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Thread: On Powerpoint

  1. #61
    Council Member William F. Owen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Martel View Post
    Scapegoating PowerPoint misses the real problem. The problems are our planning and thinking processes that stifle discussion and thought.
    Not scapegoats, but the guilty!

    I'll admit to this making me extremely angry. How does this twaddle get any amount of serious consideration. Please just read the explanation. It this is what "Systems thinking" gets you, it's more worthless than I realised, when applied to warfare.
    Infinity Journal "I don't care if this works in practice. I want to see it work in theory!"

    - The job of the British Army out here is to kill or capture Communist Terrorists in Malaya.
    - If we can double the ratio of kills per contact, we will soon put an end to the shooting in Malaya.
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  2. #62
    Council Member marct's Avatar
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    Hey Wilf,

    Quote Originally Posted by William F. Owen View Post
    I'll admit to this making me extremely angry. How does this twaddle get any amount of serious consideration. Please just read the explanation. It this is what "Systems thinking" gets you, it's more worthless than I realised, when applied to warfare.
    Personally, the only major problem I've ever had with systems theory is its serious limitations. When the two are combined in a ppt, however, there are some problems . Did you notice that Moynihan stated:

    Unlike linear thinking, the default mode of the human brain, system dynamics thinks about repercussions and occasionally unintended consequences of actions.
    That's an interesting assumption, that the default mode of thought is linear, and I don't believe it is borne out by the data. It may be the situationally appropriate default mode (by training), but it isn't the default for the species, and this has some implications for the use, comprehension and value of systems thinking.

    For one thing, systems theory operates in a minimum of 4 dimensions (go back to von Bertalenffy), but powerpoint rarely is able to present more than 3. When we are dealing with interacting human systems, each node (person) is also input and output capable and, just to make things interesting, is totally able to construct almost any picture of their operating environment that they wish. We can probabilistically "predict" patterns, and make interpretations based on those predictions, but they aren't a "vision of the future". Unfortunately, powerpoint presentations have a biasing effect that influences how what is presented is interpreted (from a probabilistic to a predictive).

    To my mind, systems theory is OK, as far as it goes, but it has some serious limitations that are exacerbated by powerpoint. Just my $.02

    Cheers,

    Marc

    ps. Wilf, love the FB rant against the overuse of "complexity"!
    Sic Bisquitus Disintegrat...
    Marc W.D. Tyrrell, Ph.D.
    Institute of Interdisciplinary Studies,
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    The Canadian Centre for Intelligence and Security Studies, NPSIA
    Carleton University
    http://marctyrrell.com/

  3. #63
    Council Member William F. Owen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marct View Post
    To my mind, systems theory is OK, as far as it goes, but it has some serious limitations that are exacerbated by powerpoint. Just my $.02
    Systems Theory may be OK, but it seems to fall down in Warfare. The real issue with the slide is that it presented no insight and added no value. What it really said (as with people saying Complex) is that those looking at the problem do not understand it.
    Ignorance or unfamiliarity, does not make something "complex" or anything like that which the slide attempted to portray.

    ps. Wilf, love the FB rant against the overuse of "complexity"!
    Seems to upset some people, but I guess it's complicated....
    Infinity Journal "I don't care if this works in practice. I want to see it work in theory!"

    - The job of the British Army out here is to kill or capture Communist Terrorists in Malaya.
    - If we can double the ratio of kills per contact, we will soon put an end to the shooting in Malaya.
    Sir Gerald Templer, foreword to the "Conduct of Anti-Terrorist Operations in Malaya," 1958 Edition

  4. #64
    Council Member Dayuhan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by William F. Owen View Post
    Systems Theory may be OK, but it seems to fall down in Warfare.
    Is that a problem with Systems Theory specifically, or a more general issue with transitions between theory and practice?

  5. #65
    Council Member William F. Owen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dayuhan View Post
    Is that a problem with Systems Theory specifically, or a more general issue with transitions between theory and practice?
    Excellent question!!! There IMO, a huge disparity between what people theorise about warfare and what people do in practice.

    As concerns system theory, having read "Pursuit of Excellence," and read about it else where, it seems to add nothing and in fact makes things more complicated than could ever be useful. IMO, it does not aid understanding
    Infinity Journal "I don't care if this works in practice. I want to see it work in theory!"

