Gunmen attack Fort Hood, Texas

[Boondoggle]

Questions I have after reflecting for a day:

1. His Chain of Command. Why was he being forced to deploy when (already in hindsight) their were numerous signals he was unfit, and a danger to other troops? It flows into the larger issue of the stress placed upon the services, particulary the USMC and Army, to provide the forces necessary for two wars, plus our other ongoing responsibilities. While I've seen this occur with rifle units, where Marines on the edge, who really shouldn't go back, do because there is no magic "Dr's note" and the units are under stress to find the bodies to flesh out their numbers. Haven't seen/heard it as much as a few years ago. But few realize it spreads beyond just the grunts. Two years ago, a Navy psychiatrist gave me the percentage of doctors the Navy was short in his profession. I don't want to quote the percentage because I can't recall the exact number, but it was shockingly, shockingly low. They did not have the bodies to offer the necessary services. Whether the Army psychiatry corps was similiary understaffed, and whether that caused them to cut corners and force this person to deploy when he should have been seperated from service is a question that needs to be asked.

2. Was this jihadist/religious/political statement, a result of the mental trauma from working with (it appears, but not confirmed by any means) numbers of troops with PTSD, another mental condition, or a combination of these factors? I've seen first hand how draining it is, both mentally, morally and physically on the providers who help these soldiers, sailors and Marines. It is not a figment of imagination or "physcho babble" as some idiot JAG was referring to last night on Larry King. It's real. But whether that was a contributing factor should be of interest if no other reason than...

3. What will be his reply to whatever charges are brought in court (military or civilian TBD)? If he really has been working for an extensive period of time with PTSD troops, undoubtably he has heard some disturbing, highly disturbing stories. Would he seek to introduce evidence of this as some sort of mental capacity defense or as mitigation at any sentencing. Beyond the legal questions of his doctor/client relationship, what if he uses a trial to turn the "issue" somehow to the conduct of our troops during the war?

So early, but this could turn a truely awful event and drag it through all kinds of worse. I hope not.

[Schmedlap]

My only confusion on this issue is why it has prompted discussion of suicide, PTSD, and stress on our military.

From what I've gathered, this is a guy who never deployed and then went on a murderous rampage.

At least I haven't heard anyone blame Bush or the NRA... yet.

[slapout9]

It is not PTSD.....it is his Belief System. And that has nothing to do with Islam. Whenever a personal believes that violence is an acceptable solution to a problem..... an attack will occur unless the original motive is dealt with. That is why after all the backround work is done it will be obvious that an attack was coming but no one did anything.....most organizations never deal with the Original Motive For War as CvC would say......that was for you Wilf

[jmm99]

but as to this:

from Slap
And that has nothing to do with Islam.

"nothing to do with Islam" is not something we should assume. See above post by omarali50[*], which is excellent.

The simplest explanation is that the man was quite sane, spent time and meditation in developing the concept of defensive jihad (preventing non-Muslim troops from setting foot in Muslim lands) ala the extreme Salafists (e.g., AQ), and put that developed concept into practice.

Some (many ?) will not be able to handle that explanation if it turns out to be so. It would be a case of absolute betrayal by a field grade officer - treason in a very real sense even though he is unlikely to be charged with that.

An easier explanation for many to handle is the nutjob who snapped. Boondoggle (nice to see a post from you, ancient JA ) is not endorsing that, but he does explain how that explanation could be developed.

I am waiting for the CID and FBI folks to complete their investigation - and I expect we will also have tons of media investigation and the inevitable punditry.

-------------------------
[*] Nicely paragraphed. Now if you would put a space between the paragraphs, they would even be kinder on my old eyes.

[slapout9]

The simplest explanation is that the man was quite sane, spent time and meditation in developing the concept of defensive jihad (preventing non-Muslim troops from setting foot in Muslim lands) ala the extreme Salafists (e.g., AQ), and put that developed concept into practice.

1-Islam as a religion had nothing to do with it......as a belief system to justify his actions had a lot to do with it. See the difference?

[SWJED]

Hasan’s Officer Record Brief was posted at This ain't hell, but you can see it from here.

[slapout9]

Hasan’s Officer Record Brief was posted at This ain't hell, but you can see it from here.

Under Religion it states no religious preferance.

[Schmedlap]

Hasan’s Officer Record Brief was posted at This ain't hell, but you can see it from here.

