What gets me is how the same Democrats who critisize bush for his lack of coalition building and resistance to reach out to Syria and Iraq, are now willfully going down the path to rid ourselves of one of our most important allies in the region.
What gets me is how the same Democrats who critisize bush for his lack of coalition building and resistance to reach out to Syria and Iraq, are now willfully going down the path to rid ourselves of one of our most important allies in the region.
Of note: Divided They Conquer: The Success of Armenian Ethnic Lobbies in the U.S. - Heather Gregg, MIT Center for International Studies, 2002.
CSIS, 15 Oct 07: The Armenian Genocide Bill and the Turkish Reaction in Iraq
Tragic as the fate of the Armenians may have been in the aftermath of World War I, the fact remains that the issue is more than half a century old. Turkish-Armenian conciliation might serve an important purpose, as might any effort to reconcile Armenians, Turks, and Azerbaijanis. The dead, however, are not grateful, and stirring up new sources of ethnic and sectarian tension are the last thing the region needs.
This is particularly true when the end result is to create problems for the living. Pushing Turkey to be more hostile to Armenia is scarcely a useful goal, but Iraq and the Kurds are affected as well – along with vital US interests. As a result, the net impact of the Armenian genocide bill may well be to create yet another pointless regional source of anger against the US – this time coming from the Congress instead of the Administration.....
They're Not Real Bright, But They Do Catch On Eventually....
Initially, I just assumed this was another move designed by Congress to stick it to the administration over Iraq. Typical DC politics - fun times in DeeCeeland.
But no, this looks to be a case of actually really, really clueless House leadership at work here. The Armenian-American lobby is really strong, and have a presence in a number of House districts, and honestly, they are good at doing the necessary political spadework.
Part of the history is that this particular issue has come up previously, and again and again, and in prior administrations. Bill Clinton got it killed during his administration before the House could do anything with it, and it's going to happen again with this administration.
The latest:
Link
It's interesting to see all the bodies running away from this one. There's going to be a whole lot of seriously pissed off congresscritters over this one, because there's more than a few of them who feel they got blindsided over this issue. They had no idea how this would escalate, how this would come across to the nation of Turkey (not just the government), and all the sudden, it's being presented as a "Supporting the Troops" issue.
The folks who were pushing this issue damaged their credibility because they didn't give the congresscritters the straight talk about any blowback. This does not reflect well on House leadership.
Good news is that in a week it will be over. Notice didn't say "Forgotten".
I find it hard to accept that members of Congress could be so clueless about international sensitivities as to get "blindsided" like this.Originally Posted by Watcher In The Middle
Maybe the "No Child Left Behind " program ought to focus some attention on senior lawmakers' education.
Bad news is that the damage has already been done. You are right it will not be forgotten, but those who won't forget are natioins whose support America needs now and in the future.
Why would this be surprising? This is an institution (the House) which Tom DeLay, a man whose Middle East policy prescriptions are largely dictated by the Left Behind series, ran for years. House Reps especially are elected primarily to focus on domestic issues. I don't know how anyone can be surprised at Congress' ignorance on the most basic issues, much less the nuances of Turkish nationalism and its response to Armenian-American grievances.I find it hard to accept that members of Congress could be so clueless about international sensitivities as to get "blindsided" like this.
This is not a Congressional problem --- it is, at base, an American problem.To his credit, Reyes, a kindly, thoughtful man who also sits on the Armed Service Committee, does see the undertows drawing the region into chaos.
For example, he knows that the 1,400- year-old split in Islam between Sunnis and Shiites not only fuels the militias and death squads in Iraq, it drives the competition for supremacy across the Middle East between Shiite Iran and Sunni Saudi Arabia.
That’s more than two key Republicans on the Intelligence Committee knew when I interviewed them last summer. Rep. Jo Ann Davis, R-Va., and Terry Everett, R-Ala., both back for another term, were flummoxed by such basic questions, as were several top counterterrorism officials at the FBI.
...
Al Qaeda is what, I asked, Sunni or Shia?
“Al Qaeda, they have both,” Reyes said. “You’re talking about predominately?”
“Sure,” I said, not knowing what else to say.
“Predominantly — probably Shiite,” he ventured.
...
And Hezbollah? I asked him. What are they?
“Hezbollah. Uh, Hezbollah...”
He laughed again, shifting in his seat.
“Why do you ask me these questions at five o’clock? Can I answer in Spanish? Do you speak Spanish?”
“Poquito,” I said—a little.
“Poquito?! “ He laughed again.
“Go ahead,” I said, talk to me about Sunnis and Shia in Spanish.
Reyes: “Well, I, uh....”
...
On the day in 2003 when Iraqi mobs toppled the statue of Saddam Hussein in Baghdad, Bush was said to be unaware of the possibility that a Sunni-Shia civil war could fill the power vacuum, according to a reliable source with good White House connections.
...
Trent Lott, the veteran Republican senator from Mississippi, said only last September that “It’s hard for Americans, all of us, including me, to understand what’s wrong with these people.”
“Why do they kill people of other religions because of religion?” wondered Lott, a member of the Senate Intelligence Committee, after a meeting with Bush.
“Why do they hate the Israelis and despise their right to exist? Why do they hate each other? Why do Sunnis kill Shiites? How do they tell the difference?
“They all look the same to me,” Lott said.
I wasn't expressing surprise. My comment was more a personal statement of my unhappiness that Congress seems to be populated by so many clueless individuals, which by BTW was how I started off this thread last week.
We are reaping the benefits of Jacksonian democracy.
I'm not surprised
I could walk outside this building and conduct a simple experiment. With a world map or globe, I would just ask passersby to point out the nation of Turkey and where generally Armenia is. I can't predict exactly how many could find one or both, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say about 20% for Turkey, and 1% for Armenia. These Congress Critters don't come from Mars, they come from here, you know. It wouldn't surprise me at all that few would even have a clue where Armenia is and what the circumstances in WWI were for the conflict between the Armenians and Turks.I find it hard to accept that members of Congress could be so clueless about international sensitivities as to get "blindsided" like this.
My own representative is not a man who has ruminated long and hard about world affairs. I have no idea how he is leaning on this, but his decision is most certainly not as a result of having a good knowledge of WWI in the Ottoman Empire. He got there by pledging to uphold the sanctity of marriage against an onslaught by Godless homosexuals, stressing his pro-life bona fides, commitment to tax cuts, opposition to socialized medicine, and dedication to victory--not "cutting and running.") That's it, boys. That's a fact.
I don't know if this is a fault of Jacksonian democracy or just basic ignorance of world history in our citizenry. Most don't know, and don't even want to know. It is just apathy.
Last edited by Tacitus; 10-17-2007 at 01:23 PM. Reason: can't type
No signature required, my handshake is good enough.
Don't be so optimistic.I could walk outside this building and conduct a simple experiment. With a world map or globe, I would just ask passersby to point out the nation of Turkey and where generally Armenia is. I can't predict exactly how many could find one or both, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say about 20% for Turkey, and 1% for Armenia.
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