McKiernan replaced

[IntelTrooper]

If it is "to kill AQ and Taliban leadership", then LGEN McCrystal is the man for the job. Having worked in direct support of him in Iraq, he understands how to hunt and capture/kill. The cost of the "to kill" strategy is we will never declare victory. Does the US have LOO's other than "capture/kill"? Is it possible to effectively execute those LOOs given the disparate and often chaotic command structure that is Afghanistan?

Very good points. Based on my observations, Afghanistan needs someone who will authorize security forces to be aggressive in order to make up for all the territory that has been lost to the TB due to excessive hand-wringing and tip-toeing around hard issues. Granted, success requires a kind of quantum state where security forces are doing their job and construction efforts are taking the lead in interacting with the populace, but so far there has been a severe imbalance with far too little follow-up and oversight of construction efforts. You can't just throw money at a project in hostile territory and expect the right things to be done (which has been the approach so far).

[Ken White]

Very good points... You can't just throw money at a project in hostile territory and expect the right things to be done (which has been the approach so far).

you, wm and helogrunt.

McCrystal is a sharp guy but so was McKiernan. Both IMO are not ideal for the jop; the former has a heavy DA background and while some of that is needed I believe we're close to overdoing it, or more accurately not doing it right because we have people who should not be doing it involved and do not have some who should be involved...

McKiernan is a Mech guy, COIN just wasn't his strong point and, seems to me, he was too nice a guy. Should've cracked a couple of heads and did not.

More important than Afghanistan is the fact the Robert Gates has probably put his mark on the US Army for the next decade. I suspect that, more than 'winning' * in Afghanistan was his intent. Casey to be replaced by Petreaus to be replaced by McKiernan with Odierno and Rodriguez as wild cards... Fun time in River City.

* I will forego my usual rant about the fact that one cannot win a COIN fight or FID effort.

[jmm99]

OK, no win in COIN (usual case: HN has a domestic violent non-state actor problem with possible transnational input(s)) or in FID (another nation assists HN in first situation). Think I got that - and generally agree as to the "acceptable outcome" philosophy.

But helogrunt raised another context:

If it is "to kill AQ and Taliban leadership", then LGEN McCrystal is the man for the job. Having worked in direct support of him in Iraq, he understands how to hunt and capture/kill. The cost of the "to kill" strategy is we will never declare victory.

Assuming the target list is finite, and if all on list are killed, captured or converted (Turki's turkey), then there is victory as to that list.

Yup, new leaders will pop up, etc. - and then you have to decide whether to play whack a mole with them. Maybe there would insufficient reason to go after them - as opposed to the guys who murdered 1000s of us.