Can anyone's ORB be obtained and placed into the public domain legally (assuming the individual is in a coma and not in a position to give his approval)?

175 months of dwell time. Never seen that before.

[MikeF]

The simplest explanation is that the man was quite sane, spent time and meditation in developing the concept of defensive jihad (preventing non-Muslim troops from setting foot in Muslim lands) ala the extreme Salafists (e.g., AQ), and put that developed concept into practice.

Slap and JMM got me thinking. I was wrong on the irrational part. I'll update my initial thoughts, blend in their observations, and we can see how it pans out. Like JMM suggested, this theory may be hard for some to accept.


1. Actor was Rational.

2. Actor had perceived grievances, or motive, or emotions.

3. Actor justified his actions through rational thought, decision making, and in belief that means justified the ends.

Actor could be this clown at Ft. Hood or a suicide bomber in Iraq.

Mike

[slapout9]

The simplest explanation is this guy wanted out of the Army and he apparently had some legitimate claim to this, up to and including hiring an attorney to support his claim. When that failed and he was sent to Ft. Hood to be deployed somewhere......the path to murder became what he perceived as his only way to solve his problem. The 5 Rings of violence don't miss.

[Entropy]

Col. Patrick Lang has the best analysis I've seen yet.

It is sadly amusing how much people do not want this to be about the man's religion or his Palestinian ancestry.

His relatives understandably want other Americans to believe that he was traumatized by listening to soldiers' stories about the wars. They certainly don't want people to think that there was anything about the atmosphere in his father's house that caused this man to reject the land of his birth and the obligations of his oath.

The media flacks have now been conditioned into political correctness to such an extent that they can't bring themselves to suggest that his Islam or his sense of grievance about American wars in the Islamic World had anything to do with what he did.

Read the whole thing.

[slapout9]

Col. Patrick Lang has the best analysis I've seen yet.



Read the whole thing.

I did and did you see the part about wearing strange clothes and being caught on a surveillance camera.

[slapout9]

Actor could be this clown at Ft. Hood or a suicide bomber in Iraq.

Mike

Absolutely, their is little difference except for the location.

[Schmedlap]

Slap and JMM got me thinking. I was wrong on the irrational part.

I think state of mind and intent will be the big issues. How those are defined will be determined by what jurisdiction he is tried in, assuming he emerges from his coma.

[MikeF]

Don't ever mess with girls from Carolina with guns. You'll lose. Hopefully, she'll recover from her wounds soon. My mom told me that Hoggard High School is recognizing her tonight at the varsity football game.

Officer who shot suspect is a firearms expert

The police officer who brought down a gunman after he went on a shooting rampage at the Fort Hood Army base was on the way to have her car repaired when she heard a report over a police radio that someone was shooting people in a center where soldiers are processed before they are deployed abroad, authorities said on Friday.

As she pulled up to the center, the officer, Kimberly Munley, spotted the gunman, Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan, brandishing a pistol and chasing a wounded soldier outside the building, said Chuck Medley, the director of emergency services at the base.

Sergeant Munley bolted from her car and shot at Major Hasan. He turned toward her and began to fire. She ran toward him, continuing to fire, and both she and the gunmen went down with several bullet wounds, Mr. Medley said...

Sergeant Munley comes from North Carolina, where her father owns a hardware store in Carolina Beach and is a former mayor. She attended Hoggard County High School.

[Rank amateur]

At least I haven't heard anyone blame Bush or the NRA... yet.

Ask and yea shall receive.

Seriously, I think he "switched sides." I think he felt - and I'm just talking about his thoughts in his mind, not saying I or anyone else agree with them - that he believed he had to choose between his religion and his country. A choice he tried to avoid by getting out of the Army, and by asking not to be deployed.

Based on some of the articles I've read, it appears as though he used to go to the Mosque in his uniform. Then he switched to wearing what for lack of the correct term I'll call "Islamic attire" around the base. A clear statement on his part.

(I could be wrong. I haven't heard much about his victims. Might change my mind if it turns out he went after people who he personally had trouble with as opposed to soldiers about to deploy.)

Anyway, that's why I always thought "You're for us or against us" was a dumb idea. "Don't kill us and we won't kill you" seems like a much better message. Keep the people who don't like us or BinLaden on the sidelines. There's enough of us already. Even one more of them is too many.