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Thread: The Afghanistan National Police (ANP)

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    Quote Originally Posted by huskerguy7 View Post
    This really makes you wander how a police force could function in an insurgency environment against guerrillas.
    This quote is taken from the UK's ongoing Iraq Inquiry (Geoffrey Cooper UK Chief Police Advisor 18 Mar 08 – 7 Apr 09) Iraq Inquiry (IPS - Iraqi Police Service)

    However coalition military commanders perhaps naturally considered the primary role of the IPS to be security provision, and as a result envisaged (and trained) the IPS largely as a paramilitary force. The primary role of policing in a stabilised environments is not security but provision of criminal justice.
    What I think this quote highlights is that the role of the police in stabilised environments is very very different from those in COIN environments.

    So what do we want the ANP to do? Provide security (primarily) with a little bit of law enforcement, or vice versa? I think at the moment we need security in order to enable (down the line) effective law enforcement. This means the ANP should be trained and equipped for security duties, but with the ability to transition (in due course) to law enforcement duties.

    What does this mean? Well we can train them now very much like the ANA, but have a considerably tighter vetting process, regular drugs testing and an internal programme of education (literacy and numeracy) so that they can transition over time as/when/if the situation allows, to law enforcement.

    Quote Originally Posted by huskerguy7 View Post
    I'm throwing it out there, but would having small "law enforcement" ANP patrols supplemented by a heavier paramilitary ANP quick reaction force work? Yes, ANP soldiers would still take losses, but they may possibly be able to enforce some law in the local area. It would be similar to a sheriff and his deputies with access to Federal Marshall assistance?
    Or you train an effective civilian police force whose primary focus is law enforcement. In areas where they are unable to carry out their policing duties they are escorted by ANA to provide the force protection. The UK did this in N Ireland. High threat areas saw the police escorted by the army, low threat areas the police did it themselves. It meant the police were trained and equipped to be police and did not have to turn into a paramilitary force.

    The other issue is what type of police force does Afghanistan require? The UK police model would probably not work in Afghanistan, and a Middle East model would probably be more appropriate.

    Last but not least, a police force is only the tip of the spear. How effective is the rest of the Afghan judicial system?
    Last edited by Red Rat; 07-20-2010 at 11:31 AM. Reason: typo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Rat View Post
    Or you train an effective civilian police force whose primary focus is law enforcement. In areas where they are unable to carry out their policing duties they are escorted by ANA to provide the force protection. The UK did this in N Ireland. High threat areas saw the police escorted by the army, low threat areas the police did it themselves. It meant the police were trained and equipped to be police and did not have to turn into a paramilitary force.
    General Scaparotti in regional east has been promoting an idea called Combined Action (you may have heard of it). CA has 4 components: the ANA, the ANP, ISAF, and the Afghan Government. CA allows the Afghan government to reach out to the environment while being protected while the ANA monitors the ANP and ISAF has their resources available to provide backup. So far, CA has been very successful. I do like the idea of having ANA patrol with the ANP because they'll keep the ANP from peroforming corrupt activities and will offer a "security arm."

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Rat View Post
    Last but not least, a police force is only the tip of the spear. How effective is the rest of the Afghan judicial system?
    This is very true. The overall system is very fragile.

    The US government should consider establishing some sort of civilian police force that can deploy abroad to help in situations like Afghanistan. The Italians have one, the French have theirs, so it is possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by slapout9 View Post
    It still is that way. All US Marshals are appointed. Most of the time when you see a Marshall he is a Deputy Marshal.
    I know, Slap. Back then it was much more political than it is today, and many of the deputies were about as worthless as their political boss. This wasn't always the case, of course, but the trained Deputy U.S. Marshal is very much a modern phenomenon.

