My bad. Thanks for the suggestion.
My bad. Thanks for the suggestion.
When I am weaker than you, I ask you for freedom because that is according to your principles; when I am stronger than you, I take away your freedom because that is according to my principles. - Louis Veuillot
I wanna know why AmericanPride is worried about Internet Education... Just a professorial interest in the why's and where fores.. so to speak.
Sam Liles
Selil Blog
Don't forget to duck Secret Squirrel
The scholarship of teaching and learning results in equal hatred from latte leftists and cappuccino conservatives.
All opinions are mine and may or may not reflect those of my employer depending on the chance it might affect funding, politics, or the setting of the sun. As such these are my opinions you can get your own.
Also, IIRC American Pride, you're a new (or about to be new) 2LT. Be warned that if you start Master's work or finish a degree, you may make yourself ineligible for the Army funded full-time grad school available to junior CPT's as a retention bonus. Something to think about for the long term.
don't look a gift bennie in the mouth. Having the Army send you off to post-grad is much cheaper than footing the bill yourself.
However, that being said, AMU might have some courses of interest should you want to fine tune your military education, although it would probably be on your own dime. It does offer some very unique classes and Internet courses, while providing you with a certain flexibility, often put more work upon the student than some "conventional" course work.
You certainly want to make sure that any post-grad work you do doesn't DQ you for any education bennies in the future.
"What is best in life?" "To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of the women."
My understanding of the CSRB, captain's bonus, is you are only disqualified for the grad school if you are already enrolled in Advanced Civil Schooling. Also, the Army will not pay for a 2nd degree in the same subject. If you had a masters, or got on on your own, I think you're still eligible for the bonus. As a 2LT you should be too busy to do a grad degree part-time though, but that is a different discussion.
Just doing some probing actions to explore my actions. Presently, my two primary considerations are: (1) I am not sure of my eligibility for traditional schools. I graduated with a 2.95 GPA (I wasted my first two years ) and a GRE common score of 1150 (630/530) and written score of 6. (2) My active duty service obligation is only three years. Based on those facts, but not knowing what education benefits are available to me presently, my assessment is that I should complete a graduate program as soon as possible. Of course, active duty limits my options in which programs I can participate.
I'm very much ashamed of my situation because I was not initially selected for active duty during ascensions. Briefly for those not familiar with ROTC: two major components of your rating are your APFT (spring/fall semesters, and LDAC for a total of 15%, of which the LDAC APFT constitutes 75%) and your GPA (40%) which is measured after the fall semester of junior year. Military performance in ROTC is the remaining 45%. All of this is computed in some magical number crunching machine and each cadet is rated nationally. The AD cut-off is relative to the number of cadets in the class that year and available AD slots. I hit just under center mass because of my low LDAC APFT score and my GPA at the time of ascensions. And yes, if you're curious, I know the obvious "lessons learned" of my ascensions experience and I've resolved not to make those mistakes again (BOLC2 and BOLC3 are my next opportunities, FYI). But because of my "referral" to reserve status, I was able to select MI as my basic branch, which I hope to augment with further education (including learning Arabic, Farsi, and/or Russian; currently doing Arabic). So I'm playing catch-up because I did not work as hard I should have earlier, and must now work hard later. I hope to actually catch up by solidly completing a masters program and hitting out of the ball park during my time on AD.
I'm entering AD now through a (new?) program designed (specifically?) for new 2LTs not originally selected for it. After three years, I'll (likely) return to the NG to complete the remainder of my contract. My education assessment is based on the assumption that I will return and remain with the NG and will thus be in the need of some kind of employment. It's also as much a pride thing as it is a practical thing.
Last edited by AmericanPride; 08-26-2008 at 05:00 AM.
When I am weaker than you, I ask you for freedom because that is according to your principles; when I am stronger than you, I take away your freedom because that is according to my principles. - Louis Veuillot
Well, I know how to get you into a graduate program with those kind of scores, fit, consideration of grades, and all. The graduate program while on active duty is possible but with that price go's up (decreases choice and increases convenience costs). The program you apply to will likely be the biggest determining factor. You asked about AMU it is a good school. If you get serious about grad school let some of us know.
Sam Liles
Selil Blog
Don't forget to duck Secret Squirrel
The scholarship of teaching and learning results in equal hatred from latte leftists and cappuccino conservatives.
All opinions are mine and may or may not reflect those of my employer depending on the chance it might affect funding, politics, or the setting of the sun. As such these are my opinions you can get your own.
I'm certain on grad school -- it's just a question of when and where. AMU seems like a good option, but if there is a better option elsewhere, I'll of course consider that choice. The appeal for education now, I think, is to be able to transfer between the Army and some kind of other employment (or even staying in the Army) without the interceding delay caused by school if I were to wait. But then again, I don't fully know what's available three years from now in terms of school, financing, etc.
When I am weaker than you, I ask you for freedom because that is according to your principles; when I am stronger than you, I take away your freedom because that is according to my principles. - Louis Veuillot
<putting mentor hat on>
Here's what my experience tells me about the above.
I was a 2.6 GPA undergrad who currently is maintaining a 4.0 in Graduate school (Kansas State) . Serving in the military comps for a lot with admissions officers, and your GRE scores are reasonably strong.
Would argue against starting grad school. Focus on being a good LT and learning your job. When you deploy to GWOT you won't likely have time for grad school anyway. The other risk is that you get busy enough in grad school you neglect your LT duties, which will negatively impact your evals, which can affect your future employment plans.
Okay, beginning the moment you pin on your gold bar, not one thing you did pre-commissioning matters to the people serving around you. None. nada. Distinguished Mil Grad? Doesn't matter. 2.2 GPA? Doesn't matter. 4.0 GPA? Doesn't matter. (* to the Army ) What matters is your performance.I'm very much ashamed of my situation because I was not initially selected for active duty during ascensions.
