Results 1 to 20 of 31

Thread: "Tarnished Brass" (new article by Dick Kohn)

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Council Member AmericanPride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    "Turn left at Greenland." - Ringo Starr
    Posts
    965

    Default

    I think a greater concern is if the military is being used for domestic gain by political factions at home, and if so, how that influences military decision-makers, the reputation and effectiveness of the armed forces, and the public perception of servicemembers. There are other questions: where does politics end, and where does it begin? The defense budget is a major political issue -- so where does that put the obligations of military officers? Are National Guard officers to be treated differently (as far as this issue is concerned) than Regular Army? What effect, if any, does the internet and other free media have on the 'politicalization' of the officer corps? Is the military's role in strategy different than its role in policy? Has there been an encroachment of civilian authority into traditionally military spheres (i.e. strategy)? And is there any relevance to the absence of an overwhelming moral cause of purpose (i.e. Pearl Harbor, 9/11, Lusitania, USS Maine, etc) for the Iraq War (and some could argue the Afghanistan war, also) that may contribute to this dispute?

    I'm curious how other democratic countries handle this issue, if it is an issue at all. I'm also curious the extent the general academic narrative and the military's own narrative align with the historical record, which raises all kinds of questions about real and perceived American traditions.

    EDIT: Also, to which is the greater moral obligation: obedience to (civil) authority (loyalty/duty) or one's sense of goodness (integrity/personal courage)? Is this question compounded by the belief that soldiers are citizens first?
    Last edited by AmericanPride; 05-08-2009 at 11:51 AM.
    When I am weaker than you, I ask you for freedom because that is according to your principles; when I am stronger than you, I take away your freedom because that is according to my principles. - Louis Veuillot

  2. #2
    Council Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    4,021

    Default Nor, do I, Niel ...

    from Cav
    I don't see officers voting as the downfall of the profession, or retired officers voicing opinions as a threat to the republic.
    nor do I.

    As to the third part of Kohn's article, starting here:

    Related to these strategic and political failures are possible moral deficiencies among the officer corps, which have arisen in the last few years.
    I simply do not see it based on what I see here; and among the actives and retireds who inhabit my little world.

    When I compare the "moral deficiencies" of similar management and leadership classes in the broader civilian world (including my own profession), there is no comparison.

    I do see problems with the civilian-military interface (which I perceive to be the focus of Kohn's 1st two points - strategy and politics). We have to communicate better - something about hanging together, or hanging separately.

  3. #3
    Council Member Mark O'Neill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Canberra, Australia
    Posts
    307

    Default An Antipodian perspective is

    that this the article is 100% USA centric. That said, based on my knowledge and experience of the US mil , it is also nearly 100% assertion and prejudice. I think Niel and Van nailed apt responses,

    Cheers

    Mark
    Last edited by Mark O'Neill; 05-08-2009 at 12:33 PM. Reason: typo

  4. #4
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    223

    Default And the history is wrong too

    To posit a decline one has to either assume or demonstrate that things were somehow better in the past. If Kohn believes that there was some golden moment when the officer corps (as a whole) was:

    1. Apolitical
    2. Intellectual
    3. Not prone to micromanagement
    4. A moral exemplar
    5. Capable of seamlessly integrating tactics, operations, and strategy

    I wish he would point it out.

  5. #5
    Council Member AmericanPride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    "Turn left at Greenland." - Ringo Starr
    Posts
    965

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eden
    To posit a decline one has to either assume or demonstrate that things were somehow better in the past.
    The greatest measurement for the effectiveness of the military instrument is whether it wins its nation's wars. So the military may or may not have been more apolitical, intellectual, macro-managed, moral, and capable in the past, but that does not mean that the condition of those things have not contributed to a posited decline in American warfighting power. If it is true that the military now lacks a fundamental understanding of strategy, for example, it should reveal itself in American wars where even if battlefield victory was attained, the political objectives sought were not secured.
    When I am weaker than you, I ask you for freedom because that is according to your principles; when I am stronger than you, I take away your freedom because that is according to my principles. - Louis Veuillot

  6. #6
    Moderator Steve Blair's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Montana
    Posts
    3,195

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eden View Post
    To posit a decline one has to either assume or demonstrate that things were somehow better in the past. If Kohn believes that there was some golden moment when the officer corps (as a whole) was:

    1. Apolitical
    2. Intellectual
    3. Not prone to micromanagement
    4. A moral exemplar
    5. Capable of seamlessly integrating tactics, operations, and strategy

    I wish he would point it out.
    He did fail there, although I suspect it's partly due to the nature of the article and (possibly) limits set by the journal.

