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#621 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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The anti Rwanda sentiment exist, it would be stupid and foolish to ignore it. I believe, as I said previously, that internal problems are at least 50% of the issue. But that said, it is also clear that Tutsi/Rwandophone community in DRC and Rwanda did prepare something. Among M23 revendications there are: - better ranks in FARDC for exCNDP, - better pay, - priviledged treatment, - not being deployed out of the Kivu, All this was partly done by Kinshasa. Therefore you cannot avoid the feeling that there is something else behind. And since DRC/Rwanda 2009 agreement are secret, this opens the door to any crazy theory. In addition, the proof of recruitment in Rwanda by M23 or Bosco are quite strong and difficult to put asside. (It is not only HRW and UN who have such testimonies and other proof). Personaly, I do not see the benefit for Rwanda in starting another rebellion in DRC. Facking a rebellion to put Bosco Ntaganda aside would have make sens. Now it just looks like Rwanda is trying to solve its internal problems (overpopulation, food production, energy...) by inflaming the Kivu. Especially since refugees returns from Rwanda started to create problems in DRC. I think that UN should have a stronger mandate and especially a stronger obligation to implement their mandate in terms o PoC and political dialog. If FARDC infiltration by Rwanda through CNDP has been/is an issue; MONUSCO infiltration by Kabila is also an issue. Both do not help in solving the crisis. Hope this answered you question. Sincerely M-A |
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#622 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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#623 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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but you can't fool all the people all the time
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#624 | |||
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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Quote:
More surprisingly: a member of the UNSC is preventing the DRC Group of Experts to publish their mid term report with all the details on Rwanda backing up M23. Quote:
Quote:
Let say that after asking for a serious enquiery, some may have changed their mind... Strange that it leaks through 2 US citizen DRC rexearchers/blogers. Does that mean that US are not the only one trying to save Kagame? |
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#625 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 6,115
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Marc,
In answer to your question: Quote:
Amongst the other non-permanent UNSC members today I cannot see one that would do such a thing? Although South Africa can follow a strange policy at times. The members are on:http://www.un.org/sc/members.asp
__________________
davidbfpo |
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#626 | ||
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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A difficult question to answer to. First of all, please find below a communication from HRW calling to not defend Rwanda.
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I think that HRW resumes very well the situation: Rwanda will be a UNSC non permanent member next year. For many permanent members (at least 2), this means more leverage in the extended UNSC. This tends to go in the direction given by David on why are there some difficulties in publishing the proof of Rwanda support to M23. On the other end, DRC gov has been conducting a strong diplomatic offensive in Uganda, Tanzania, Burundi and Angola. An offensive to which Angola responded positively, ensuring DRC of its support and SADC sympathy. This means that South Africa, Zimbabwe and Angola are, until they do something different, on DRC side. (Many articles in French can be found. I just add a link to one: http://www.mediacongo.net/show.asp?doc=20667) The situation is quite tense in the sub region because we could end in a regional war in Africa, Central Africa against Southern Africa, on Congo soil. Therefore lights need to be brought on allegations of Rwanda support to M23 (Rwandese have been made prisonners or surrendered). Hopefully, discussions started as Rwanda foreign affairs minister is in Kinshasa. And to finish and to illustrate why war criminal in DRC have to be turned to ICC, please find a link to Prosecutor address at Lubanga trial. Just to remind who people like Bosco Ntaganda are (Bosco Ntaganda was under Lubanga orders in Ituri and he is wanted for similar crimes). Quote:
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#627 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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From Enough:
Quote:
DRC government just addressed a letter to UNSC to ask the UN to come and play an active role in preventing the situation to go amok. Not really the best news in such context. |
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#628 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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Quote:
In addition, additional exCNDP has left FARDC to join M23. Was not smelling good but starts to smell really bad at this stage. Especially when Lambert Mende, the DRC gov speaker, says that they are not in a logic of war but in a logic of broken peace.
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#629 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 799
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Perhaps I'm unfair, but 1. and 2. (from post #627) appear to be feel-good happy talk. However, point 3. would go a long way toward reducing the violence - after the violence involved in "dismantling" subsides. But they have overlooked DRC promotion of violence against Tutsi in the Kivus, which leads to the formation of Tutsi militias, which prompts Rwandan support, which provokes formation of Hutu militias, et cetera ad nauseum.