    The US government should consider establishing some sort of civilian police force that can deploy abroad to help in situations like Afghanistan. The Italians have one, the French have theirs, so it is possible.
    I think a modified version of the Deputy U.S. Marshal system/service is about the best you could get. The FBI doesn't really do this sort of thing well, and the marshal service is about the closest the U.S. gets to a national police force model. You might be able to copy some of the state police/highway patrol models, but that's about it.
    Last edited by Steve Blair; 07-20-2010 at 05:57 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by huskerguy7 View Post
    General Scaparotti in regional east has been promoting an idea called Combined Action (you may have heard of it). CA has 4 components: the ANA, the ANP, ISAF, and the Afghan Government. CA allows the Afghan government to reach out to the environment while being protected while the ANA monitors the ANP and ISAF has their resources available to provide backup. So far, CA has been very successful. I do like the idea of having ANA patrol with the ANP because they'll keep the ANP from peroforming corrupt activities and will offer a "security arm."
    I have not heard of CA, but it sounds like common sense. The police police, the army provides security and ISAF provide the overwatch and specialist capabilities. Is the role of the ANA to mentor, monitor or protect the ANP?

    Quote Originally Posted by huskerguy7 View Post
    The US government should consider establishing some sort of civilian police force that can deploy abroad to help in situations like Afghanistan. The Italians have one, the French have theirs, so it is possible.
    One of the lessons we learnt in the UK from Iraq was our lack of a deployable policing capability. The US Army's Military Police branch is however much larger then its UK equivalent, and with a much broader scope (rear area security) so it is more useable to fill the identified gap.

    As far as I can make out the ANP is little more then a local protection force at the moment, and not what we would regard as a police force. Does AFG want the ANP to provide a policing service or an internal security service? Perhaps what we should be looking at is rolling out a paramilitary security service (the ANP) with limited policing expertise (and powers) and a separate more specialised policing branch. Many developed countries have a policing service and then a paramilitary 'knock heads' service (the French CRS, elements of the Italian Carabineri and the Spanish Civil Guard all spring to mind) with the balance weighted towards the policing. Perhaps in an unstable country we want to reverse polarity, with the majority of the policing being of the paramilitary type and a smaller civil policing / investigative branch?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Blair View Post
    I think a modified version of the Deputy U.S. Marshal system/service is about the best you could get. The FBI doesn't really do this sort of thing well, and the marshal service is about the closest the U.S. gets to a national police force model. You might be able to copy some of the state police/highway patrol models, but that's about it.
    Although for a short time there was a Special Forces MP Company which may be what really need....soldiers that can stand up a Police Force as a Police Force not just a modified Infantry company. Where is W.E. Faibairn when you need him

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    Default Wild Wild West

    Quote Originally Posted by huskerguy7 View Post

    Another thought: As I think about the ANP's difficult situation, they seem comparable to America's "Wild West" years. During this time in history, law enforcement in secluded small towns would be outnumbered by the gangs. As a result, they would either fight and die, do nothing, or join their efforts-just like the ANP today. How did these towns survive? I'm currently examining that and am curious if it could apply to Afghanistan.
    First, I agree with many of your comments and appreciate the correction to the quote.

    I have often depicted the Afghan situation as the 'Wild West' to friends and aquaintances and mused myself about examining the turnaround and its factors. For Canada, what effect did the RCMP federal police services, or the US Marshall's have in your country?

    Another parallel if I may, what significant event contributed to the reconstruction and development of our national governments in the time of the wild west? I believe the national railway was very significant in the west's national identity, unity and fostered security, governance, reconstrution and development. I believe the building of a national railway could foster such a change in Afghanistan and the idea merits serious consideration. It would provide national transportation for security personnel movements, reliable public transportation and migration, linking of education and medical facilities, foster trade and goods exchange, facilitate industrialization, and in the interim, represent a significant source of jobs. If it isn't militarized, then insurgents should ignore or tolerate it's presence since they would benefit from it as much as others. Just a thought.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seahorse View Post
    Another parallel if I may, what significant event contributed to the reconstruction and development of our national governments in the time of the wild west? I believe the national railway was very significant in the west's national identity, unity and fostered security, governance, reconstrution and development. I believe the building of a national railway could foster such a change in Afghanistan and the idea merits serious consideration. It would provide national transportation for security personnel movements, reliable public transportation and migration, linking of education and medical facilities, foster trade and goods exchange, facilitate industrialization, and in the interim, represent a significant source of jobs. If it isn't militarized, then insurgents should ignore or tolerate it's presence since they would benefit from it as much as others. Just a thought.
    MikeF should have warned you that I like to compare Afghanistan (in general, not in some of the particulars) to Arizona between 1860 or so and 1876. The similarities are fascinating, including a transition from preparation for a high-intensity conflict to more Small Wars-style operations, muddled command arrangements after 1865, and a number of competing interest groups (to include a local government that profited from Indian wars, a number of different tribal groups, Federal government representatives, and the Army often caught in the middle).