    It's been my read that the officer corps has never actually hit the "perfect" state in all of the above areas, although they have been more capable in some areas than others at various times in the past. In many cases the corps was apolitical only because they couldn't actually vote (due more to a lack of absentee voting mechanisms or postings in territories where no one could vote in national elections), but the level of internal politics and willingness to use political connections to gain desired postings was always high (especially in the days when there was a clear separation between the Line and the Staff...). As for moral exemplar...obviously one would have to ignore a great deal of stuff to make that claim. Like any other group, some come closer than others to the ideal.

    There was a time when micromanagement was limited, but that was more due to widely dispersed units and a lack of rapid communication systems (and one could also contend that it was before the rise of "business school methods" in the post-World War II Army). Some commanders tried to micromanage, but the results were usually sub-par (imagine that...). I still think that in many ways our personnel system aggravates the flaws that might exist.

    As an aside, it's kind of interesting to see the reaction to stereotyping and such when with a few word changes Kohn's comments could be quite similar to some of the rants against academics we've seen on this board. (just an observation...)
    "On the plains and mountains of the American West, the United States Army had once learned everything there was to learn about hit-and-run tactics and guerrilla warfare."
    T.R. Fehrenbach This Kind of War

  7. #7
    Council Member wm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    On the Lunatic Fringe
    Posts
    1,237

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eden View Post
    To posit a decline one has to either assume or demonstrate that things were somehow better in the past. If Kohn believes that there was some golden moment when the officer corps (as a whole) was:

    1. Apolitical
    2. Intellectual
    3. Not prone to micromanagement
    4. A moral exemplar
    5. Capable of seamlessly integrating tactics, operations, and strategy

    I wish he would point it out.
    He did in a rather left-handed way with his comments about the military that won World War II. Reading his piece somewhat reminded me of reading Vegetius, who spends a lot of his verbage extolling the virtues of the Republican-era Roman legionnaires (who probably never really existed), or Tactitus' discussion in either his Germannia or Agricola, 2 examples of panegyric with significant hidden agendas.

    The more things change, the more they stay the same.
    Vir prudens non contra ventum mingit
    The greatest educational dogma is also its greatest fallacy: the belief that what must be learned can necessarily be taught. — Sydney J. Harris

  8. #8
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Rocky Mtn Empire
    Posts
    473

    Default

    Micromanagement waxes and wanes, as I'm sure Ken and Tom can attest to. We used to refer to higher ranking micromanagers as "Squadleader 6". There are tales from Vietnam of multiple command and control helicopters stacking up over a single firefight in order to "help" the engaged unit. As a young officer, my favorite "get off my back" technique was to answer a radio call from higher with some garbled throat sounds, then turn off the radio.

    I ain't buyin' the political thing either. I served as an apolitical, but voting officer. You think I'm not going to vote for someone who is going to define my life for the next four years? Maybe send me off to a BS war somewhere? On a coupla different occasions I have worked with foreign armies where bennies as low as battalion command were handed out by party. Trust me, we are not a political military.

  9. #9
    Council Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Rancho La Espada, Blanchard, OK
    Posts
    1,065

    Default Some random comments

    Apolitical military in the mythical past: GEN winfield Scott, while on active duty, ran for POTUS as a Whig in 1852. MG George B. McClellan was actively opposing his commander-in-chief, A. Lincoln while in command of the Army of the Potomac and ran for Pres in 1864 (after he'd been fired).
    Do we give up our rights as US citizens because we put on the uniform? some yes but mainly no. there is also a difference between the active and reserve components. Sen Lindsay Graham is a USAFR Colonel. there are still a few states that elect their Adjutant Generals and a significant number where the position is a purely political appointment. Note that a RC officer writing for publication does not have to get a security review of what he writes before it is published if he is (1) not on active duty and (2) not required to do so because of his civilian DOD (or OGA) job.
    Strategy: I know one of the AWC faculty members quoted by Kohn here. But his complaint was based not on the issue of national strategy but rather on the strategies that officers produce by law and policy. Remember that the Goldwater-Nichols Act charged the CJCS to produce the National Military Strategy. Every unified command is required to produce its strategy by policy. Unless officers at the war colleges are required to learn to do strategy, how can they meet their legal obligations. (BTW I ran the SOUTHCOM Policy & Strategy shop in 1988 and 89 and was resposible for GEN Woerner's last strategy as well as GEN Thurman's.) In addition, the process of developing the National Security Strategy (NSS) - called for in the GNA - and the Defense Strategy (instituted by SECDEF Rumsfeld) requires military input.

    Cheers

    JohnT

Similar Threads

  1. Colin Gray's New Article in SSQ
    By Gian P Gentile in forum Catch-All, Military Art & Science
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 12-16-2007, 05:43 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •