostitution (no regicide yet but give it time). Additionally, apparently Prince has been running the organization like a weird "crusader" mafia like army, wherein informants and random Muslims are routinely murdered. All of this has been going on essentially under the DOS's nose for years but we just now found out about it. Riiiiight.

This thing reads like movie written by Michael Moore and directed by Oliver Stone. They tried so hard to pack so much evil in there that it is almost laughable. I don't doubt that there has been wrong doing by Blackwater in Iraq and elsewhere, but I am not prepared to give Blackwater or Erik Prince enough credit for competence to have engaged in this kind of high level conspiracy. Most of the guys I know who have worked for the various PMCs tell me the same thing. Competent operators avoid Blackwater like the plague. Prince got greedy and took on more contracts than he had competent operators to fill. In order to meet his obligations he started hiring almost anyone. The competent guys don't want to deploy with these guys so they start to find other employment so Blackwater has to hire more of the lower quality operators and so on. I would be inclined to believe that whatever wrongdoing has been committed by Blackwater members has more to do with the policy of hiring guys who probably shouldn't be allowed access to sharp objects much less guns than it has to do with a "crusader" conspiracy.

SFC W

[William F. Owen]

I don't doubt that there has been wrong doing by Blackwater in Iraq and elsewhere, but I am not prepared to give Blackwater or Erik Prince enough credit for competence to have engaged in this kind of high level conspiracy. Most of the guys I know who have worked for the various PMCs tell me the same thing. Competent operators avoid Blackwater like the plague. Prince got greedy and took on more contracts than he had competent operators to fill. In order to meet his obligations he started hiring almost anyone.

Concur. 2 years hanging out in certain bars Bangkok, I met more than a few PMCs contractors, and "Blackwater" were bottom of the Sh*t list, as concerns competence. Horror stories abound, but how many were true, I don't know.

[bourbon]

Courtesy of Cryptome, in PDF:

August 3rd, 2009 - Plaintiffs’ Opposition to Motion to Dismiss

July 29th, 2009 - Declaration of John Doe No. 2

July 27th, 2009 - Declaration of John Doe No. 1

[jmm99]

especially your last links to the original court pleadings. IIRC, Blackwater's responsive reply is due 17 Aug.

Let's all keep in mind that this case is a private civil case, where the standard of "rigour" (we might say) can be much lower than that in a Federal criminal prosecution. While one side of this case has Blackwater personnel emerging out from under their rocks, that cuts both ways. That is, the affidavits are from Blackwater personnel - are they also emerging out from under their rocks ?

The flavor of this case comes to the fore in the first paragraph of the Plaintiff's Opposition:

Plaintiffs respectfully request that this Court deny Defendants’ Motions To Dismiss and permit Plaintiffs’ claims to proceed to discovery and trial. Defendants mislead the Court by portraying Plaintiffs as challenging the State Department’s policies. As explained below, nothing could be further from the truth. Plaintiffs are challenging Mr. Prince’s callous scheme to kill, repeatedly, innocent Iraqis. This scheme was implemented without the knowledge or consent of the State Department. This scheme was motivated by Mr. Prince’s greed and his racist Christian supremacist views. Mr. Prince and his Blackwater companies deceived the State Department, and destroyed evidence that might have led to the detection of the scheme. Mr. Prince’s actions, and those of his alter ego companies, should not evade judicial review. No statutory or decisional law supports Mr. Prince’s claim that he is immune from the rule of law.

It is one thing to allege it; it is quite another thing to prove it.

Just something to keep in mind.

PS: See pp.92-124 of the Opposition for a good example of how to prove foreign law (in this case, Iraqi law). In the usual case involving domestic laws (Federal or state), the judge simply takes judicial notice of the applicable laws. Where foreign law is concerned, it technically has to be proved by a foreign law expert (sometimes the parties simply agree to handle it like domestic laws). So, Blackwater could come back with its own Iraqi law experts; and so on. The court could, if it wished, appoint its own Iraqi law experts. Just a point of in-courtroom legal trivia, for true devotees.

[IntelTrooper]

Most of the accusations seem pretty vague and unprovable. I'm interested in hearing more from former CFO Roy Mettinger, though.

[Dayuhan]

Blackwater IS the Templars. The Vatican is secretly in charge; they formed Blackwater and sent them to Iraq to get rid of Muslims and recover a mysterious relic with infinite power. The CIA is involved,and oil companies, and aliens, and Elvis. Blind affidavit #1 was filed by a gorgeous chick, and when the Templars come to silence her she will be rescued by the guy who filed blind affidavit #2, a manly man with perfect hair and lots of liposuction, who has a gun that shoots 437 rounds without reloading and knows kung-fu and ninjutsu. In 120 minutes they will save the day, recover the relic, kill the sinister corporate stooge at the core of the conspiracy, discover cold fusion, save the whales and the ozone layer, and we will all live happily ever after.

If you don't believe me, wait for the trailer... coming soon to a cinema near you!

[sandbag]

My experiences with Blackwater have not been good. They really took on way too much work, and now hire just about anyone that can make their OIF rotation at Victory as a spoon sound sexy on a CV. If you see them downrange, run the other way, but not for any cool or sexy reasons.

Concur. 2 years hanging out in certain bars Bangkok, I met more than a few PMCs contractors, and "Blackwater" were bottom of the Sh*t list, as concerns competence. Horror stories abound, but how many were true, I don't know.

[SWJED]

- another book in the making either way -

You’re kidding - more like a "reality show" on an island or a remote track of NC countryside - this time the word survivor will take a whole new meaning.

[bourbon]

Explosive Allegations: Blackwater Founder Implicated in Murder, by Jeremy Scahill, The Nation. Posted August 4, 2009.

Doe #2 states: "Using his various companies, [Prince] procured and distributed various weapons, including unlawful weapons such as sawed off semi-automatic machine guns with silencers, through unlawful channels of distribution." Blackwater "was not abiding by the terms of the contract with the State Department and was deceiving the State Department," according to Doe #1.

Gotta get me one of them.