    As for the development of the West, the railroad was certainly an important factor, but possibly not the decisive one. It wasn't reliable or truly national for some years (the whole "Golden Spike" thing aside), and its impact was limited until the mid to late 1880s outside of its main corridors. I would contend that industrialization had a bigger impact, to include the national thirst for precious metals (something we had in common with the Spanish Empire not that long before us). Prospecting, and later deep rock mining, drove a great deal of the settlement and development in many areas of the West (miners have to eat, and they have specie to buy goods). There was also a great deal of displacement going on, even among the new Anglo arrivals.

    And I don't know if you could count on insurgents ignoring a railroad. Railroads bring outside influences, modernization, and any number of assorted things they might not appreciate or welcome. Also, if it makes it easier for Government forces to concentrate it becomes a target for that reason alone.

    Just some thoughts in response to your thoughts.
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    Default gosh

    We do this.... Police mentor teams
    and they have that ANCOP
    just hasnt always been the priority

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    Default One more snippet to Add

    Texas Rangers

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    Quote Originally Posted by OfTheTroops View Post
    We do this.... Police mentor teams
    and they have that ANCOP
    just hasnt always been the priority
    But most police mentor teams have a limited policing capability and focus on the security aspect of work. Who is mentoring the the afghan police on scenes of crime work (which is still applicable in the Afghan judicial system even if it consists only in taking a photograph or suspect with evidence at crime scene or video recording the suspect re-enacting the crime, both acceptible, indeed preferred by Afghan courts). Who is mentoring the Highway Police on how to ensure vehicles are roadworthy under Afghan regulations?

    The ANCOP (Afghan Civil Order Police) appear to be an Afghan version of the French CRS, a highly specialised public order capability, possibly with some specialised anti-terrorist capability as well.

    We appear to be focusing on the ANP as a security force and not a police force. Working on the Combined Action principle as alluded to earlier in this thread I think we can and should be playing things smarter.

    I think there is merit in a centrally based investigative arm.

    The issue hinges on what role do we expect police forces to play in society, and in a society in conflict. Once you know what you want then you look at a suitable mechanism for carrying out that role, then you can look (in Afghanistan) at the plan and TTPs needed to grow that capability in conflict.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Rat View Post
    But most police mentor teams have a limited policing capability and focus on the security aspect of work.
    Not to mention limited time to spend with each district's ANP, meaning plenty of time for them to get back into their bad habits.

    Who is mentoring the the afghan police on scenes of crime work (which is still applicable in the Afghan judicial system [...] Who is mentoring the Highway Police on how to ensure vehicles are roadworthy under Afghan regulations?
    Also, who is teaching them the value of the rule of law in the first place? We teach them tactics, but not how to determine the correct situations to use them, or even why.

    Once you know what you want then you look at a suitable mechanism for carrying out that role, then you can look (in Afghanistan) at the plan and TTPs needed to grow that capability in conflict.
    Exactly -- we are confused about what the ANP should be doing and therefore so are the ANP.
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    Default ANP in Helmand

    Speaking to people in Helmand, it is apparent that in parts of Helmand Province the ANP is now turning out in greater numbers and proving more reliable then the ANA.

    A combination of several factors. The Helmand Police Training Centre is now up and running (and well resourced), and is turning out formed cohesive sub-units of ANP (who are local to Helmand). The emphasis is still on the ANP as a primarily security force, but if that is what is needed...

    Interestingly, like Iraq it has taken us some time to focus on the police, and yet when we do focus effort and resources there we find that the dividends are quick and the police can change from being part of the problem to part of the solution, especially with the overlap between criminality and insurgency in most COIN situations.

