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Forum Organization? | Main / All | Participant Communities | Conflicts | Military Functions | Small Wars COI | Members Only |
| Adversary / Threat One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. Talk about (or with?) them. |
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#1 | |
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Small Wars Journal
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Virginia
Posts: 3,885
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Just saw this post on Lightfighter Tactical Forum - Islamist Website Instructs Mujahideen in Using Popular U.S. Web Forums to Foster Anti-War Sentiment Among Americans.
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#2 |
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i pwnd ur ooda loop
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: North Shore of Indiana
Posts: 1,844
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It's nice to see this percolating to the surface finally. Want to bet it is ignored by just about everybody? Every time I've mentioned to anybody this as an information operations weapon I get told it can't be happening. Despite the evidence that the Democrats used the same techniques during the last presidential election cycle.
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Sam Liles Selil Blog Don't forget to duck Secret Squirrel The scholarship of teaching and learning results in equal hatred from latte leftists and cappuccino conservatives. |
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#3 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Rancho La Espada, Blanchard, OK
Posts: 902
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This is a really sophisticated approach to PSYOP that will be nearly impossible to counter. The best we can do is mitigate the impact.
That said, I could not find the full article on the link to MEMRI. Can anybody give me a cite that I can get to. thanks John |
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#4 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 72
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Let's get "capitalistic" with this! By that I mean there is one product out there with very little competition. We can "flip" their position and relative strength quite easily by creating our own parallel slickness. We have the ability to mass produce ANYTHING and with all of the multi media capabilities we possess I don't see why there arent four or five American-made and American "spun" DVDs in every Iraqi home. Best way to break a monopoly is to introduce competition into the mix.
I dont see why we have to just do damage control on this one, we can actually win this war... now we just need to enlist our finest media personnel to institute a massive spin campaign that will influence the minds of millions and impact the decisions of... wait a minute I think they are already on the job, but they are not working for us. If our media put as much attention into helping our cause as they do hating Bush this would BE OVER WITH. |
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#5 | |||||
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 3,420
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Quote:
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Hey, it worked in WWII.Quote:
![]() Nah, you don't want broadcast media, what you want is a bunch of disgruntled teenagers who have forgotten more about the net than 99% of broadcast personnel ever knew! Quote:
! More seriously, the best way to handle the problem is to bypass the broadcast media and work directly on the population; especially the under 20 population.Marc
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Sic Bisquitus Disintegrat... Marc W.D. Tyrrell, Ph.D. Institute of Interdisciplinary Studies, Senior Research Fellow, The Canadian Centre for Intelligence and Security Studies, NPSIA Carleton University http://marctyrrell.com/ Last edited by marct; 04-04-2007 at 06:35 PM. Reason: corrected URL |
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#6 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 3,420
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John,
The original thread is listed as http://www.mohajroon.com/vb/showthread.php?t=48233 but I am getting a database error when I try to connect to it. Marc
__________________
Sic Bisquitus Disintegrat... Marc W.D. Tyrrell, Ph.D. Institute of Interdisciplinary Studies, Senior Research Fellow, The Canadian Centre for Intelligence and Security Studies, NPSIA Carleton University http://marctyrrell.com/ |
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#7 | |
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i pwnd ur ooda loop
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: North Shore of Indiana
Posts: 1,844
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Quote:
It's interesting but the people who really understand the medium of information age weapons are all in their late 30's and 40's. The teenyboppers are consumers not developers. Must agree on bypassing mainstream media. With the web you can do that.