The reality is also 99.9% of your year group, regardless of commissioning source, will make CPT in the current environment, and about the same to MAJ at current rates. Over-commissioning may reduce this, but trust me, you have to work at it to be in the bottom 10%. You have every opportunity if you want to stay active for a career. In three years the Army will be begging/bribing you to stay on. Your current accession status will not prevent you from staying on. You don't HAVE to go to the NG. If that's what you want, it's a great route.
If your intent is to get out after 3 years, the new GI bill applies to officers as well. (read on it). What many of my peers did is save money while deployed, get out, and go to grad school full time living off of savings. If you stay in, the Army will pay for grad school, and you will be competitive for the full-time programs.I'm entering AD now through a (new?) program designed (specifically?) for new 2LTs not originally selected for it. After three years, I'll (likely) return to the NG to complete the remainder of my contract. My education assessment is based on the assumption that I will return and remain with the NG and will thus be in the need of some kind of employment. It's also as much a pride thing as it is a practical thing.
If you do decide to get out, headhunters (Orion, Cameron Brooks, Lucas Group, GE, etc.) will be beating down your door to give you a job, with or without a master's. Seriously, you will get letters from them each week. Many companies they recruit for will pay for you to go to grad school. Former officers are very marketable.
For consideration, depending on what you want to do an AMU degree probably won't be as marketable in the civilian world outside of the security field.
I would hold off on rushing to grad school and make the most of your LT time. You will have plenty of options to get further educated. Platoon Leader and Company Command are the most rewarding jobs in the army. Don't be worried about your accessions, if you do well on active duty you will be rewarded.
Finally, don't do anything that "boxes you in" regarding options, as mentioned above. Sit down with an Army Education Counselor and your commander and make sure you have all the facts before you commit.
Feel free to PM if you want more.
Another mistake many graduate students make is thinking it will just be like under graduate. If it is even close then they are doing it wrong.
Sam Liles
Selil Blog
Don't forget to duck Secret Squirrel
The scholarship of teaching and learning results in equal hatred from latte leftists and cappuccino conservatives.
All opinions are mine and may or may not reflect those of my employer depending on the chance it might affect funding, politics, or the setting of the sun. As such these are my opinions you can get your own.
Thanks for the information and advice everyone. I'm going to hold of on a decision until I complete MIOBC and settle into my first assignment.
When I am weaker than you, I ask you for freedom because that is according to your principles; when I am stronger than you, I take away your freedom because that is according to my principles. - Louis Veuillot
I am a quarter of the way through the curriculum for the NSS MA. So far I have found it to be excellent in that it covers a great deal of materiel, all of which is required for a rudimentary understanding of the topic. However, I am sure that this program may fall short for someone who has extensive experience studying or working in the field of military strategy(military academy or war college grads). For me, the program and degree will provide a foot in the door and is not meant to supplement prior experience or field-related education.
On the negative side, the professors are very capable and experienced; but how much you get out of them is really up to you and their schedule. Also, I have a friend in another AMU graduate program and he has stated similar concerns with little or no feedback and automatic grading; but I have not yet experienced this.
In the end AMU is one of very few to offer these degree programs and online learning is one forum where you really do get back what you put in.
About working and doing school. It is hard, in numerous ways, especially if you have a family or other obligations. However, it will almost always be beneficial and it is unlikely that you will later regret it.
I finished my MA in the UW/SOLIC concentration from AMU a few years ago, and like most in this thread who have studied with AMU, I was pleased with the quality of the program. I started with AMU in the Spring of 1996, but it took me a while to finally complete the degree due to the typical deployments, PCS, other resident schools, etc. Throughout the entire process, though, AMU was extremely accomodating of my schedule requirements, and I found the profs to be very solid. There is enough diversity within their faculty to keep courses really interesting. Profs from essentially an exclusively military world meshed well with those with a more traditional academic background.
I'll echo the sentiments of those who state that students get exactly what they put into the courses; AMU operates under "Big Boy" rules, so I don't recommend this place to anyone who needs to be prodded along with their studies. However, most folks who pursue a degree with AMU are probably at a point in their life where they are self-motivated, so such prodding is probably not even an issue.
Perhaps the best aspect of AMU from my perspective, though, is that I've been able to apply my AMU MA directly to aspects of my career, sometimes even applying the lessons of a particular course as I was actually taking it. The degree has complemented other degrees and PME that I've received, and the fact that the military picked up the vast majority of the tab certainly adds to the attractiveness of the program. The military paid just about all of my tuition; I just paid for the books.
All in all, I was quite pleased with the program I took, and I enjoyed the give and take with the instructors and the other students. When I finally received my degree, I certainly did not feel like I was part of a diploma factory; I definitely felt I had earned that thing. I obviously continue to recommend AMU to all who are genuinely interested in pursuing additional studies.
Just finished my AMU degree (as in I wrapped up the comp exam 4 hours ago just finished) and I second his statements regarding affordability, the faculty, and the school's willingness to work with a guy whose schedule requires some flexibility.
"Law cannot limit what physics makes possible." Humanitarian Apsects of Airpower (papers of Frederick L. Anderson, Hoover Institution, Stanford University)
CR6 could you lend me some insight as to how you prepared for the AMU Comprehensive Exam. I am now enrolled to start the class in January 09. It has been a long and interrupted road, about 12 years, but I will be glad to finally see it done and over with. Any insight as to what worked well and what din not for you preparations would be greatly appreciated.
PM sent
"Law cannot limit what physics makes possible." Humanitarian Apsects of Airpower (papers of Frederick L. Anderson, Hoover Institution, Stanford University)
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