    Perhaps next time we should focus on building up the police first, recognising that in a COIN situation police provide the bedrock element of security and intelligence and that a police force is more likely to provide a pervasive destabilising influence then the army which generally remains free of insurgent and criminal elements for longer.
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    Default Really

    The problem is that there are not enough Military police who can do this partnering/advising quite effectively and everyone else thinks they can do it just as well. If its the sexiest part of the fight or where the action is then that is where all of the maneuver( non-LE ROL ) types do not wanna be on the FOB...or they want the civilian surge.......And of course Civi Police do not flock to warzones out of camoflauge in droves... and Contractors perpetuate their contracts.... and uh oh i am complaining... Repeal posse Comitatus and establish the Military Police as the proponent for stability policing units DSCA and FID/SFA. Thats our bag.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Rat View Post
    I have not heard of CA, but it sounds like common sense. The police police, the army provides security and ISAF provide the overwatch and specialist capabilities. Is the role of the ANA to mentor, monitor or protect the ANP?
    CA is a great idea (the ANA both protect and monitor the ANP), but as you can imagine, setting it up can be difficult; you're working with four different groups. My point is that we shouldn't rely on it.


    (From Red Rat:As far as I can make out the ANP is little more then a local protection force at the moment, and not what we would regard as a police force. Does AFG want the ANP to provide a policing service or an internal security service? Perhaps what we should be looking at is rolling out a paramilitary security service (the ANP) with limited policing expertise (and powers) and a separate more specialised policing branch. Many developed countries have a policing service and then a paramilitary 'knock heads' service (the French CRS, elements of the Italian Carabineri and the Spanish Civil Guard all spring to mind) with the balance weighted towards the policing. Perhaps in an unstable country we want to reverse polarity, with the majority of the policing being of the paramilitary type and a smaller civil policing / investigative branch?
    I really like this idea. I think that that we should consider establishing a new organization that focuses on enforcing the law, not providing security. The ANP is clearly made to do the latter. This is nice, but who's going to enforce the law? Yes, the judicial system isn't very strong, but it may get somewhere if it is enforced properly. I'm looking at images of the ANP and they are patrolling with heavy PKM MGs. This just supports the assertion that they are a security force. In my opinion, this should change.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seahorse View Post
    Another parallel if I may, what significant event contributed to the reconstruction and development of our national governments in the time of the wild west? I believe the national railway was very significant in the west's national identity, unity and fostered security, governance, reconstrution and development. I believe the building of a national railway could foster such a change in Afghanistan and the idea merits serious consideration. It would provide national transportation for security personnel movements, reliable public transportation and migration, linking of education and medical facilities, foster trade and goods exchange, facilitate industrialization, and in the interim, represent a significant source of jobs. If it isn't militarized, then insurgents should ignore or tolerate it's presence since they would benefit from it as much as others. Just a thought.
    This is a good suggestion that definitley should be considered. However, I think that securing it would be incredibly difficult, if not impossible. It's comparable to the construction of power lines in Afghanistan. Electricity can benefit both civilians and enemy combatants. However, the Taliban ignored this and continuously attacked the powerlines rendering them useless. Neither the contractor's PMCs or the contingent of the ANP could secure the lines until a couple hundred ANA and ISAF forces assisted. My point is that despite the benefits, it would be to difficult to secure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Rat View Post
    But most police mentor teams have a limited policing capability and focus on the security aspect of work. Who is mentoring the the afghan police on scenes of crime work (which is still applicable in the Afghan judicial system even if it consists only in taking a photograph or suspect with evidence at crime scene or video recording the suspect re-enacting the crime, both acceptible, indeed preferred by Afghan courts). Who is mentoring the Highway Police on how to ensure vehicles are roadworthy under Afghan regulations?

    The ANCOP (Afghan Civil Order Police) appear to be an Afghan version of the French CRS, a highly specialised public order capability, possibly with some specialised anti-terrorist capability as well.

    We appear to be focusing on the ANP as a security force and not a police force. Working on the Combined Action principle as alluded to earlier in this thread I think we can and should be playing things smarter.

    I think there is merit in a centrally based investigative arm.
    I completely agree. Modifying the ANP from a paramilitary security force to a law enforcement group would be to difficult. Thus, I think we should investigate establishing a new organization that focuses strictly on law enforcement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Rat View Post
    Speaking to people in Helmand, it is apparent that in parts of Helmand Province the ANP is now turning out in greater numbers and proving more reliable then the ANA.

