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Old 11-24-2011   #501
Surferbeetle
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Shamelessly lifted from Zero Hedge although I have seen this chestnut elsewhere...

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It is the month of August, on the shores of the Black Sea. It is raining, and the little town looks totally deserted.

It is tough times, everybody is in debt, and everybody lives on credit.

Suddenly, a rich tourist comes to town.

He enters the only hotel, lays a 100 Euro note on the reception counter, and goes to inspect the rooms upstairs in order to pick one.

The hotel proprietor takes the 100 Euro note and runs to pay his debt to the butcher.

The Butcher takes the 100 Euro note, and runs to pay his debt to the pig grower.

The pig grower takes the 100 Euro note, and runs to pay his debt to the supplier of his feed and fuel.

The supplier of feed and fuel takes the 100 Euro note and runs to pay his debt to the town's prostitute that in these hard times, gave her "services" on credit.

The hooker runs to the hotel, and pays off her debt with the 100 Euro note to the hotel proprietor to pay for the rooms that she rented when she brought her clients there.

The hotel proprietor then lays the 100 Euro note back on the counter so that the rich tourist will not suspect anything.

At that moment, the rich tourist comes down after inspecting the rooms, and takes his 100 Euro note, after saying that he did not like any of the rooms, and leaves town.

No one earned anything. However, the whole town is now without debt, and looks to the future with a lot of optimism.

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is how the governments of the world are doing business today.
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Old 11-24-2011   #502
Presley Cannady
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Originally Posted by Bill Moore View Post
What are the other parameters?
Any number of covariant indicators depending on the model and what the modeler believes to improve the predictive power. Space, liquidity of the instrument, temperature, rainfall, salinity, underlying instruments, etc.

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Are you making an argument that markets are rational and predictable?
"Rational" is a teleological concern; I don't really care if markets are rational or not. They are conditionally predictable.

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Your use of value is technically correct, but I was referring to value as value to society (goods and/or services), and a lot of the market action today has nothing to do with that type of value.
That definition of value, if I'm reading you correctly, is subjective and useless.

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Got it, that is just the way it is, that is how the system evolved so those in the know can make a lot of money that is often disassociated with the true value of a company's goods and services.
In other words, "true value" is some subjective measure taken that permits you to sustain the argument that the take extracted in its trade is unjustified.

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The system still works if you look at from the optic of the stock's value, and not the underlying value of the company.
Objectively, there's no difference between the two. A stock price measures an aggregate demand, just as the price of an exchange traded derivative measures aggregate expectation of performance.

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Artifically determined value is a loaded phrase, agreed...
Specifically since it relies solely on your subjective estimation of value.

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...but there have been instances when stock prices have been "artifically" manipulated (in clear violation of the law).
I mug you and take $50 dollars from you. Cops never find me. Have I artificially manipulated my cash pile by $50, or is that $50 real enough to buy a surf and turf dinner?

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This has always happened, but it seems logical that the risks are greater now due to globalism and the coorisponding ability to move money rapidly around the globe. It may be impossible for governments to effectively regulate this behavior.
Governments have been losing to commerce since the ratio of subject to flatfoot went above 10 to 1. Which is why the most heavily regulated economies--totalitarian ones--rely on collective and arbitrary depredation to keep black markets from thoroughly overwhelming their veneer of control.

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Are you the author of a "Random Walk on Wall Street"?
Nada; and I try as often as possible to steer people away from pop finance and economics books.

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Agreed again, but at least it seemed that market conditions were somewhat more predictable then, and if the old rules no longer apply, what has changed? Why has it changed? And is that change good?
There's no evidence that the market is more volatile today than it was in previous years. Our understanding of volatility has improved, which may contribute to the spectrum running from mere insecurity to outright panic over more visible fluctuation.
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Old 11-27-2011   #503
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Default The next revolution - whining and complaining

I do agree with the first part of the original post - that Washington (both sides) are completely out of touch with "us".

Still, I think the next revolution will be one of "whining and complaining" as the number of entitlement recipients is strategically increased to a critical mass.

