Not a bad place to be stuck----have learned a bit lately from others.Originally Posted by Stan
It appears that a good portion of the SBU is still functioning and supporting the government---a really good article on the Russian activities inside the Ukraine that the SBU is picking up on.
Wish the NSA/CIA would release as much as the SBU is releasing to the mass media.
http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukra...on-343855.html
The old and the new
An interesting, short commentary by Anne Applebaum, the sub-title says it all:As a historian, with a book on the Ukraine, she writes well:Forget D-Day or “shock and awe.” The Kremlin is reinventing invasions with thugs, criminals, and lies.Link:http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...ow_russia.htmlMany of these tactics are familiar, though we haven’t seen them for a long time..... (Russian)slick modern media—is genuinely new, so much so that it’s fair to say we are witnessing a new kind of war, and a new kind of invasion.
davidbfpo
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...ro-russia-sideProtesters say that after the soldiers were given food and water and had a "nice conversation" with residents, Russian flags were raised on the vehicles and they went "rolling off to Slovyansk."
Perhaps sending MRE's was exactly what the Ukrainians needed, since all it takes is a little food to get their Soldiers to change sides.
"I can change almost anything ... but I can't change human nature."
Jon Osterman/Dr. Manhattan
---
So long as they are not Russian MREs. If you have never tried one, consider yourself lucky
The yellow pill is a vitamin tablet? It should be eaten in the morning, then the ration tastes great. I didn't eat this thing - now it's too late.
If you want to blend in, take the bus
A little too late
But at least they finally get it
They've obviously not witnessed what Russian females are capable of !Meanwhile, Ukraine's State Border Service has been quoted by the Interfax-Ukraine news agency as saying that it is "significantly" restricting entry into the country by adult men from Russia because of the risk of "acts of terror".
If you want to blend in, take the bus
http://kiev1.org/en/nagrada-za-poimku-diversantov.htmlKolomoisky has set a reward for the capture of Russian commandos: 10000 USD for each and 1000 $ for the automatic
The Deputy Governor of Dnepropetrovsk region Boris Filatov proposed new methods of dealing with terrorists.
That's what he wrote on his Facebook page, passes the Censor No.
He said: the first units of the specbatal′ona "Dnepr" formed and ready for combat missions. Roadblocks are established ".
A scrimmage in a Border Station
A canter down some dark defile
Two thousand pounds of education
Drops to a ten-rupee jezail
http://i.imgur.com/IPT1uLH.jpg
Nice find, Adam !
Interesting maneuver considering the ethnic Russian youth were paid less than 10 euros each to demonstrate in front of the American Embassy and destroy diplomatic vehicles, and, were all collected together by their school teacher.
Later in 2007, we discovered the price for going haywire was increased to 20 euros and the alcohol was free.
Seems the Estonian Russians needed less incentive to go haywire and Vodka was the catalyst
If you want to blend in, take the bus
It is amazing that by merely removing patches from the uniforms of their troops, or by sending them in in plain clothes wearing balaclavas the Russians can so completely flummox and paralyze the West. It is like the guy on the wanted poster tells the cop 'No that's not me. The guy on the poster is wearing a hat and I'm not.' and the cop says 'Oh yeah. You're right. You don't have a hat on.' and then let's him go.
Anne Applebaum's book The Iron Curtain is a wonderful book that has many many small war lessons to be learned. Of course some of those things can only be used by regimes of brutal killers.
"We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene
I couldn't resist...
and
http://youtu.be/diuQiXt5qE4?t=7m3s
In all the hype about Russian commandos stirring up trouble, the real point is missed: the new administration in Kiev has near zero legitimacy in Russian populated enclaves. Reading these threads gives the impression that every ethnic Russian in Ukraine is on Moscow's payroll and is armed to the teeth. The fact of the matter is that Russian agitation operations, no matter their extent, would be futile if there was not already popular sentiment in their favor. And while the new administration is struggling to shore up its legitimacy through light military operations, it's preparing for a campaign of economic shocks: slashing gas subsidies, terminating tens of thousands of state employees, and tax increases; all on conditions imposed by the IMF. Now despite all the institutional knowledge on this forum, I have not yet read one person question the political strategy of Kiev and its failure to build support among its population. As I've stated in previous posts, the Kiev government is not an innocent bystander or victim in this chain of events. It brought political instability upon itself, and it's not doing itself any favors by pushing through its economic program.
