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  1. #1
    Council Member Ken White's Avatar
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    Default Agreed, Jon.

    I also agree you don't have to practice being miserable but we've gone about fifty paces past that. It's okay to take care of the troops; Westmorleand did it well -- perhaps too well -- in Viet Nam. I always figured he knew he was in a no win situation and decided to take as good care of people as he could under the circumstances but we over did it there and in Desert Storm and in these two we've definitely gone too far, way too far. Though I believe at least part of that is the due to the same sort of logic; we ain't gonna win but we'll make it comfortable for you...

    Troops in the base camps don't need to live as rough as Joe the Grunt -- but they don't need to live like they're not at war either. That is every bit as inimical (if not more so) to decent performance and morale for both the REMFs and the grunts as no amenities at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken White View Post
    ... they don't need to live like they're not at war either. That is every bit as inimical (if not more so) to decent performance and morale for both the REMFs and the grunts as no amenities at all.
    That is treading very close to Schmedlap Truth number 2: The morale value of a reward or luxury is inversely proportional to the amount of planning and organization necessary to provide it.

    According to this guy, these changes are only about 5 years overdue...

    Small units of soldiers and Marines in Iraq are working around the clock to capture or kill our enemies while safeguarding civilians and infrastructure. These are the people whom we tend to envision when we think of veterans, yet they represent a minority of the troops in Iraq. On our larger base camps, much larger numbers of soldiers, airmen, and Marines are working the same 9 to 5 duty hours that they work back home... While our troops who patrol the streets of Iraqi cities are more lethal, suffer fewer casualties, and cause fewer civilian casualties and collateral damage than in wars past, the troops in secure areas are becoming exponentially less efficient, turning our base camps into money pits into which our tax dollars quickly disappear. Peruse the publications put out by the military Public Affairs Offices in Iraq and you will see countless examples of our defense budget and manpower being put to gratuitous waste... There are radio stations, restaurants, coffee shops, beauty salons, massage parlors, and even post exchanges that sell lingerie, condoms, cologne, and perfume. On some base camps, most notably Camp Liberty, Camp Victory, and Logistics Support Area Anaconda, civilian attire is nearly as common as the starched military uniforms -- even among the troops -- and the pool, volleyball courts, and basketball courts are packed all day long... Contrary to the sacrifices and hardships that most Americans envision our troops to be making, most of our troops are being only slightly inconvenienced by their tour in Iraq.
    Some of the links in the quoted text are now defunct, the ones that still work are a hoot. For some that don't work - you can see in the url the title, which itself is hilarious "US Troops Living Large in Iraq".

    On a slight tangent, I can't help but notice that the author seemed to "get COIN" (protect the populace, avoid damage to infrastructure, etc) even though that article was written in 2005, before 3-24 allegedly revealed new truths to us.
    Last edited by Schmedlap; 04-02-2010 at 01:09 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmedlap View Post
    That is treading very close to Schmedlap Truth number 2: The morale value of a reward or luxury is inversely proportional to the amount of planning and organization necessary to provide it.
    I like those points you make. Not sure I agree fully with number 2 though (for reasons stated elsewhere). But then again what we considered a reward or luxury 30 years ago in a small African backwater is nowhere near what is possible and maybe even demanded by today's troops.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken White View Post

    Troops in the base camps don't need to live as rough as Joe the Grunt -- but they don't need to live like they're not at war either. That is every bit as inimical (if not more so) to decent performance and morale for both the REMFs and the grunts as no amenities at all.
    So the problem is confined to the base camps then?

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    Council Member jcustis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMA View Post
    So the problem is confined to the base camps then?
    Yes, that problem is all about the bigger bases.

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