Ill Informed Blog Post at AM on Advisors

[Old Eagle]

Ken --

FORSCOM, as the Army's force generation HQ, has the mission to provide trained and ready forces to the warfighting commands, so they write the standards.

Jill --

The Joint Center for International Security Force Assistance coordinates among all the various advisor training activities. In fact, they are developing an interactive webtool on their website that allows trainers at all sites to access curricula and classes from other training centers. Doesn't solve all the problems, but it's a major step in the right direction.

[Ken White]

Ken --
FORSCOM, as the Army's force generation HQ, has the mission to provide trained and ready forces to the warfighting commands, so they write the standards..

I'm aware of their mission and having participated directly for a lot of long hours in that force generation effort during Desert Shield and Storm know that then the gaining GCC provided the tasks and standards; FORSCOM merely executed. I know things change but one expects the changes to be progress, not regression.

I understand FORSCOM involvement on location selection (though I question whether today with ACSIM there should be such a thing as a 'FORSCOM' or 'TRADOC' post...) and operational entity (as Riley/1 ID vs. JRTC) but other than as executor for templating TRADOC doctrine over CentCom requirements at unit level seems to me that their imposing standards is merely job justification???

An added question. Even accepting FORSCOM standard setting for units, am I to understand that the Advisory Teams are considered FORSCOM elements until they chop over to CentCom? The Teams were the focus of my question, while I think the setting of standards is a bit much, I can understand some FORSCOM involvement with units in the generation and deployment process. I'm unsure what their relationship with the Teams happens to be.

Sorry to be a pain, just trying to get a feel for what's happening.

[Ski]

Since Riley is a FORSCOM post and 1/1 is a FORSCOM unit, FORSCOM gets to write the task list.

The tast list was just revised two weeks ago at a conference...it is going to be MUCH shorter from what I have heard. There was a roughly 65% growth in training tasks from OIF II to OIF whatever it is today (8-10?) and a lot of people were getting pissed off - the list kept growing and it almost never shortened. A lot of tasks were part of normal METL training anyway, so those were eliminated.

[Ken White]

Since Riley is a FORSCOM post and 1/1 is a FORSCOM unit, FORSCOM gets to write the task list.

That tells me what is happening as did Hacksaw (so I knew that); my question was why is it happening. The fact that the 1st ID, a nominal FORSCOM organization is doing the training is not remotely germane to the development of the task list for elements bound for a theater, those are a GCC call and FORSCOM has no business complicating the issue by adding their thoughts (and CYA concerns). Doctrinally, FORSCOM just has no business sticking their nose into it (nor much reason for existing IMO and based on long experience with them -- but that's another thread)

The tast list was just revised two weeks ago at a conference...it is going to be MUCH shorter from what I have heard. There was a roughly 65% growth in training tasks from OIF II to OIF whatever it is today (8-10?) and a lot of people were getting pissed off - the list kept growing and it almost never shortened. A lot of tasks were part of normal METL training anyway, so those were eliminated.

Bureaucracy in action. My sympathy to all involved -- and that's not a snark, it's a serious dose of real sympathy...

Edited to add: Since 1/1 is doing the training, they have every right to tamper with the task list but FORSCOM should have auth dir coord w/CentCom for that adjustment. Oh, wait...

[Ski]

Ken

FORSCOM became the force provider for ALL Army units a few years ago, and that's why they are so involved in the process. Doesn't matter what kind of unit - outside of the SOF community.

That task list is not just FORSOM, it also eminates from CENTCOM, ARCENT/3rdArmy, HQDA and TRADOC. All of that kluged together has made for an exceptionally painful DMETL.

The best quote of the conference was from an 06 from HQDA :"Are we really this ####ing stupid?" Uh, yes, we are.

[Ken White]

Thanks for the expansion. Er, that is thank you . The apparent facts of the expansion don't fill me with glee...

Ken

FORSCOM became the force provider for ALL Army units a few years ago, and that's why they are so involved in the process. Doesn't matter what kind of unit - outside of the SOF community.

They've always been the big Daddy for everyone that wasn't totally stovepiped -- that's not new. What apparently is new is that a 4-button Hq is getting down in the weeds; even under the weeds for either justification, covering or meddling purposes Whatever happened to delegating authority? Trusting subordinates? Deconfliction of tangled responsibilities?

All of Which leads to your very apt quote:

The best quote of the conference was from an 06 from HQDA :"Are we really this ####ing stupid?" Uh, yes, we are.

Sigh, again. This is all a plot to make my gray hair go away so I look like Tom and Steve...

[wm]

Thanks for the expansion. Er, that is thank you . The apparent facts of the expansion don't fill me with glee...They've always been the big Daddy for everyone that wasn't totally stovepiped -- that's not new. What apparently is new is that a 4-button Hq is getting down in the weeds; even under the weeds for either justification, covering or meddling purposes Whatever happened to delegating authority? Trusting subordinates? Deconfliction of tangled responsibilities?

All of Which leads to your very apt quote:Sigh, again. This is all a plot to make my gray hair go away so I look like Tom and Steve...

My ages past experience with Farcecom was always that their 4 button needed to meddle in what were more properly the affairs of division and bde commanders. But that was back in the days when Fort McPherson held sway over the CONUS portions of REFORGER and chopped on every OPLAN/CONPLAN TPFDDL.