When I am weaker than you, I ask you for freedom because that is according to your principles; when I am stronger than you, I take away your freedom because that is according to my principles. - Louis Veuillot
1. I may translate anything from this site, regardless of my attitude to the content. What do you want to be translated?
2. I dont have any other questions to that guy, do you?
3. Yes, I answer as I please, just like you, why should I do otherwise? To Quoque - my favorite fallacy
4. Haven't read that post/don't care. Sorry, common sence does not allow me to agree/disagree with anything I have no idea about.
Meanwhile, Irina Farion, deputy of "Svoboda" party, teach children the "right" names. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=vfVocpx5coM
fun starts at 0:45
Farion: What's your name?
Girl: Olenka
Farion: Such a beauty, never-ever be Aliona (Russian form of the same name)...or you have to pack pack your stuff and go to Moscow.
1:12
Farion: Never adress Marichka as Masha, because Masha isn't ours, Mashas live out there.
picture to attract attention
Who we are? - Ukrainians!
What do we want? - Better lives!
What do we do to have it? - Nothing!
Who to blame for this? - State!
Last edited by mirhond; 04-17-2014 at 05:54 PM.
You got anything to back up that contention? Outlaw says just the opposite, that from what he's seen the Russian provocateurs have very little support beyond themselves, the Russian riot tourists and the paid drunks. The fact of the matter is that well organized, well funded, well trained and well led military and intel units in mufti have huge advantage over a brand new and somewhat disorganized government.
I find your suggestions that the Ukrainians are equally at fault in this less than convincing. In fact to me they are just apologies for the violent aggressor.
"We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene
Relax, You personally, are not in danger. Yet
ps. You have a misguided conception: we are not the orcs - we are Imperium Humanum, and you are the Eldars, tolerable but need to be watched closely, just in case
Emperor protects!
Last edited by mirhond; 04-17-2014 at 06:36 PM.
Ref the edit and add by Mirhond just a few minutes ago, the drawing thing.
Man that's just straight up agit/prop and clutter. He/they did the clutter the site stuff before but this is the first blatant agit/prop I remember.
Fascinating.
"We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene
1. I may translate anything from this site, regardless of my attitude to the content. What do you want to be translated?
2. I dont have any other questions to that guy, do you?
3. Yes, I answer as I please, just like you, why should I do otherwise? To Quoque - my favorite fallacy
4. Haven't read that post/don't care. Sorry, common sence does not allow me to agree/disagree with anything I have no idea about.
Meanwhile, Irina Farion, deputy of "Svoboda" party, teach children the "right" names. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=vfVocpx5coM
fun starts at 0:45
Farion: What's your name?
Girl: Olenka
Farion: Such a beauty, never-ever be Aliona (Russian form of the same name)...or you have to pack pack your stuff and go to Moscow.
1:12
Farion: Never adress Marichka as Masha, because Masha isn't ours, Mashas live out there.
picture to attract attention
Who we are? - Ukrainians!
What do we want? - Better lives!
What do we do to have it? - Nothing!
Who to blame for this? - State!
mirhond---really still awaiting your Russian ID---gesh where have you been-- in the bar by chance as the alcohol was supposedly free if you crossed the border into the Ukraine.
On the other hand you might not be after all a Russian FSB agent just an independent informal worker for them.
But again still looking for the Russian ID until then you even be Chinese.
There was an open question to you that you massively tap danced around---you compared Putin to Hitler and Putin being a Nazi--still stand by your previous comments?
Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 04-17-2014 at 06:12 PM.
Fuchs:
How about this one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqomZQMZQCQ
"We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene
Do you have any evidence other than the claims by made the Ukrainian government itself?The situation is more complicated than East vs West - just because the Kiev administration is unpopular in eastern Ukraine does not mean that Moscow is popular. The fact of the matter is that eastern Ukrainians for the most part did not participate in the Maiden, and they are not well represented in the new government. Nor are they looking upon the new economic program with any anticipation. This is a prime opportunity for Moscow obviously; it's not a situation created by Moscow from nothing.
None of which actually addresses the fundemental political disposition of eastern Ukrainians in the first place - who, as I have stated repeatedly in previous posts, are not the real conflict in Ukraine. Officials in the Kiev administration, including the President himself, have stated from the beginning that they are effectively on a suicide run in implementing their policies. In other words, they are unconcerned about the expression of any kind of democratic will by the population - ethnic Russians or otherwise - and democracy will not thrawt their agenda. Yatsenyuk is attempting to grab as much political advantage as possible in the short window before the elections. By radically shifting the political stage in his favor, he can significantly shape the outcome of the next election.The fact of the matter is that well organized, well funded, well trained and well led military and intel units in mufti have huge advantage over a brand new and somewhat disorganized government. I find your suggestions that the Ukrainians are equally at fault in this less than convincing. In fact to me they are just apologies for the violent aggressor.[/
So - you are stating that Yatsenyuk, et. al, force out Yanukovych, but that's Russia's fault, not the new Kiev administration. And when they ally with Right Sector and alienate Russian Ukrainians, that's also Moscow's fault, not the Kiev administration. And when they increase taxes, cut subsidies, and dismiss state employees, that's also Moscow's fault, not Yatsenyuk.