Just like any junkie, once you're on the drug (in this case the dole) then the pusher owns you. You think whatever and do whatever to keep the supply coming cuz' cold turkey ain't no fun at all.
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Old 07-05-2013   #504
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Default Update On The Revolution By Bill Ayers!

Update on the coming American Revolution by former Weatherman Scumbag and friend of the current occupant of the WH......Bill Ayers......As they say dreams never die.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHN7qcwGDBI
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Old 07-16-2013   #505
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Default Adult Warning Some Offensive Language

The home version of 4GW. A clash of cultures.
But it was on national TV so I thought it was OK to post. Rachel Jeantel explains the difference between Nigg@@ and Nigg@@. Notice the reference to Generations!


http://www.mediaite.com/tv/rachel-je...-piers-morgan/
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Old 07-17-2013   #506
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Default Social Engineering Higher Calling Of Treyvon Martin Attorneys

As the 4GW Cultural war continue here is a Link to FOX a news interview where Jasmine Rand (Treyvon Martin family Attorney)admits to higher calling of SOCIAL ENGINEERING!Great job of Greta Van Sustren on how our Justice system is not perfect but we have the best Justice system ever created.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qhhnNw6UaU
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Old 07-18-2013   #507
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Originally Posted by slapout9 View Post
we have the best Justice system ever created.
Sarcasm?
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Old 07-18-2013   #508
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Sarcasm?
You jest? What system in the world can be better than one that:

1. Privatizes part of its prison system not only to gain efficiency, but to produce financial incentives to put more people in prison? And it is so successful they lobby Congress to produce tougher laws to keep prisoners in jail longer? Only the Chinese have more people in prison than we do, so maybe their system is better, but we're darn close to being the best!

2. What system can be better than one where the outcome of case can be manipulated the media even before the trial begins? Put enough media pressure on the system and we can bend the legal process to appease the crowds whether they're yelling for blood or to free someone.

3. What system can be better than one that recognizes a white collar worker on Wall Street getting caught with Cocaine is relatively minor, but a young, poor black kid caught with a little crack a few blocks away will have to hard time?

4. I can't think of a more rational system than one where the federal government removes the ability for the judge to determine appropriate sentences based on the total context of the crime and person. We're so superior we removed judgment from the legal process by mandating stiff minimal sentences for minor illegal drug charges and the favorite "three times and your out."

Its perfect in every way, and once marked as a criminal they're always felons, which makes it harder to get a job, easier to get back in prison, and that in turn creates more profits for our privatized prison system, which creates a larger tax base (if they pay taxes), produces more jobs, and more lobbyist groups to further influence the legal system.

It's the bestest system ever.
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Old 07-18-2013   #509
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Perhaps our justice system is a bit like democracy - the worst possible system except for every other system.

Rule of law is a relatively easy task; justice however is an elusive commodity to achieve in the best of systems.
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"The modern COIN mindset is when one arrogantly goes to some foreign land and attempts to make those who live there a lesser version of one's self. The FID mindset is when one humbly goes to some foreign land and seeks first to understand, and then to help in some small way for those who live there to be the best version of their own self." Colonel Robert C. Jones, US Army Special Forces (Retired)
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Old 07-18-2013   #510
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Originally Posted by Bob's World View Post
the worst possible system except for every other system.
You probably didn't compare with a lot of other systems, though.

Few if any Western European justice systems come close to piling up so much fail.

The U.S. justice system is a strong contender for the worst justice system in the First World.

For starters, I don't recall any West European justice system executing innocents. I also don't recall them producing such a stark contrast between criminals who can afford a lawyer and those who cannot. I just stumbled over this today; one really needs to close one's eyes to not learn about such defects.

I've also never heard of any European getting sent to jail for 20 years because she fired a warning shot.
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Old 07-18-2013   #511
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I've also never heard of any European getting sent to jail for 20 years because she fired a warning shot.
You’re underinformed on that one [LINK].