    - The job of the British Army out here is to kill or capture Communist Terrorists in Malaya.
    - If we can double the ratio of kills per contact, we will soon put an end to the shooting in Malaya.
    Sir Gerald Templer, foreword to the "Conduct of Anti-Terrorist Operations in Malaya," 1958 Edition

  6. #66
    Council Member Umar Al-Mokhtār's Avatar
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    Default I think...

    Mr Moynihan was just being a tad bit condescending. He meant: unlike linear thinking, the default mode of the military brain, we much smarter civilians utilize system dynamics which thinks about repercussions and occasionally unintended consequences of actions.…

    But he also realizes which side of the toast the butter is on.
    "What is best in life?" "To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of the women."

  7. #67
    Council Member marct's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by Umar Al-Mokhtār View Post
    Mr Moynihan was just being a tad bit condescending. He meant: unlike linear thinking, the default mode of the military brain, we much smarter civilians utilize system dynamics which thinks about repercussions and occasionally unintended consequences of actions.…

    But he also realizes which side of the toast the butter is on.
    Aaaah! Got it! He was dancing in circles rather than getting to the point !!!!
    Sic Bisquitus Disintegrat...
    Marc W.D. Tyrrell, Ph.D.
    Institute of Interdisciplinary Studies,
    Senior Research Fellow,
    The Canadian Centre for Intelligence and Security Studies, NPSIA
    Carleton University
    http://marctyrrell.com/

  8. #68
    Council Member Umar Al-Mokhtār's Avatar
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    Default Yes Marc!

    The 'Power' Point!!!!

    Perhaps if PA Consulting did a few spiffy slides describing exactly how linear thinking differs from system dynamics we could all be illuminated.

    Oh, some snazzy sounds and cool animations too!

    Some imbedded video as well.

    And a really dark colored background since they eat up the most toner when printed.
    "What is best in life?" "To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of the women."

  9. #69
    Council Member marct's Avatar
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    LOL!

    You know, I wonder if this was one of his ancestors ?
    Sic Bisquitus Disintegrat...
    Marc W.D. Tyrrell, Ph.D.
    Institute of Interdisciplinary Studies,
    Senior Research Fellow,
    The Canadian Centre for Intelligence and Security Studies, NPSIA
    Carleton University
    http://marctyrrell.com/

  10. #70
    Council Member Umar Al-Mokhtār's Avatar
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    Default Holy Crap!

    They have "talking pictures" now! Wow! I'm guessing that spells doom for the Interwebs, oh and the silent film industry too.
    "What is best in life?" "To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of the women."

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    24 Aug 10: Outside View: PowerPoints 'R' Us
    I have been assigned as a staff officer to a headquarters in Afghanistan for about two months. During that time, I have not done anything productive. Fortunately little of substance is really done here, but that is a task we do well.

    We are part of the operational arm of the International Security Assistance Force commanded by U.S. Army Gen. David Petraeus. It is composed of military representatives from all the NATO countries, several of which I cannot pronounce.

    Officially, IJC was founded in late 2009 to coordinate operations among all the regional commands in Afghanistan. More likely it was founded to provide some general a three-star command. Starting with a small group of dedicated and intelligent officers, IJC has successfully grown into a stove-piped and bloated organization, top-heavy in rank. Around here you can't swing a dead cat without hitting a colonel.

    For headquarters staff, war consists largely of the endless tinkering with PowerPoint slides to conform with the idiosyncrasies of cognitively challenged generals in order to spoon-feed them information. Even one tiny flaw in a slide can halt a general's thought processes as abruptly as a computer system's blue screen of death.....
    27 Aug 10: Colonel Kicked Out of Afghanistan for Anti-PowerPoint Rant
    Consider it a new version of death by PowerPoint. The NATO command in Afghanistan has fired a staff officer who publicly criticized its interminable briefings, its over-reliance on Microsoft’s slide-show program, and what he considered its crushing bureaucracy.

