Gazing in the Congo (DRC): the dark heart of Africa (2006-2017)

[Michael F]

To add to your reflexion, please read http://www.ssrnetwork.net/document_l...kivu-provinces

It's brilliant, to the point and so true (in my opinion).

[M-A Lagrange]

You have also Candide in Congo by IFRI, a think tank in Paris. The analyses of the failure of the SSR is also quite detail and straight to the point.
http://www.ifri.org/frontDispatcher/..._1241612173509


Tom,
I am actually preparing to defend a master on MONUC operations in East. With special orientation on the problematic of FARDC and MONUC obligation to protect. I would be very interrested to have your books references.

And anyways, you are right. The main problem is the concept of army as a national defence dedicated body and not a predator group under in power command.

Have you seen that Bemba may come out jail? What will happen if he is back for election? We are training troops for what? If he is elected (imagine) how security apparat would be transfered? That never happened before.

[Tom Odom]

MA

Two on Congo/Zaire are here at CSI Press:

LP 14 on the 1964 Hostage Crisis

Shaba II Study on French and Belgian Ops in Kolwezi in 1978

Third is here:

Journey Into Darkness: Genocide in Rwanda


Best
Tom

[Stan]

... not a predator group under in power command.

110% correct MA.

Have you seen that Bemba may come out jail? What will happen if he is back for election? We are training troops for what? If he is elected (imagine) how security apparat would be transfered? That never happened before.

Then, you answered your own question. Bemba was my neighbor and ruthless when it came to relinquishing his power base. Probably why he had an M2HB nest in front of his garden

On the other hand, my street was relatively quiet during 2 civil wars

[davidbfpo]

The BBC reports on rioting SANDF soldiers in Pretoria: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/8226121.stm

Cannot recall that type of behaviour in the SANDF or SADF.

davidbfpo

[carl]

This may be slightly off topic, but the BBC article about the SANDF mentions the gov plans to dismiss 1,000-2,000 soldiers, essentially en-masse.

I don't know much about the South African political culture but dismissing disgruntled soldiers in a group like that might be asking for trouble. What do you more knowledgeable and experienced guys think?

[Tom Odom]

This may be slightly off topic, but the BBC article about the SANDF mentions the gov plans to dismiss 1,000-2,000 soldiers, essentially en-masse.

I don't know much about the South African political culture but dismissing disgruntled soldiers in a group like that might be asking for trouble. What do you more knowledgeable and experienced guys think?

Do not be "the guy" designated to make the speech and hand out the pink slips

[Michael F]

Sure think it won't please them. One of the advantages of the DRC-south Africa militiray cooperation is I guess they learned a lot from their congolese colleagues in what relates to strikes, not being paid,.....

[Stan]

in what relates to strikes, not being paid,.....

Hey Michael !

Those were called strikes ?

[davidbfpo]

Originally Posted by Carl

This may be slightly off topic, but the BBC article about the SANDF mentions the gov plans to dismiss 1,000-2,000 soldiers, essentially en-masse.

I don't know much about the South African political culture but dismissing disgruntled soldiers in a group like that might be asking for trouble. What do you more knowledgeable and experienced guys think?

There is some history in South Africa, long ago in the inter-war years, of unrest in one of security forces being forcibly repressed and the SADF developed a very strong, if not authoritarian style, partly due to the Army being Afrikaneer-dominated. Discipline in the apartheid armed forces did wane at times, notably over smuggling weapons, ivory etc from Mozambique in the 1980's - which an Air Force investigation un-covered.

How much of this apartheid era tradition remains in the SANDF is a moot point.

Probably more important for the SANDF are the traditions of the ANC's military wing, which IIRC was rather stalinist in approach, i.e. harsh treatment in overseas camps etc. The ANC is not the dominant tradition and some senior, highly respected officers are from the old 'Homeland' forces.

Between the two traditions I think en masse dismissal is manageable, although I'd want to know what other units are on duty on the day.

Note the SAP (Police) had no apparent issues with using tear gas etc when the original riot happened.

davidbfpo

[davidbfpo]

An update on the sacked SANDF soldiers: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/8248596.stm

The ANC Defence Minister is now to review unions in the military.

davidbfpo

[Stan]

Belgian instructing officers in DR Congo

Six officers of the Belgian Army departed the capital, Brussels, for the DR Congo, where they will lead the improvements of a base for the training of the armed forces in Kindu, the capital of Maniema province, a military source disclosed to PANA here.

A group of 60 instructing officers, in charge of the training of the first battalion of the Congolese rapid reaction forces, will join the soldiers mid-September.

[M-A Lagrange]

Well, I have not seen any of this in english news, but FDLR are accusing FARDC to have commited war crimes.
They say that FARDC have killed several dozen of hutu civilians in East Drc.
Sorry, did not have time for more details.

[Stan]

Well, I have not seen any of this in english news, but FDLR are accusing FARDC to have commited war crimes.
They say that FARDC have killed several dozen of hutu civilians in East Drc.
Sorry, did not have time for more details.

