All matters Rhodesian / Rhodesia (merged thread)

[davidbfpo]

Cited in part:

The level of technical and tactical innovation and inventiveness also fascinates me. Much of the modern MRAP's history seems to stem from developments in Rhodesia (and South Africa too, possibly to an even greater extent).

There are a couple of books on vehicle development. Rhodesian contacts were proud of their record and as part of the relationship with South Africa gave the SADF full access, even one example of each vehicle. After 1980 IIRC they were amazed to see how much the SADF had developed the concepts further, usually putting them into service in SW Africa (Namibia now) and annoyed they had not been updated.

[Biggus]

If you haven't already read this, here is a start point:

The Pookie - A History of the World's first successful Landmine Detector Carrier - by Dr J.R.T. Wood

The key was this: "The net result was that ZANLA would stop laying landmines on roads regularly swept by the Pookie and lay them elsewhere in the hope that they would not be found before they could achieve their objective."

That's a thoroughly interesting link.

I'd previously only read Dr Wood's Helicopter Warfare: 1962-1980 article and found it very informative. I found it an excellent bit of further reading after Chris Cocks' Fireforce.

There are a couple of books on vehicle development. Rhodesian contacts were proud of their record and as part of the relationship with South Africa gave the SADF full access, even one example of each vehicle. After 1980 IIRC they were amazed to see how much the SADF had developed the concepts further, usually putting them into service in SW Africa (Namibia now) and annoyed they had not been updated.

I'm not surprised at how amazed the Rhodesians would have been at seeing what the South Africans had accomplished. When you consider how quickly things seemed to progress from looking at Pookie prototypes to developing the Bosvark, the Buffel and then the Casspir, it's an incredible achievement. Then to consider how successful both the Buffel and the Casspir have been over the last three decades or more, it's really quite remarkable. They've been quite long-lived vehicles.

[JMA]

I'm not surprised at how amazed the Rhodesians would have been at seeing what the South Africans had accomplished. When you consider how quickly things seemed to progress from looking at Pookie prototypes to developing the Bosvark, the Buffel and then the Casspir, it's an incredible achievement. Then to consider how successful both the Buffel and the Casspir have been over the last three decades or more, it's really quite remarkable. They've been quite long-lived vehicles.

Development in South Africa was parallel where the SAP (police) and the military worked separately with the military retaining the conventional chassis with its suspension system (the Buffel) while the SAP developed the monocoque design used by Konchel in Rhodesia on the Leopard further (into the Casspir).

It should be noted that while Rhodesian vehicles were designed to travel on roads and tracks the South Africans developed vehicles with cross country capability to avoid roads and tracks that could be mined.

Book to read:

Taming the Landmine - by Peter Stiff

[Biggus]

Taming the Landmine - by Peter Stiff

Thank you for the tip.

[flagg]

My interest lies largely with the back to the wall innovation displayed by Rhodesian forces.

My greatest interest lies in Selous Scouts/Special Branch, SAS, and RLI operations....most specifically with external operations conducted by SAS and Selous Scouts.

There have been some great books out in recent years about the conflict.

A recent couple of titles seem well regarded but VERY hard to come by, such as Pittaway's book series on SAS and Selous Scouts:

http://dandy.co.za/

Unfortunately, out of print.

I'd just about sell my soul if I could find a copy of Pittaway's SAS: The Men Speak and especially Selous Scouts: The Men Speak

Recently read Viscount Down and was quite impressed with the book to go along with Ron Reid Daly's Selous Scouts book and Barbara Cole's The Elite.

Just lined up Dennis Croukamp's Bush War book next and waiting for a book on Rhodesian Special Branch.

I wonder how relevant the paramilitary merge between Selous Scouts and Special Branch is in today's climate and the likely future climate?

[JMA]

My interest lies largely with the back to the wall innovation displayed by Rhodesian forces.

My greatest interest lies in Selous Scouts/Special Branch, SAS, and RLI operations....most specifically with external operations conducted by SAS and Selous Scouts.

There have been some great books out in recent years about the conflict.

A recent couple of titles seem well regarded but VERY hard to come by, such as Pittaway's book series on SAS and Selous Scouts:

http://dandy.co.za/

Unfortunately, out of print.

I'd just about sell my soul if I could find a copy of Pittaway's SAS: The Men Speak and especially Selous Scouts: The Men Speak

Recently read Viscount Down and was quite impressed with the book to go along with Ron Reid Daly's Selous Scouts book and Barbara Cole's The Elite.

Just lined up Dennis Croukamp's Bush War book next and waiting for a book on Rhodesian Special Branch.

I wonder how relevant the paramilitary merge between Selous Scouts and Special Branch is in today's climate and the likely future climate?

Hi Flagg,

Had breakfast with Jonathan Pittaway this morning and sadly there are no immediate plans for additional print runs for his SAS and Selous Scouts books. Keep your eyes out on e-bay.

Don't forget the RLI book (proceeds to the Regimental Association):

Africa's Commandos: The Rhodesian Light Infantry

Other books can be found on facebook group: Rhodesian War Books including fiction.

[flagg]

Hi Flagg,

Had breakfast with Jonathan Pittaway this morning and sadly there are no immediate plans for additional print runs for his SAS and Selous Scouts books. Keep your eyes out on e-bay.

Don't forget the RLI book (proceeds to the Regimental Association):

Africa's Commandos: The Rhodesian Light Infantry

Other books can be found on facebook group: Rhodesian War Books including fiction.

I finally got my hands on two Pittaway books: SAS and Selous Scouts.

Both highly recommended. I suspect these books will continue to climb in value due to such low print volume.

Of all the books I have on the respective topics, I reckon these are both the best.

-----

I also just added this one:

Special Branch War, Ed Bird

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1909982342/

[McArthur]

My interest is in the use of pseudo-operations during the Rhodesian Bush War.

Reading about the Selous Scouts prompted me to begin studying pseudo ops, and I've been working (albeit slowly ) on the project for the past year.

- Mac

[davidbfpo]

My interest is in the use of pseudo-operations during the Rhodesian Bush War. Reading about the Selous Scouts prompted me to begin studying pseudo ops, and I've been working (albeit slowly ) on the project for the past year.

- Mac

Mac,

You are not alone in this interest. At one stage quite a few books often with a more military emphasis referred to such tactics aka "dirty tricks", then there was a pause and IIRC a book by an ex-BSAP officer, Ellert being the author, added a lot more. I don't think we know much today, if records existed they have gone and now Rhodesian memories are fading away. In my reading I have yet to encounter the views of the targets, the liberation fighters.

The Ellert book was published in 1989:http://www.amazon.co.uk/Rhodesian-fr...t+%2B+rhodesia