The rest of your comments I largely agree with.
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Old 07-18-2013   #512
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Fuchs,

As I clearly implied, we are far from perfect, but I have to wonder, is your condemnation of the American legal system, or of the European media freedom?? ��
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"The modern COIN mindset is when one arrogantly goes to some foreign land and attempts to make those who live there a lesser version of one's self. The FID mindset is when one humbly goes to some foreign land and seeks first to understand, and then to help in some small way for those who live there to be the best version of their own self." Colonel Robert C. Jones, US Army Special Forces (Retired)
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Old 07-18-2013   #513
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Default It Is Based On Responsible Citizenship

Despite the fact that every Communist Revolutionary Warfare propaganda technique was used to pollute the facts of the case before trial.The fact that a jury of adults listened to the evidence and then followed the law and came to the only proper conclusion possible shows how well the system works as long as it is in the hands of educated adults. This system will only work when all citizens are properly educated in their responsibilities to make the system work.
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Old 07-18-2013   #514
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Originally Posted by Bill Moore View Post
You jest? What system in the world can be better than one that:

1. Privatizes part of its prison system not only to gain efficiency, but to produce financial incentives to put more people in prison? And it is so successful they lobby Congress to produce tougher laws to keep prisoners in jail longer? Only the Chinese have more people in prison than we do, so maybe their system is better, but we're darn close to being the best!

2. What system can be better than one where the outcome of case can be manipulated the media even before the trial begins? Put enough media pressure on the system and we can bend the legal process to appease the crowds whether they're yelling for blood or to free someone.

3. What system can be better than one that recognizes a white collar worker on Wall Street getting caught with Cocaine is relatively minor, but a young, poor black kid caught with a little crack a few blocks away will have to hard time?

4. I can't think of a more rational system than one where the federal government removes the ability for the judge to determine appropriate sentences based on the total context of the crime and person. We're so superior we removed judgment from the legal process by mandating stiff minimal sentences for minor illegal drug charges and the favorite "three times and your out."

Its perfect in every way, and once marked as a criminal they're always felons, which makes it harder to get a job, easier to get back in prison, and that in turn creates more profits for our privatized prison system, which creates a larger tax base (if they pay taxes), produces more jobs, and more lobbyist groups to further influence the legal system.

It's the bestest system ever.
Bill, most of what you point out are not defects in the Justice system of Cops, Lawyers and Judges it is a defect in the LEGISLATIVE system. I never made any Laws I just enforced them. Most people becuase of poor citizenship training do not pay any attention to how our laws are made or which Laws are being made....many don't even know how they are made.
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Old 07-21-2013   #515
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Default Political Correctness: The Control Of Though And Speech

Bill Lind Speech from 1998 on Political Correctness. Notice the video tape subtitle "Next Revolution". Also PC is well documented as a Communist Subversion Technique.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...Gctxe81E#at=33
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Old 07-21-2013   #516
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Originally Posted by slapout9 View Post
Bill, most of what you point out are not defects in the Justice system of Cops, Lawyers and Judges it is a defect in the LEGISLATIVE system. I never made any Laws I just enforced them. Most people becuase of poor citizenship training do not pay any attention to how our laws are made or which Laws are being made....many don't even know how they are made.
I'm not talking about our judicial system, but our legal system, which is consists of multiple systems including our legislative system. I can't see the logic of separating the legislative process from the discussion if that is where the majority of the fault lies (in your opinion)? I think activist judges are equally at fault, and this all ties into your arguments about political correctness.

As for political correctness the Soviets were masters at infiltrating and manipulating our universities, and while they'll deny it to the very end our COINdistas are largely a product of the political correctness agenda they pushed. Most of us are aware of the book burnings, speech control and other Nazi like measures employed by the far left, but we would mistaken not to recognize that the Christian Right also promotes a form of political correctness. Both are dangers to our Constitution. If a middle America exists that doesn't want government interfering in their personal affairs and beliefs they better start mobilizing politically before left and right wing social engineers destroy the beliefs imbued in our Constitution. If the middle is to weak or apathetic to make a stand then we deserve the government we get.
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