Last edited by davidbfpo; 04-18-2014 at 06:38 PM. Reason: light editing
When I am weaker than you, I ask you for freedom because that is according to your principles; when I am stronger than you, I take away your freedom because that is according to my principles. - Louis Veuillot
I'll restate the question and you can answer it. You got anything to back up your contention that there is popular sentiment in favor of the silovikian orcs crawling around eastern Ukraine?Do you have any evidence other than the claims by made the Ukrainian government itself?
None of which actually addresses the fundemental political disposition of eastern Ukrainians in the first place - who, as I have stated repeatedly in previous posts, are not the real conflict in Ukraine. Officials in the Kiev administration, including the President himself, have stated from the beginning that they are effectively on a suicide run in implementing their policies. In other words, they are unconcerned about the expression of any kind of democratic will by the population - ethnic Russians or otherwise - and democracy will not thrawt their agenda. Yatsenyuk is attempting to grab as much political advantage as possible in the short window before the elections. By radically shifting the political stage in his favor, he can significantly shape the outcome of the next election.
So - you are stating that Yatsenyuk, et. al, force out Yanukovych, but that's Russia's fault, not the new Kiev administration. And when they ally with Right Sector and alienate Russian Ukrainians, that's also Moscow's fault, not the Kiev administration. And when they increase taxes, cut subsidies, and dismiss state employees, that's also Moscow's fault, not Yatsenyuk.
Yea, yea I get it. The month or two old Ukrainian government is a pox upon the people and they are allied with the Right Sector and democracy will not thwart their agenda. Gee, come to think of it all that sounds familiar. Where did I hear it before? Hmm.
I will make one observation. Russian heavy forces are poised to strike. Russian spec ops and intel forces have already invaded Ukraine and are striking as we speak. Since those guys are pretty well disciplined and are there at Vlad's direction, I'd say it is clear, black and white clear even, that their presence which is the crisis, is Moscow's fault.
But that is just a simple flyover person talking.
Last edited by davidbfpo; 04-18-2014 at 06:40 PM. Reason: light editing
"We fight, get beat, rise, and fight again." Gen. Nathanael Greene
AP---let's take for the sake of discussion the simple statement that every population within a recognized border so we can exclude the Putin Doctrine then add the simple statement that every population has the inherent right for the Rule of Law and Good Governance as determined by themselves---that is the key by themselves.
If one looks at the Arab Springs and the Color revolts that is what basically drove them because why ---most people want a better life, employment and a future for their children regardless of ideology.
Then if we look at the Ukraine with its massive corruption schemes that made 28 year old Billionaires inside three years and left 42 kilos of gold bars and 5M in USD alone in just one house---we then wonder why the population and it was a cross section of the population that froze and demoed and got killed to express exactly that desire.
Then we take a group of individuals who have not much experience at running a government, an Army and even more importantly internal security and throw them into the fire and ask them to get everything correct the first time out the door---it is like asking someone to jump from a perfectively flying plane without any training.
Then they step up and do it without stating they want to keep those positions and are willing to step aside after elections have been held---all in the interests of their country.
And we think they are perfect and should not be making any mistakes---come on---if they can get it 50% correct then that is massive.
Do you think we were any better organized when the first locals showed up on the Lexington Green and challenged a superpower and that shot was literally heard around the world and reverberated for years---Washington struggled as a commander for years to get it right and we expect these guys in Kiev facing a well trained army and an equally well trained FSB and special ops all the while having a rather untrustworthy military and internal security service behind them and a ethnic population that inside itself does not know what it wants and is being massively hit with a slick I/O campaign. I have stated a number of time the Russian I/O campaign is really worth a doctorial thesis.
I think that on the whole that they have hung on and that is all that counts---and this is the critical piece changed law for law every day since 21 Feb to the structures that are in fact democratic for them the population that started this whole thing.
We cannot ask for more than that---allowing a population to go it's own route if it is comfortable in that decision. After all is that not what we have been preaching for the last 100 years and we call it democracy. Did not Putin call the elections in Crimea as their "self determination"?
AND in the process thrown Putin into panic as this is his worst nightmare for his own population if the Maidan is used as an example when they at some point create their own Color revolt demanding the same things as the Maidan.
Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 04-17-2014 at 06:44 PM.
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