MA, If you check out among other places Human Rights Watch, there's some good detail on those accusations. MONUC also has much to say regarding Operations Umojo Wetu and later Kimia I & II.

In at least one incident recently, UN peacekeepers fired warning shots over the heads of Congolese army soldiers to try to minimize their abusive behavior.

I generally find more starting with French links such as Agence France-Presse (AFP) and then search for English.

[M-A Lagrange]

Thanks Stan, but that was not the ones I was speaking about.
As I did not found it in english, I translated from AFP. (So excuse my english.)

On September 6, the hutu rebels from FDLR accused FARDC and APR to have assassinated several hutu refugees in July and August in Walikale, Masisi and Kalehe.
The also denounce the silence of international community.
They say the events took place from July 4 to August 25.
Not saying I like FDLR and interharmwe, far from it. But the medicine seems to be worst than the plague.

At the same time, FARDC experienced massive defection from former CNDP soldiers.
September 5, Colonel Jaguar and is men (more than 100), all former CNDP, deserted FARDC ranks. They reason is said to be the non payment of salaries since 5 month…
Colonel Jaguar went to a hill close to Uganda while part of his former troops went to Ishasha.

FARDC commanders are actually speaking about a small problem of discipline.

This does remind me what happened few years ago…
Does someone knows that Colonel Jaguar? He looks like the new Nkunda to me. Seems Rwandain on war path again in Kivu.

[Schmedlap]

This week I will have the opportunity to hear a lecture from a guy from the Congo. He will be discussing the recent fighting/genocide there from the perspective of international law. At the moment, that's about as specific a description as I can come up with.

If anyone has a good question related to International Law, as it relates to the recent nonsense in the Congo, feel free to leave it here or private message me. It could add to the lecture and make me look far smarter than I actually am . In return, I will relay his answer to you.

Two caveats: 1) I don't know if I'll have the opportunity to ask the question, since there is rarely enough time and 2) English is not his first language, so if the question is a bunch of five syllable words that I cannot simplify into a question of less than a few sentences, then it might not be a good one to ask.

[M-A Lagrange]

Dear Schmedlap,

I have two questions:

Do you have a name for the guy from congo and an organisation?
There are not so many persons specialised on congo and even less specialised on the recent fightings/genocide and international law.

Will he be lecturing about Eastern DRC only (North and South Kivu) or also about the LRA problem?
Cause it is two different issues with both different implications concerning international law. I believe it will be only the East as it is "sexu" at the moment but you never know.

[Michael F]

Thanks Stan, but that was not the ones I was speaking about.
As I did not found it in english, I translated from AFP. (So excuse my english.)

On September 6, the hutu rebels from FDLR accused FARDC and APR to have assassinated several hutu refugees in July and August in Walikale, Masisi and Kalehe.
The also denounce the silence of international community.
They say the events took place from July 4 to August 25.
Not saying I like FDLR and interharmwe, far from it. But the medicine seems to be worst than the plague.

At the same time, FARDC experienced massive defection from former CNDP soldiers.
September 5, Colonel Jaguar and is men (more than 100), all former CNDP, deserted FARDC ranks. They reason is said to be the non payment of salaries since 5 month…
Colonel Jaguar went to a hill close to Uganda while part of his former troops went to Ishasha.

FARDC commanders are actually speaking about a small problem of discipline.

This does remind me what happened few years ago…
Does someone knows that Colonel Jaguar? He looks like the new Nkunda to me. Seems Rwandain on war path again in Kivu.

Check http://www.fdlr.org/...

[Tom Odom]

I stumbled on this little slide show on Congo history this AM on MSNBC.com. As a "history" it is both selective and sketchy. Still the photos do cover the points they chose to highlight. The photo of Kibumba camp with the three rows of bodies is pretty much etched on my brain--what the photo cannot show is that line was actually on both sides of the road and ran nearly continuously from the northern most camp at Rutshuru through Kibumba 65 kilometers south to Goma.

Congo's tumultuous history in pictures

The Democratic Republic of Congo, a vast nation about a quarter the size of the U.S. in the center of sub-Saharan Africa, is one of the continent’s most mineral-rich countries. But it also one of the world’s poorest countries and has been the site of near constant warfare over the last decade which has left over 5 million dead. A recent flare-up of violence between rebels and government forces has revived fears that it could slide back into all-out war again. Click through to learn more about its tumultuous history.

[Tom Odom]

Short piece on CNN today

This individual was ex-FAR intelligence and led a death unit in Butare and has been with the FDLR since the 94 genocide. I am glad they cuaght him but I'd rather know he was dead.

Rwanda genocide suspect arrested, extradited

From Samson Ntale
For CNN
KAMPALA, Uganda (CNN) -- Police in Uganda have arrested and extradited a man who is among the most wanted suspects in the Rwandan genocide.

The 100-day killing rampage led to the loss of an estimated 10 percent of Rwanda's population.

He was extradited to Tanzania, where the U.N.-sponsored International Criminal Tribunal (ICTR) for Rwanda is based. Top officials who allegedly took part in the genocide, such as army generals and politicians, are tried in the court.