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| Historians The practice of history, and historical analysis. See FAQ for where to discuss history relevant to other forums. |
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#81 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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I'm not sure the process is illusory as much as fragile and at times reversible? On the doctrine stuff--about which I know next to nothing if not less--I am interested in "options" as mentioned above and for two reasons: 1. The military doesn't get to choose and needs to be prepared, and 2. The intellectual study of "options" countering an insurgency may help us in other ways, lead to other lines of productive inquiry, something like that. At any rate, FWIW. I don't know, maybe if I were drinking rum I might not be so confused about all of this.... |
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#82 | ||
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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Steven Metz, World Politics Review
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That's it for me--for now--because it seems that I am becoming some sort of council and blog commenting addict, which is just weird.... |
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#83 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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I don't believe I've posted this upthread, but, if have, my apologies. Interesting reading:
Counterinsurgency: Strategy and The Phoenix of American Capability http://www.strategicstudiesinstitute....cfm?pubID=333 Especially "in retrospect" and all that.... |
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#84 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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So I am years and years behind everyone else around here, it seems.
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http://ricks.foreignpolicy.com/posts...urgency_manual Last edited by Madhu; 08-14-2012 at 02:03 PM. |
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#85 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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I've always wondered about the origin of the term "capacity building" and its relation to Thomas Barnett's SysAdmin, Kilcullen's proposed global "CORDS" (via the Counterinsurgency book linked above), etc? From the UN originally?
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What was the scholarship or whatever behind the UNDP definition? Anyone know? I'm just curious, that's all. I like to know where terms come from and the intellectual genesis. |
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#86 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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Quote:
Hmmm, did all of this stuff start "embedding" itself in your military doctrine during the 90s, when we started to think about a post Soviet world and our peacekeeping duties as the main purpose of the American Army? Loaded question, I know, I know. Just wondering how it all "came about". |
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#87 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 419
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BTW, the methods used in Bosnia etc. were exactly the methods that the Rumsfeld Defense Department were working hard to avoid during the planning for Iraq. Might be part of the reason we were so far behind the power curve (but only part).
__________________
"I can change almost anything ... but I can't change human nature." Jon Osterman/Dr. Manhattan --- A plan without action is a Daydream, Action without a plan is a Nightmare. Chinese Proverb --- "There is no Good and Evil, there is only Power, and those who are too weak to seek it" Lord Voldemort Last edited by TheCurmudgeon; 08-14-2012 at 04:03 PM. |
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#88 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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Has anyone at the Council noted the similarity between The Ugly American and Three Cups of Tea (haven't reviewed this thread in some time, perhaps it's somewhere here already....) |
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#89 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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#90 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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Quote:
I am adding this title to the thread because I asked up thread when certain language seemed to become standard, especially in doctrinal writing and thinking. A lot of current military/stability/development thinking might come from the 90s-era stability assignments and development theory of that period? Around the time of MOOTW? Well, I don't know. Continue to be intellectually curious about all of this. Last edited by Madhu; 11-14-2012 at 12:55 PM. Reason: Added sentence "a lot of...." |
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#91 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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This has sort of morphed into a catch-all for international aid criticism but developmental and humanitarian aid seem to be important parts of international peace-keeping so I'll keep at it:
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I suppose for intellectual honesty's sake I ought to go dig up articles by critics of the aid critics.... |
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#92 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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I proposed that the Mortenson book Three Cups of Tea was this generation's The Ugly American upthread but the following is a post with a different view:
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On the other hand, I'm not sure that the two points are that far off. What does development mean and what is its place within "stabilization" operations, military or civilian? Perhaps the first question is whether to "do" development or not, does it help or hinder progress, however progress is defined? http://kingsofwar.org.uk/2012/11/flo...longer-useful/ Last edited by Madhu; 11-27-2012 at 03:17 PM. Reason: changed block quote |
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#93 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 100
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Quote:
So, supposedly, the Army had forgotten lessons learned in Vietnam about counterinsurgency. But the topic was kept alive, especially because the Army had an internal argument about who really lost the war and why? I wonder if the better understanding is that the methodical institutional STUDY stopped, rather than it was entirely forgotten. Better lesson learned: study on such topics must continue institutionally and be kept intellectually alive and informed by current developments? Intellectual study is a living thing, not simply a "lessons learned" thing? The American military "Insurgents" (Kaplan book), then, had a point about unpreparedness regarding counterinsurgency but their ideas off the page did not bear fruit? I personally still think we paid a price for not reviewing our own complicated history in South Asia, especially Afghanistan and Pakistan. (I don't generally talk about Iraq around here because I am not as comfortable with that topic). I hope the institution corrects that error and studies its own history and its own SELF (if you see what I mean) in South Asia and China so that there is a better understanding of the region. If outside experts or State Department Hands are used, then something important is missing and a DC group think will continue about various regions, IMO. Some of the reading lists around here, on the larger strategic view of regions, is a bit worrisome. I will add to those articles at a later date. Each institution with its own rigorous understanding may help. Last edited by Madhu; 04-29-2013 at 03:12 PM. Reason: Corrections and added last sentence |
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