Osama bin Laden dead (for information & debate)

[omarali50]

NO drug dealer or smuggler could be living in that place without the police and the security agencies being exactly aware of who he was, what his business was and who visited him and so on. Neighbors, yes, they might not know, but in most cases, some will be nosy enough to know. Servants seem to know a lot about the neighborhood.
No, the way it worked was that someone in the security agencies let it be known that this house was "agency business". May even have hinted that some "good jihadis" (Haqqani family, Daood Ibrahim, whatever) were hiding there. That would do it. Neighbors (according to friends in the Pakistani police) all regarded it as an "agency building". THey certainly did NOT know that Bin Laden was there. Most likely, neither did the fluctuating ranks of lower level agency people (such areas in Pakistan are crawling with FIU, MI, ISI, special branch and whatnot, Fuchs is completely off when he imagines its like those trains in the pictures). But someone put him there and spread the notion that it was an agency site and therefore protected from on high.
I have no idea how long he was there. My police friend made no comment about that.

[motorfirebox]

What do you guys think of the reported pornography found at the compound? Real, or an attempt to discredit OBL? I can see it going either way, honestly--I have no problem believing that hardcore zealots are prone to secretly violating their own strictures, but it's also a lot of bang for very few bucks in terms of de-martyring.

[omarali50]

There were a lot of males in that compound. It would be abnormal not to find SOME pornography. On the other hand, if this is a PR effort, its wasted. Those who dont like Bin Laden will make fun of this too, those who support Bin Laden are sure its a lie. Either way it doesnt count for much.

[Hacksaw]

Originally Posted by omarali50

There were a lot of males in that compound. It would be abnormal not to find SOME pornography. On the other hand, if this is a PR effort, its wasted. Those who dont like Bin Laden will make fun of this too, those who support Bin Laden are sure its a lie. Either way it doesnt count for much.

absolutely... I hope we aren't that amateurish

[Bill Moore]

Breaking News Alert
The New York Times
Tuesday, June 14, 2011 -- 10:32 PM EDT
-----

Pakistan Arrests C.I.A. Informants Who Aided Bin Laden Raid

Pakistan’s top military spy agency has arrested some of the Pakistani informants who fed information to the Central Intelligence Agency in the months leading up to the raid that led to the death of Osama bin Laden, according to American officials.

Pakistan’s detention of five C.I.A. informants, including a Pakistani Army major who officials said copied the license plates of cars visiting Bin Laden’s compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, in the weeks before the raid, is the latest evidence of the fractured relationship between the United States and Pakistan. It comes at a time when the Obama administration is seeking Pakistan’s support in brokering an endgame in the war in neighboring Afghanistan.

The fate of the C.I.A. informants arrested in Pakistan is unclear, but American officials said that the C.I.A. director, Leon E. Panetta, raised the issue when he travelled to Islamabad last week to meet with Pakistani military and intelligence officers.

Read More:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/15/wo...cy.html?emc=na

[davidbfpo]

Bill,

Thanks for posting that. It just shows that patience will be rewarded.

On the 4th May 2011 I noted a small detail in The Guardian's report on the OBL raid:

Note the nearest neighbour's house was occupied by a Pakistani Army major.

The fuller quote from the article:

But there was no sign of life from a nearby property, about 50 metres from Bin Laden's back wall, with a high perimeter wall and two watchtowers. Neighbours said it had been built three years ago by a man whose family has long owned property in the area. The nameplate read: Major Amir Aziz. Locals said he was a serving Pakistan army officer. Despite repeated rings on the doorbell, he refused to answer.

The latest article has:

..including a Pakistani Army major who officials said copied the license plates of cars visiting Bin Laden’s compound..

If all true then it makes the point human sources have a vital role even when hi-tech techniques are available.

[davidbfpo]

A well-written article from the New Yorker magazine, hat tip to Abu M; nothing startling IMHO:http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2...urrentPage=all

(Added later)

A review which highlights:

The raid on Osama bin Laden’s hideout in Pakistan was a mission to kill him, and there was “never any question” he would be captured alive, one of those directly involved has claimed.

Link:http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...the-start.html

[davidbfpo]

The BBC's Security Correspondent, Gordon Corera, did two radio programmes a month ago and I should have added them here.

Link to BBC News article, Part One:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-14115327

Link to BBC podcasts, Part One:http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b012ftrq

Link to BBC News article, Part Two:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-14190032

Link to BBC podcasts, Part Two:http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b012llrx

[davidbfpo]

A puzzling story by Dr. RJ Hillhouse, which appeared in today's UK press and her blogsite is:http://www.thespywhobilledme.com/the....html#comments

Which opens with:

Sources in the intelligence community tell me that after years of trying and one bureaucratically insane near-miss in Yemen, the US government killed OBL because a Pakistani intelligence officer came forward to collect the approximately $25 million reward from the State Department's Rewards for Justice program.

The informant was a walk-in.

Refreshing to see this walk-in had a better reaction than the 'Underwear Bomber' information given by his father in Lagos. Walk-in sources are the gems.

[AdamG]

Anyone surprised? Anyone? Buehler? Anyone?

(Reuters) - Pakistan gave China access to the previously unknown U.S. "stealth" helicopter that crashed during the commando raid that killed Osama bin Laden in May despite explicit requests from the CIA not to, the Financial Times reported on Sunday.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/...77D2BT20110814

[davidbfpo]

That Hollywood has made a blockbuster 'Zero Dark Thirty' based on official help is not a great surprise (honest). Along comes a FOI advocate and we get 'the Vickers Transcript', which:

....reveals the deep uncertainty among intelligence analysts over whether it was actually bin Laden hiding in the Abbottabad compound, and it provides the most complete and specific inside history of the creation, planning, training, and approval of the U.S. strike that killed the man behind the September 11 attacks.

Mr Vickers being:

..the undersecretary of defense for intelligence and DOD's highest-ranking civilian intelligence official.

Link, which includes the transcript:http://www.foreignpolicy.com/article...irty?page=full

There is a lot to read on 'The National Security Archive' entry, plunder for outsiders I expect:http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB410/

[davidbfpo]

One question commentators are asking is what the relationship is between AQIM and al Qaeda’s senior leadership (AQSL) in Pakistan, under Ayman al Zawahiri....But the documents captured from Osama bin Laden’s compound in Abbottabad do reveal communications between AQIM and AQSL that extend over the span of four years, and include discussion of strategic and operational issues. While it is possible that after bin Laden’s death, when Ayman al Zawahiri became AQSL’s emir, these communications were crippled or otherwise ceased, there’s no reason that this should be our a priori assumption.

Link:http://gunpowderandlead.org/2013/01/...or-leadership/