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Thread: Courageous Restraint "Hold fire, earn a medal"

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  1. #1
    Council Member Greyhawk's Avatar
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    Default Hold some of the fire...

    A quote from the first news story I saw on the topic:

    NATO commanders are not planning to create a new medal or military decoration for "courageous restraint," but instead are looking at ways of using existing awards to recognize soldiers who go to great lengths to avoid civilian casualties, Hall said.
    And a more recent one from General McChrystal:
    Q General... Is it true that you are contemplating -- awarding some sort of special honor for soldiers who make a special effort to avoid civilian casualties?
    GEN. MCCHRYSTAL: ...The issue of courage -- we have a number of ways to recognize courage in uniform. And I think courage in uniform can come under enemy fire in the most traditional ways, or it can come under actions that may not be as expected or as traditional -- involve killing the enemy; it may involve protecting civilians.
    There's a great photograph from the Marja operation. I think it's a U.S. Marine shielding an Afghan man and an Afghan child with his own body. He wasn't shooting anyone; he didn't kill any Taliban; but I would argue that he showed as much courage as any that I've seen on the battlefield.
    So when we talk about courage, I think -- I don't think we need a different medal to differentiate different kinds of courage.
    And one from Rush Limbaugh
    I'm up to speed on it now. So we're going to have courageous military medal for showing restraint... I can just see the ceremony. Obama at the White House presenting the Distinguished Yellow Cross.
    That last one included here as only as explanation why this is suddenly getting attention a week after the first stories appeared.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob's World View Post
    I think it might be getting over played and twisted a bit by those who have heard the words, but lack the context.
    I've heard that same point made by others over there, even before Rush chimed in...

    Quote Originally Posted by Schmedlap View Post
    If the only way that leaders can influence Soldiers is to promise them awards for doing their jobs, then they're not really leaders.
    True.

    So... Company Commander A in village A engages local leaders, establishes rapport, gets through a tour pretty much unscratched. In fact, never fires a shot. Over in village B Company Commander B experiences constant kinetic activity, high casualty rates...

    End of tour. You're the Btn Commander. Who went "above and beyond?" How do you recognize them for it?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greyhawk View Post
    So... Company Commander A in village A engages local leaders, establishes rapport, gets through a tour pretty much unscratched. In fact, never fires a shot. Over in village B Company Commander B experiences constant kinetic activity, high casualty rates...

    End of tour. You're the Btn Commander. Who went "above and beyond?" How do you recognize them for it?
    Is this really a quandary? Again, five years ago, a platoon in my battalion caught heat... not for restraint, but for over-aggressiveness. I'm not kidding when I say this: they were put on "time-out" (the CO's exact words). They were stood down for three days to review their SOPs, do maintenance, and pull PB security. The PL never lived it down. It was a black mark. Once again, five years ago.

    Who went "above and beyond"? Whomever got the best results, given the situation that they were handed. Kind of similar to what, in the financial world, they call "alpha".

  3. #3
    Council Member Ken White's Avatar
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    Default Not enough information.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greyhawk View Post
    And one from Rush Limbaugh
    Why, Greyhawk, I'm surprised you listen to him. Never heard the guy speak, m'self.

    But then I tend to ignore all the taking heads as they rarely contribute much.
    That last one included here as only as explanation why this is suddenly getting attention a week after the first stories appeared.
    Perhaps you're correct but I'm more inclined to blame sloppy main stream media reporting and editing added to civilian lack of knowledge. As Bob's World said, out of context...
    So... Company Commander A in village A engages local leaders, establishes rapport, gets through a tour pretty much unscratched. In fact, never fires a shot. Over in village B Company Commander B experiences constant kinetic activity, high casualty rates...

    End of tour. You're the Btn Commander. Who went "above and beyond?" How do you recognize them for it?
    Not nearly enough info. Did the rapport actually accomplish anything or did it just exist? How kinetic was it, who initiated most of the contacts and how well did he do in the fights he had?

    The real questions that Bn Cdr must answer have little to do with those two variables which are really sort of meaningless, rather they have to do with how well each did his job in totality for the deployment given the situations (plural) with which he had to deal. Their Cdr has all sorts of methods of rewarding -- or punishing, if warranted -- performance ranging from OERs (unimportant to some, vital to others) to hero badges (same discrimination criteria apply) to a slap on the back (always appreciated unless the Cdr is an @$*hole). Hopefully he knows his people, knows where their buttons are, knows what's important and does not have too much "help" from above...

    And, most importantly; is fair.

    Or we could use the simple or Ranger solution -- Bronze Stars for both and a "V" for the more kinetic locale.

    Added: Apologies to Schmedlap, somehow I missed his intervening post. I coulda just said "What he said."
    Last edited by Ken White; 05-16-2010 at 02:36 AM. Reason: Addendum

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    Council Member MikeF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greyhawk View Post
    So... Company Commander A in village A engages local leaders, establishes rapport, gets through a tour pretty much unscratched. In fact, never fires a shot. Over in village B Company Commander B experiences constant kinetic activity, high casualty rates...
    That sounds so simple in a classroom. It is logical and rational. It makes sense. I would caution that there are so many other scenarios. I will give you mine as a company commander. This is one of the times that it's good that I use my real name. Others can verify or just say he's full of crap .

    As a commander, I had a wealth of contacts and friends within the villages. I engaged in and out everyday with the various elders. As it were, I was in a highly kinetic area, and I became one of the most violent commanders in Diyala Province. The Iraqis called my IA CDR and I the Lions of Diyala. The Americans called us the War Machine. In that area, we had the fewest casualties.

    There are so many different scenarios in war.

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