A change in policy by the DRC is required, along with recognition that it will take the DRC a long time to build trust among the Tutsi that they can disband their militias without fear of slaughterer. It's a very tough sell.
__________________
John Wolfsberger, Jr. An unruffled person with some useful skills. |
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#630 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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John,
I agree with you on the inferno spiral of the Kivu. I am just not that sure who started the militia (Hutu, Hunde, Tutsi, Nande, Bashi ???). My points are: 1) there is a need of change of policy on both sides of the border, 2) there is a need of change of policy in US (backing Rwanda just does not work anymore), 3) there is a need for Kagame to clean his house if Rwanda is really not involved, 4) If Rwanda is involved and there are proofs then USA should help to solve rather than hide the issue. Situation is getting hot in North Kivu. There are many ways to solve this. Last edited by M-A Lagrange; 06-22-2012 at 12:14 PM. |
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#631 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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even if it hurts.
Here is a link to the DRC Group of Experts report. Unfortunately, the crucial annexes with proofs of Rwanda involvement have been removed. And it's USA who is guilty of it. I can understand why and how a delayed publication might help. But anyways, I also past a link to the join NGO call for publication. ![]() The report is difficult to access in its pdf format. Therefore, I encourrage to download it in WORD format. Here is the link: http://documents.un.org/mother.asp Symbol: S/2012/348 Quote:
In addition, DRC MPs have called for an increase of defense 2012 budget... To quote DRC speaker: "we are not at war with Rwanda but in a broken peace relationship." I do not know what that means but for me DRC is on the path of war and so is Rwanda. Nothing good will come out of this. |
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#632 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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Quote:
The addendum can be found at the following link: http://www.un.org/sc/committees/1533...2012/348/Add.1 All the ingredients of an invasion of DRC through proxies and exCNDP (Pro Rwanda) forces integrated in FARDC are here. The evidence are disturbing. 200 000 IDPs + 20 000 refugees for the momment. May be it is time to call for stronger sanctions than just saying: "you're naughty boy!". |
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#633 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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Quote:
Kinshasa and Kigali must talk. Let's push in that direction. |
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#634 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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Quote:
14 years is not much as Lubanga spent already 8 years in jail. So he'll be free in 6. But that's a strating point. |
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#635 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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#636 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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SATURDAY, JULY 21, 2012
US State Department's Statement on Rwanda Quote:
Spokesperson Bureau of African Affairs U.S. Department of State Last edited by davidbfpo; 07-21-2012 at 08:33 PM. Reason: Quote marks added |
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#637 | ||
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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Quote:
Washington is increasing pressure on Rwanda while in the field, military pressure is set by M23 on FARDC and MONUSCO: Early this morning, at 3am (local time), the M23 started an offensive against the FARDC in Rutshuru. Heavy fightings took place between M23 and FARDC who are supported by MONUSCO. MONUSCO, to enforce FARDC movement deployed 3 light infantry "tanks" in Rutshuru on 22 july 2012. At 15h00, after nearly 12 hours of fightings, combats in Rutshuru and Kiwanja have stopped but FARDC and M23 are still fightings in the surrounding areas. Yesterday, on 24 july 2012, M23 launched an offensive in the south of their position. MONUSCO used its airpower to stop them, 23 km far from Goma, the North Kivu capital. Quote:
To all my friends there: stay safe! |
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#638 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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While Rwanda through its foreign affairs is protesting, accusing western powers to treat african countries as children, hopefully, western powers do not listen:
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It's a wake-up call for Rwanda... to figure out a way to sustain our development without being subjected to bullying and pressure from donors said Louise Mushikiwabo Rwandan foreign minister Well, I believe it should be a wake up call for Rwanda... To figure out a way to sustain development without bullying and exploiting illegaly its neigbour ressources. |
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#639 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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joins the club of the naughty western children:
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#640 | ||
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: In Barsoom, as a fact!
Posts: 944
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Rwanda just published a response to the UN group of Experts report pointing Rwanda has the master mind of M23 mutiny:
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The report from Rwanda government is accessible from that site. Among many questions rised by Rwanda, the main one is the final aim of Rwanda support to M23. Here is a response from Herman Cohen, the US diplomat, who cannot be accused to be against Kigali. Quote:
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