Military Strategies

[SWJED]

Global Security - M113 Gavin vs. Stryker...

[GorTex6]

Although a 14.5mm armor design was developed for the M113s, the armor was never produced and fielded.

But of course, this would be disasterous for Stryker contracts and all the subcontracts that are needed to build and support it.

The Army’s center of gravity is the resource process.

It sure is....

[DDilegge]

As this is a Small Wars forum and that is our future - a couple of notes to remember - to ensure this thread does not become a "Gavin" vs. Stryker debate.

First, and foremost, the bread and butter of successful Small Wars, to include COIN, are dismounted infantry supported by combined arms and all the elements of interagency operations... Whether the "other agencies” are no-shows or not – the inherent tasks are still in the need to do category.

Second, when considering the type of vehicle most suited for these types of operations, there are several considerations…

1) Influence ops are essential – tracked combat vehicles in this setting do little, if nothing to win hearts and minds.

2) Winning hearts and minds – as well as destroying the enemy - are essentially urban operations – building a road or repairing a bridge one day is of little use should a tracked vehicle tear it up the next.

And two notes on the continuing links to General Butler’s War is a Racket by GT-6 and various "moonbat" webpages…

1) General Smedley Darlington Butler was an active duty hero – and an extremist in retirement. While some of his 1930’s diatribes were based on truth at that time – had his rants to members of veteran, Communist and pacifist groups been taken to heart – we would have lost World War II. Moreover, to take his “War is a Racket” book and simply plop it down as gospel for our post 9/11 operating environment is ludicrous. The anti-American crowd love War is a Racket because it supports their America is Evil Racket.

2) If you desire to link or otherwise quote Pre-WW II era Marines I would suggest LtCol Pete Ellis as a start...

[GorTex6]

The very same time Gen Shinseki introduced the Stryker brigade concept at the AUSA convention, he also very cunningly announced the change of official army headgear to a black beret. Masking the plan with contraversey, the army was about to forgoe drastic changes of its force structure yet everyone was more concerned with a stupid peice of wool- made in China.

I will always be weary of the Stryker.

had his rants to members of veteran, Communist and pacifist groups been taken to heart – we would have lost World War II.

It depends on how you interpret it. Didn't WWII break us out of the great depression? Wasn't WWII fought over oil? ie Hitler pursuing the Baku to fuel his empire, and Japan bombing Pearl Harbor in retrobution for oil embargo and to protect their flank in pursuit of oil in the east Indies? Think of all the affluency that resulted from war- the baby boom.

[DDilegge]

The so-called anti-war coalition are the wolves. These anti-war front organizations for the World Workers Party and other anti-U.S. groups are hardly against war - and love dragging out Butler's remarks at the drop of a hat... If a shoe fits, I say wear it.

[Merv Benson]

Antiwar activist are not pacifist. If they were they would be carrying signs condemning the enemy too. They just want the US not to engage in war period and if it does they want the US to lose. There opposition is to the use of force by the US under any circumstances.

Smedly Butler should be appreciated for what he did while he was in the USMC and ignored for what he tried to do after he left. He was pretty good at fighting small wars, but not very good at thinking large after he retired.

[DDilegge]

... Shinseki introduced the Stryker brigade concept at the AUSA convention, he also very cunningly announced the change of official army headgear to a black beret. Masking the plan with contraversey...

I will always be weary of the Stryker.

It depends on how you interpret it. Didn't WWII break us out of the great depression? Wasn't WWII fought over oil? ie Hitler pursuing the Baku to fuel his empire, and Japan bombing Pearl Harbor in retrobution for oil embargo and to protect their flank in pursuit of oil in the east Indies? Think of all the affluency that resulted from war- the baby boom.

Yep and we never landed on the moon either.

On edit:

A conspiracy theory attempts to explain the cause of an event as a secret, and often deceptive, plot by a covert alliance rather than as an overt activity or as natural occurrence.

The term "conspiracy theory" is used by scholars and in popular culture to identify a type of folklore similar to an urban legend, having certain regular features, especially an explanatory narrative which is constructed with certain naive methodological flaws. The term is also used pejoratively to dismiss allegedly misconceived, paranoid or outlandish rumors.

Most people who have their theory or speculation labeled a "conspiracy theory" reject the term as prejudicial.

[slapout9]

The current edition of Joint Force Quarterly has a good article about some of the draw backs to EBO. It was written by a professor from the Naval War College. Makes some very good points.

[SWJED]

The current edition of Joint Force Quarterly has a good article about some of the draw backs to EBO. It was written by a professor from the Naval War College. Makes some very good points.

Issue 41 of the Joint Force Quarterly - Effects-Based Operations: A Critique by Milan Vigo.