    Army Col. Lawrence Sellin, a 61-year old reservist from New Jersey who served in Afghanistan and Iraq prior to this deployment, got the sack Thursday from his job as a staff officer at the International Security Assistance Force Joint Command in Kabul. The hammer fell barely 48 hours after United Press International ran a passionate op-ed he wrote to lament that “little of substance is really done here.” He tells Danger Room, “I feel quite rather alone here at the moment.”.....

  13. #73
    Council Member carl's Avatar
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    COL Sellin is my hero for the day. And he is a clever writer too.
    "We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene

  14. #74
    Council Member Ken White's Avatar
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    Default Roger that!

    Quote Originally Posted by carl View Post
    COL Sellin is my hero for the day. And he is a clever writer too.
    Note the solution to the actual problems he cites won't get fixed and that he gets fired and a wrist slap for doing what's right.

    Sad...

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    Default All is explained ...

    if you read past this (from article):

    Army Col. Lawrence Sellin, a 61-year old reservist from New Jersey who served in Afghanistan and Iraq prior to this deployment, got the sack Thursday from his job as a staff officer at the International Security Assistance Force Joint Command in Kabul.
    to this (near end):

    Sellin is going to head home to Finland, where he’s worked for the past several years for an information-technology company that he asks me not to name.
    Sellin has written a number of pieces for UPI - note the Helsinki and Finland byline on many of them.

    So, Sellin is a Finlander - at least by choice of residence (I've no idea as to ancestry - Sellin is a Finnish family name).

    As Carl knows (from flying the exotic regions of Northern Michigan), Finlanders are not known for their love of "pullsit" - except as applied to the back 40 for fertilizer.

    Thus, all is explained.

    Cheers

    Mike

  16. #76
    Council Member Tracker275's Avatar
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    On Powerpoint...

    In light of all previous comments....All I have to say on Powerpoint is that it has most definitely been the demise of the quality of Intelligence products.

    I miss a few years ago when I would get an INTSUM (Intelligence Summary), which has now been replaced by a GRINTSUM (Graphical Intelligence Summary). With the invention of the GRINTSUM, not only intelligence products, but the Patrol Debriefs have simply become a storyboard that encompasses half a slide that represents where on the map the unit was. Last I checked, the Commander already knows where the unit was. The Commander doesn't need to know where his infantry platoon was through the use of a map on Powerpoint that takes up at least half of the entire storyboard/patrol debrief. If he does, then he is "lost in the sauce", and doesn't know what his unit is doing, or where they are going. Not to mention, a true Patrol Debrief is not doctrinally a Powerpoint slide in either the US military or even NATO.

    Yes, pictures are "1,000 words", however when the pictures tell you less than the "1,000 words", it is time to step back for a moment.

    Not only that, too many Commanders do not want to see "NSTR" (No Status to Report) on their GRINTSUM's.

    Well, Sir...If there is nothing to report, then there is nothing to report. By ordering that "NSTR" is not allowed on an intelligence report, you are only prompting intellegence professionals to generate information (not intelligence) that really is of no use to anyone.

    Honestly, if the intel shop is telling you that there is "NSTR", then maybe it is time to stop sending troops and intelligence collection assets to a place or activity that continually produces "NSTR" information. Or, what happens is that the same information continually gets reported day-in, and day-out. Hence, why many analysts and others get to where they will just hit the "Delete" button on their keyboard when the 20megabyte file drops into their inbox. They know there won't be anything new on it, and besides...their email inbox is only 30megabytes so all it does is fill it up so they can't receive information that is the "hear-and-now" from someone else.

    Unfortunately, by ordering the ban on "NSTR" in reporting, you are only generating false reporting in that the intelligence analysts have to "create" something from nothing, which in turn...turns into a combat zone based on fictional reporting.

    Currently, we are teaching students in the All-Source Analyst Course (35F) the GRINTSUM, and discarding what is actually written in doctrinal publications on how to report intellegence to commanders. During the 10-day FTX here at Fort Huachuca, we spend more time on the students learning how to be "Powerpoint Rangers" than actual intelligence analysis. It is nothing for the students to spend an hour and a half just preparing the CIU to brief, which typically does not yield enough information to really give the Commander a true sense of his COP. Instead of the students learning how to write intelligence reporting, they spend more time on trying to be able to graphically represent what is on the various slides. This last class, I can't tell you how many times I had to try and pound into their heads the simple concept of presenting "Bottom-Line-Up-Front" (BLUF) reporting where the first sentence answered the "5W's". They honestly do not know how to do that, and after 4-months of training, we end up having to teach them just how to write intelligence that is useful to not only Commanders, but the rest of the intelligence community.

