It's the Tribes (merged thread)

[marct]

Hi tribeguy,

The best answer I've gotten to the question of which noble tribes are in Iraq was from an anthropologist with a PhD, who could only provide a general definition of what a noble tribe is, and copped out with his statement that actually knowing ARE in Iraq is "granular knowledge." Oh, well, granular knowledge saves lives.

And have you ever seen me claiming that I am an "expert" on the tribes in Iraq? "Granular knowledge", at least in Anthropology, is gained both by reading about something and, most importantly, by being there. You want that, maybe I should claim to be an expert on something I'm not? You're the one claiming to be an expert at the granular level, not me.

Of course, I suppose I should sit back and just accept that - but if that is the best that anthropology can do for us in support of the GWOT, then I'm going to be looking elsewhere for answers. Middle Eastern scholarship is where it's at - with all of its warts, its still more reliable than somebody that worships at the altar of anthropological theories - or those that claim to be masters thereof but can't produce anything better than a cop-out answer. I've had the duty of applying what I learned on the job in Iraq.

Well, good for you. Since you denegrate theory, I will also note that you are making a logical category error extrapolating from my own lack of granular knowledge of the tribes in Iraq to the entire Anthropological community. I hope that you didn't apply the same logic when you were in the field!

And, I'm NOT going to give away the answers to this and open myself up the "well, we already knew that" counter. If we all knew this, then I'd have my answer to which are the noble tribes in Iraq now, and happily move on to another area of study knowing that this field is in good hands.

(from Ken)I think the issue may not be closed minds here but a misperception on your part -- and that got started when you barged in and flooded the zone with excessively glib sales pitches and teasers. Most here don't do or play the academic mind game thing. FWIW, challenges to this crowd will generally get a reaction and if one isn't careful, it may not be the reaction one wants. Seems to me you can either modify your approach or chalk this crowd off as whatever you wish to call them / us and save everyone some time and effort.

Totally agree, Ken. Tribeguy, let me point out something to you - online communities operate on a reciprocity system (if you don't know what that is, then you should read some of the theory you denigrate). These communities are "voluntary" and trans-national, so several of your rhetorical assumptions are flawed. First off, this isn't an Iraq 101 course where you get to play teacher and administer tests; your status and how people react to you, is based on what you give away (try reading Marcel Mauss, The Gift or chapter 5 of Sahlins Stone Age Economics). Second, your posts point towards an assumption that the people here are all American, something you should have realized was NOT the case by the location marker under many posters names. This shows up in your assumption that we are all "duty bound" to be involved in Iraq. Really? My government and military isn't there and never has been.

Once again, you are commiting the same category error you did earlier. You assume that because Iraqi tribes are the centre of your universe, they must be the centre of everyone's universe. Could I find out who the noble tribes in Iraq are? Sure, but why should I - I am neither your student nor you employee, and the subject, while of interest to me, is not germain to most of my research. Furthermore, you claim to already know who they are, and why they are important, so why should I bother? That knowledge is what you bring to this community.