Corrective Training vs Punishment

[jkm_101_fso]

NCOs are good at smoking and Soldiers are good at PT. A match made in heaven! OK, just kidding. I'm an prior service officer and was smoked many times as a young Soldier. I deserved every single one.

I will echo the sentiments of others on this thread by saying getting smoked is better than losing pay, doing extra duty or even getting it on paper. That is pretty indisputable.

As a LT, there was only one instance where I had to stop an NCO from a smoke session. It wasn't because it was harsh or anything of that nature, but his timing was terrible. The BDE CDR was giving my BN a "Pep talk" prior to our deployment and this NCO decided that his Soldier nodding off needed some motivation to stay awake. I simply asked him not to interrupt the BDE CDR and wait until he left.

For every 99 NCOs that are mature and competent and would never abuse this type of corrective punishment, there is one who will. That's life. I wouldn't advocate eliminating smoke sessions, because of that.

In regards to COIN, I don't buy the theory that if we smoke our Soldiers, they would in turn treat the HN civs cruely. It comes back to leadership. Soldiers behave and perform primarily based on the conditions established by their leadership, from TL to BN CDR. I saw many Soldiers smoked in OIF for various things go out on missions treat Iraqis with dignity and respect. They were mature enough to make the separation. But then again, our unit had good leaders who fostered and promoted that environment.

[Eden]

Leadership techniques have to vary according to circumstance and audience. Mr. Ewing apparently comes from the school that believes 'one size fits all' and that enforcing Army policy trumps leaders employing common sense, military judgment, and effective techniques. My first platoon was filled with poorly-educated, drug-drenched, ambitionless thugs - back in the day when it was nearly impossible to chapter out poor performers. By the time I assumed company command, the majority of those folks were gone, replaced by brighter, better educated troops eager for promotion (God Bless Ronald Reagan). Guess what? We had to use different ways to motivate different kinds of troops.

By the time I assumed battalion command, I had an NCO Corps that had forgotten how to motive the unmotivated - the Army had made getting rid of poor soldiers so easy that working with them (or working them over) was too much trouble. I am glad, in a sense, that the NCOs have rediscovered the wonderful talent for imaginative correction.

I've always thought that the perfect punishment (for me anyways) was walking the area at West Point. It was so humiliating, painful, and utterly pointless that a dozen hours of it was more than enough to motivate me to comply with West Point standards (at least until I was eligible for room con).

[120mm]

Note to self: Before you adversely counsel someone, make sure they aren't armed. Or able to beat your *ss.

http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/0...gging_092208w/

[selil]

Just from the articles narrative I can already see the "self defense" argument. This will be on the national news pretty darn quick.

[Norfolk]

Army Times:

Neither Dawson nor Durbin was wearing body armor, helmet or other protective gear during the counseling, and each was shot multiple times.

Wait for the rocket that sees everyone having to wear full body armor whilst conducting an in-theatre counselling session. And don't forget the armed MP detachment that will have to be present, just to be sure that everything is (legally and procedurally) kopacetic.

[Tom Odom]

Army Times:


Wait for the rocket that sees everyone having to wear full body armor whilst conducting an in-theatre counselling session. And don't forget the armed MP detachment that will have to be present, just to be sure that everything is (legally and procedurally) kopacetic.

And the reflective safety belt...

Don't forget the safety belt!

[Cavguy]

And the reflective safety belt...

Don't forget the safety belt!

From the "OIF Alphabet"