    Through the use of Powerpoint to produce intelligence products, there are several issues that come about.

    First, most of the GRINTSUM's are too big to even be transmitted through email to some elements that are in remote areas.

    Second, if you didn't sit through the brief, there is information that was presented on what was in the brief that is not displayed in text somewhere. So, if you weren't in the brief, you are looking at a slide with pretty pictures, and really don't know what the content was that is trying to make a point.

    Thirdly, Powerpoint is like the old school slide show. So, the point is that the "highlights" are presented graphically, and the briefer fills in the rest of the details. By doing this, all that is said by the briefer is lost when it is posted to a website, and someone from another unit looks at it. They are missing the additional details that are part of what was briefed, which are no longer included in any form to those that are no where near the briefing room.

    The GRINTSUM is perfectly fine to brief the Commander during a their CUB/CIU brief. However, it absolutely does not replace what the doctrinal concept behind what an INTSUM produces.

    Solution: Produce the GRINTSUM, but do not neglect the publication of an INTSUM, which can be put in small kilobyte size files able to be be sent to troops in remote areas with all of the details that they were unable to hear in a brief they were unable to attend.

    Unfortuntely, the doctrinal INTSUM that is referenced so many times in Army FM's is no longer taught, or tested on. This is particularly the case when they go do their 10-day FTX.
    Last edited by Tracker275; 08-30-2010 at 08:04 AM.

  17. #77
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    Default Lots of Sho, but missing Go

    seems to be the bottom line; or, the product is for the "first army" and not the "second army" - to take a quote from the Centurions via Gian Gentile in another context:

    I'd like to have two armies: one for display, with lovely guns, tanks, little soldiers, fanfares, staffs, distinguished and doddering generals and dear little regimental officers...

    The other would be the real one, composed entirely of young enthusiasts in camouflaged battle dress, who would not be put on display, but from whom impossible efforts would be demanded and to whom all sorts of tricks would be taught. That's the army in which I should like to fight.
    It strikes me that the "second army" would need and appreciate the INTSUMs.

    I'm a proponent of visual aids (repeat: aids) in what I've done and do. When the "aids" in a system supplant the substance, that system has a real problem.

    Googling GRINTSUM yields only 43 hits (just now) - a well kept secret, it seems.

    Regards

    Mike

  18. #78
    Council Member Cavguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracker275 View Post
    Solution: Produce the GRINTSUM, but do not neglect the publication of an INTSUM, which can be put in small kilobyte size files able to be be sent to troops in remote areas with all of the details that they were unable to hear in a brief they were unable to attend.

    Unfortuntely, the doctrinal INTSUM that is referenced so many times in Army FM's is no longer taught, or tested on. This is particularly the case when they go do their 10-day FTX.
    Every unit I've been in (Tactical BN and BDE), including the one I'm in now, still produces a full INTSUM daily in combat ops, with all the appropriate content. We just produced a series in our latest WFX/FSX. I even have my S2 shop producing a weekly OSINTSUM on our projected AO to stay in practice. Not sure which units have abandoned the INTSUM, news to me.
    "A Sherman can give you a very nice... edge."- Oddball, Kelly's Heroes
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    Default It seems one unit ...

    in the "second army" has spoken. Niel's posting is comforting on that score.

    We have 96°F in Hancock today - we will pay for that in a couple of months, together with those living to the north of us (including transplanted SC folk). Then, Niel, you can add snow data to your INTSUMs.

    Regards

    Mike

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    Default Finnish language blog by Col. Sellin

    Most of you won't be able to read it (and google translate has a few kinks to work out in Fin --> Eng translations), but Col. Sellin posted a little over forty posts from July onwards on Ilta-sanomat's website (one of two 'afternoon' papers published in Finland). From the first posts onwards I surprised at how open he was - good stuff, and certainly a useful perspective for many people in Finland to hear/read. Obviously that gig is also done, last post being Sept 7.

    http://blogit.iltasanomat.fi/afganistan/

    -Charly

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