    A combination of several factors. The Helmand Police Training Centre is now up and running (and well resourced), and is turning out formed cohesive sub-units of ANP (who are local to Helmand). The emphasis is still on the ANP as a primarily security force, but if that is what is needed...

    Interestingly, like Iraq it has taken us some time to focus on the police, and yet when we do focus effort and resources there we find that the dividends are quick and the police can change from being part of the problem to part of the solution, especially with the overlap between criminality and insurgency in most COIN situations.

    Perhaps next time we should focus on building up the police first, recognising that in a COIN situation police provide the bedrock element of security and intelligence and that a police force is more likely to provide a pervasive destabilising influence then the army which generally remains free of insurgent and criminal elements for longer.
    I like this idea alot. If there is a "next time", the invading country should have the capacity to provide security, so they should invest their resources into stabilizing the whole legal system starting with law enforcement.
    Last edited by davidbfpo; 07-21-2010 at 07:23 PM. Reason: Fix quote

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    Default The Afghan Legal System

    I was at a briefing on the Afghan legal system a couple of months ago, given by European and Afghan experts on the (Afghan) legal system. To put into context some of the issues regarding the ANP I have included below some of the points that I picked up.

    Background

    Following his European Tour in the 1920s King Amanullah reformed the Afghan legal system introducing amongst other things a more liberal interpretation of women's rights. However this immediately ran into opposition from mullahs and tribes. Throughout the 1940s and 50s there remained no countrywide organised, formal legal system. Most justice remained local and religious, based on a local interpretation of the Koran and sharia law and having no reference to Afghan state or written law. Later on the mullahs were brought somewhat more into the fold through the payment of mullahs of a government salary, giving the government a degree of leverage on them. Historically penetration of the countryside by the (formal) law system was weak.

    In the 1970s and 1980s the law was reformed again, this time modelled on the Soviet legal system. Under this system much more emphasis is placed on the role of the Prosecution Service or Attorney General's office. The office actively seeks to enforce compliance and will embed people in Ministries to enforce compliance. Certainly in Kabul this allows it a great deal of political influence. Many of the people now occupying roles in the Afghan judical system will have been trained under the Soviet system, and the corporate memory of this era remains strong.

    Current

    Afghanistan now has a proper constitution and one that protects Human Rights. However all laws must be in conformity with Islam and where an area is not covered by statute then Islamic law is to be applied. This was highlighted by the student blasphemy trial in Mazar - e - Sharif where the defendant was sentenced to 20 years for blasphemy, despite the fact there is no blasphemy statute on the books (this was presumably the technicality that saw the student released under western (donor) government pressure to the Karzai government…)

    The Afghan constitution remains weak on judicial review and the Afghan Supreme Court functions more as a court of higher appeal then what we would regard as a Supreme Court in the western model. There is no concept of Habeas Corpus in Afghanistan and the Supreme Court has no power to judge the constitutional validity of legislation.

    There is a national Justice Strategy, but it is probably correct to say that we need to focus more on getting desks chairs and telephones out to courts and staff in the short to medium term and educating judges into the concept of human rights in the longer term.

    The Informal System

    There has been some speculation about focusing more on the informal system of justice (jirgas and shuras) in Afghanistan as a means of enabling the delivery of justice. The two main problems with the informal system are:

    • The system is geared towards conflict resolution and not for delivering justice.
    • There is no fair and transparent means of appeal


    The Stabilising Influence of Justice

    Afghan encounters with the State are very often negative with violence, corruption and limited forms of redress commonplace. The British experience in India (including what is now Pakistan and Bangladesh) was the provision of a transparent and fair legal system was very popular. Whatever the perceived iniquities of the colonial system by the Indians, they recognised that the judicial system benefited them more so then previous local systems, and this made the imposition of (British) government rule much more palatable. How the British introduced their legal system in their colonies and the role it played in maintaining an acceptance of British rule is worthy of greater study.
    Last edited by Red Rat; 07-26-2010 at 08:29 AM.
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Rat View Post
    I was at a briefing on the Afghan legal system a couple of months ago, given by European and Afghan experts on the (Afghan) legal system. To put into context some of the issues regarding the ANP I have included below some of the points that I picked up.
    Who is in charge of constructing a judicial system? Is it still Italy? If so, what exactly are they currently doing about it? Are "useless" written reports still being produced in Rome or are there actual personel in Kabul working on this.

