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Thread: Victory Has a Thousand Fathers (by RAND)

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    Council Member carl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidbfpo View Post
    Which I note refers to a paper by David Killcullen.
    Boy did I like that paper by Kilcullen and Gorka. Especially the last paragraph which says (my paraphrase)-quit fooling around with trying to pick the correct field manual, doctrine and label to apply, find out who is fighting you, why they are fighting you then figure out what to do.
    "We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene

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    Quote Originally Posted by carl View Post
    Boy did I like that paper by Kilcullen and Gorka. Especially the last paragraph which says (my paraphrase)-quit fooling around with trying to pick the correct field manual, doctrine and label to apply, find out who is fighting you, why they are fighting you then figure out what to do.
    And because soldiers are rotated through Afghanistan so rapidly they will never fully understand who is fighting them and why. Forget about the rest. So what you see is the experts (6 months in country) trying to teach those preparing for a first tour what to do and expect in the great tradition of the blind leading the blind.

    The war is lost. All that remains to be seen is just how badly.

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    Council Member carl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMA View Post
    The war is lost. All that remains to be seen is just how badly.
    You may be right. I remain hopeful though. I have great confidence in the ability of the guys on the spot to figure something out. And remember too, a lot of those guys have multiple tours.
    "We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene

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    Quote Originally Posted by carl View Post
    You may be right. I remain hopeful though. I have great confidence in the ability of the guys on the spot to figure something out. And remember too, a lot of those guys have multiple tours.
    A couple of points. You don't have to wait for the fat lady to sing before you know its over. Generally they (the politicians and the generals) start to fudge the aim/mission in relation to the horrible truth that is beginning to dawn. Then the "guys on the spot" just don't have the power to really influence policy/strategy/tactics at any more than a very local level. Finally the gap between tours make true and effective continuity of manpower impossible. Sometimes a soldier carrying forward outdated experiences from the past is more of a liability than a fresh one who tends to suck in the knowledge like a dry sponge and adapt quicker.

    You don't know how much I wish I was wrong, this is a head and a heart thing.
    Last edited by JMA; 04-08-2011 at 04:04 PM.

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