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Sam Liles Selil Blog Don't forget to duck Secret Squirrel The scholarship of teaching and learning results in equal hatred from latte leftists and cappuccino conservatives. |
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#8 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 72
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Quote:
As an example I had a guy in my platoon who was from the rural Midwest. He was a teen when he came into the Corps and he went to RadBn... he already knew (almost) everything his courses taught him and even offered tricks to the SNCO's who taught them. I got this from a crusty career Gunny who ended up becoming his platoon sergeant. Once this kid applied the Marine Corps standard to the knowledge base he already POSSESSED he was unstoppable. There are 18-20 year old communications geniuses (Comm "Guru's") that knew everything they needed before they even enlisted. They are some who are now solidly in their 20's and are making six figures, doing what they did in the Corps, which is actually what they did BEFORE the Corps. How many of our teenyboppers use their time in the service simply so they can establish some bona fides to develop a resume that says they are qualified to know what they already knew? While I would concede that the people who understand the most about the application of information age weapons are the 30-40 set, the ones who understand the best are in the 10-20 set. Last edited by Ender; 04-04-2007 at 11:38 PM. |
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#9 |
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i pwnd ur ooda loop
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: North Shore of Indiana
Posts: 1,844
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Ender,
We'll likley have to agree to disagree. The principle of using a specific case as cited in your example of the comm guru to a general population of teenagers doesn't hold up logically. My experience is that the guru's entering my classes have "silo's" of information that can be applied. They don't have the broad foundation of knowledge needed to operate across multiple operating systems, network topoologies/architectures, or enviroments. On average I have about 80 vetted, motivated, cream of the crop students in information assurance and security topics a semester. Of those about three are truly uber geeks, and of that there is maybe one who has a good understanding of cyber warfare. The mental change from citizen to warrior is still needed to have the mental "bend" to use a tool for whacking people. This semesters future god of war is a former Army Sgt mother of a couple rug rats who is going to be a force to be reckoned with.
__________________
Sam Liles Selil Blog Don't forget to duck Secret Squirrel The scholarship of teaching and learning results in equal hatred from latte leftists and cappuccino conservatives. |
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#10 | ||
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Council Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 72
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Sam,
No need for that. I can be persuaded by superior logic and experience! Quote:
Quote:
Joel Last edited by Ender; 04-05-2007 at 02:37 AM. |
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#11 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Rancho La Espada, Blanchard, OK
Posts: 902
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First, thanks Marc for the cite. I just wanted to be absolutely sure that it wasn't bogus.
My point on countering the propaganda strategy was not a technical one. Sure, we can find multiple ways to cover cyberspace as well as the more conventional airwaves. The problem, as I see it, is the message strategy itself. Consider what these jihadis are recommending. Pass yourself off as an American. Sow dissent about the government and its policy on the basis of all the legitimate arguments made by the anti-war crowd. Do not talk about Islam, Jihad, or the cause... The counter - which really can only mitigate the impact of that message - is to get your side of the story out in the same media, especially cyberspace. But the USG is limited by law in doing so. It cannot lawfully conduct even "White" propaganda operations targeted on Americans, let alone the kind of "gray" or "black" propaganda this kind of counterpropaganda operation needs. We, as individuals or as private groups can do so, but do we have the time or willingness to hunt down the kinds of websites the jihadis are talking about? The best I can do is to call the attention of my class on National Security Policy to this website (which I have already done) and now to this thread (which I will do tomorrow). That will put a few civilian 20 somethings into the loop... |
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#12 | |||
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Council Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 3,420
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Hi John,
Quote:
Quote:
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). If you conduct the strategy based on a philosophical set of core values such as individual choice and responsibility, the advantages of a social contract to agree to disagree, and the benefits to all members of society in multiple viewpoints exchanging ideas in a free and open dialogue, then it is not, technically, propaganda.Actually, this is something that is already happening with the spread of blogs and net 2.0 software. All I am suggesting as a general strategy is to make certain that particular viewpoints are expressed and provide factual support for those viewpoints. The nice thing about this strategy, if it can be implemented, is that it a) serves to strengthen philosophical core values and b) counters large parts of the irhabi subversion. Marc
__________________
Sic Bisquitus Disintegrat... Marc W.D. Tyrrell, Ph.D. Institute of Interdisciplinary Studies, Senior Research Fellow, The Canadian Centre for Intelligence and Security Studies, NPSIA Carleton University http://marctyrrell.com/ |
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