    Initially, when the new government was put into power, Italy was tasked with forming a judicial system. There were simply no results as little work had been done (I read somewhere that a handful of people were sent to Afghanistan to interact with judges and lawyers). That's why I'm curious if they're still in charge of this task, and if so, are they putting forth more effort?
    Last edited by huskerguy7; 07-26-2010 at 03:15 PM. Reason: Typo

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    Default Judicial Reform

    I am not sure who is in charge of the judicial reform now. The consensus at the conference was the model currently being used by the British as part of their counter-narcotics effort whereby they select, train and fund a complete judicial system (police, jails, judges and prosecutors) specifically for counter-narcotics is working reasonably well.

    The Italians had a good plan based on their experience of running a judical system that can cope with pervasive organised crime, but it was under-resourced and there was no impetus to get it established.

    Whether the British counter-narcotics system could be expanded further, perhaps to deal with anti-corruption is another matter. Certainly the British have found it very difficult to keep their counter-narcotics stovepipe clean and untainted.
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    Default A gloomy observation on Afghan training

    A gloomy observation on Afghan training
    SUSAN SACHS
    KABUL— From Saturday's Globe and Mail
    Published Friday, Dec. 31, 2010 6:56PM EST

    In the nine months he worked as senior adviser to the chief of the Border Police, John Brewer relied on a local translator to navigate Afghan culture. Yet the Canadian Mountie spent as much time trying to interpret the actions of foreign forces to equally puzzled Afghans.

    Why, they asked him, did Germany provide their training base with drug-sniffing police dogs but not dog food or kennels? Why would the Americans build a brand new border police headquarters on land with no water? And what should be done with the thousands of donated European radios that do not operate on the same frequency as the Afghan ones?

    His polite response was to suggest that Afghans speak up for themselves and that NATO officers listen to them more. Still, the plain-spoken Superintendent Brewer will admit to some frustration with the waste of time and money through miscommunication. “A lesser man,” he says, “would say it’s pissing in the wind.”

    ...
    They mostly come at night. Mostly.


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    Default The Afghanistan National Police (ANP)

    Copied here for reference.

    Police Mentoring in Afghanistan 2007-2009

    Entry Excerpt:

    Police Mentoring in Afghanistan 2007-2009 by Dr. William Rosenau, Center for Naval Analyses, Strategic Studies Solution Center.

    The role of the police is an important but largely overlooked aspect of contemporary counterinsurgency and stability operations. Although academic and policy specialists have examined the role of police in post-conflict environments, the question of how police should be organized, trained, and equipped for counterinsurgency campaigns has received little systematic attention.
    Similarly, US military doctrine and the professional military literature, while not ignoring the subject entirely, do not consider it in any systematic way. This gap is particularly ironic, given the prominent role that soldiers and Marines have played in training indigenous police and other security forces in counterinsurgency campaigns from Vietnam to Afghanistan.
    If the broader topic of police and counterinsurgency is under-examined, the subject of mentoring—that is, advising and training—foreign police forces is even more neglected. American Marines, soldiers, and other military personnel preparing to deploy to Afghanistan for the police mentoring mission have few sources of information and analysis available to them.
    This monograph addresses that gap. Using a series of ten vignettes, this report examines in depth the experiences of individual American and British soldiers and Marines who served as mentors in Afghanistan during the 2007-2009 period.
    Police Mentoring in Afghanistan 2007-2009 by Dr. William Rosenau, CNA.



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    Default The master of Spin Boldak

    Hat tip to Abu M, who commends this article from Harpers Magazine, December 2009:
    What are the trade-offs for using a character like Col. Raziq? (On the one hand, he is seen as being effective, but on the other hand ... well, anyone who has not yet read the 2009 Matthieu Aikins profile of Raziq for Harper's should.)
    Link:http://www.harpers.org/archive/2009/12/0082754

    The article is about the Afghan Border Police and I have not searched to see if Col. Raziq is still in place.
    davidbfpo

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