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| Government Agencies & Officials War zone governance, and in-country political, economic, development assistance. |
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#81 | ||
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Council Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Latitude 17° 5' 11N, Longitude 120° 54' 24E, altitude 1499m. Right where I want to be.
Posts: 2,563
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All this talk about creating, selecting, vetting, developing assumes capacity and will. If the host nation government had that capacity and will there wouldn't be an insurgency in the first place. The reason we're involved in these situations is that the capacity and/or will are not present in the host government... and the harsh reality is that in most cases we can neither fill that gap with our own capabilities (which would require us to govern the territory in question ourselves) or to force or persuade others to fill it. Quote:
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In our current situation access to resources is less likely to be the motivation for intervention than a perceived need to deny territory or support to hostile forces. This is all too true, and ultimately the key to managing these situations lies with more realistic decision making at the political level. This of course is small consolation to those in the field, but I don't know if it will help them any more to lay out a program based on assumed capacities that in most cases will not actually exist. |
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#82 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,111
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Dayuhan,
...your excellent analysis of the heterogeneity of motivations, opportunities, populace/culture/language, governance and economics (access, competition, etc.) have brought our situation into crisp focus. Your are also truly on target to emphasize that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. The question of this being too much to expect of our political construct I would like to defer for the moment. ![]() Instead, for those of us who have gone and will go again, please turn your analytical skills for a moment to the how-to of building something of lasting value with broken and worn out tools for the situations we are in. My particular focus has been upon Iraq of late however an analysis of Afghanistan would be just as interesting.
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Sapere Aude |
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#83 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,877
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Surferbettle your post,
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I remember many of the coalition development efforts in Southern Iraq were controlled by the Shi'a militia's (sometimes directly, sometimes clandestinely by coercing from the shadows). They controlled what contractors got the jobs, and no doubt the militia's collected their taxes and got the message out that if you want to make money you need to side with us. All others will be paid a visit by your friendly militia thugs. Several points worth studying IMO. - How much of our economic aide in these countries actually supports the efforts of our foes? I just looked a graph today that showed a correlation between CERP spending and reduced violence, but is that the real picture, or did we simply forfeit control to the enemy, thus there is no need to fight? - Once black economy models are established (such as the illicit business transfers on the cell phones, selling gas illegally on the side of the road, narcotics trade, human smuggling, kidnap for ransom, etc.) is it even feasible to displace this black economy with a legal economy? - There are estimates that up to one third of the world's economic activity takes place in the black economy which equates to over a trillion dollars that governments have no control over. What does the ever increasing convergence of crime and extremism mean to those of us who develop and execute plans in an attempt to defeat terrorists and insurgents? - Are there cases where our economic development efforts actually undermine successful black economic development, thus push the populace away from us and the HN? For example, attempting to eradicate the poppy plant and replace it with some form of unskilled labor or with a replacement crop that isn't worth as much? There is a lot more to economic development than meets the eye when you're operating in these chaos zones. |
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#84 | ||||
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,111
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Speaking of which you might enjoy this short article at Foreign Affairs by Nikolas K. Gvosdev entitled The Soviet Victory That Never Was, What the United States Can Learn From the Soviet War in Afghanistan (H/T to the Nixon Center) Quote:
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#85 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Slapout,Al.
Posts: 4,453
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Surfer and Bill, might want to try this link to Rogue Economics.......I have not read the book but have seen short interviews of work......not sure I believe everything she says but alot I do.
http://www.sevenstories.com/book/?GCOI=58322100402010 |
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#86 | ||
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Council Member
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Upper Michigan
Posts: 3,583
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I fail to see the logic of this:
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1. If the incumbant government has an insurgency on its hands, it lacks the capabilities or will to implement the very modest suggestions by Steve and me on a local level. 2. Therefore, since the modest program cannot be implemented by the incumbant government, it can be implemented only by a foreign intervenor (e.g. US). 3. Therefore, the modest program will have a "Made in the USA" label, even though I clearly stated that the local program should be indigenous. The fallacy lies in the initial premise. What we are talking about, for a rural population complex of say 2500-5000 people, would be an armed civil affairs team of say 6-12 persons; and a very mobile platoon of patrolling Dobermans to preserve the military balance. If the incumbant government cannot make that effort, it indeed is in deep trouble (regardless of how good it looks on paper at higher levels). In effect, it will be legislating into a void. The factors of "creating, selecting, vetting, developing" are relative. None of them requires the resources of a modern industrial state. They should be done in accord with the local environment. Obviously, the local environment is capable of "creating, selecting, vetting, developing" - otherwise, the insurgency would not exist. Merry Christmas Mike
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JMM When I quit learning, I'll be dead. Crabtree's Bludgeon (updated) - No set of mutually inconsistent observations can exist for which some human intellect cannot conceive a coherent explanation, however complicated and implausible - credits: R.V. Jones & Hayden Peake. |
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#87 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,877
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This is the first post of a few on this topic if the moderators don’t shut me down. In this one I just want to introduce some additional context that will shape later posts on the efficacy of our economic development efforts as means to counter threat economic systems, which can probably be described as the life blood of any movement.
Eventually I hope to evolve these thoughts with your help to where I can make a case for changing “clear, hold and build” to clear, hold, and consolidate” where build is one subcategory of consolidate. Then I hope to collaborate with the SWJ larger mind to develop effective approaches of neutralizing enemy economic systems (slap, I’ll know you’ll love this), which will hopefully push the populace to rely on State endorsed economic systems (without conducting economic warfare against the populace). However, I think this will prove to be a tough nut to crack. I think that even with over eight years of experience with GWOT, our military and other government organizations such as State remain largely incapable of understanding unconventional warfare, since our perception is biased by outdated doctrine. The U.S. military focus on unconventional warfare is really nothing more than a focus on the warfare piece (i.e. maneuvering guerrillas within the constraints of the law of land warfare) against enemy forces. This really isn't UW at all, but simply a fifth column of surrogates that is conducting a limited form of guerrilla warfare that is very much tied to the our interpretation of CvC’s view of war as a state versus state conflict where the military is the decisive factor. If this is true (open for debate), then it is only natural that our counter UW, or COIN doctrine is largely focused on militarily defeating the IED networks (in the current fight). Once again the conventional force has learned this isn’t a conventional war (but they were slow learners), so they slowly revisited previous lesson from previous conflicts that had a similar (not identical) character. They started protecting the populace, providing essential service and focused on developed relationships with community to facilitate more effective intelligence operations, which were largely focused on finding and destroying the IED networks. It still keeps coming back to that, because CvC taught us the way to win was to destroy our foe’s ability to wage war. CvC wasn’t wrong, but we failed to see that the enemy can wage war without IED networks through propaganda, political subversion, quiet terrorism behind the scenes to influence key personnel, establishing shadow governments, taking over the local schools, economic subversion, etc. We tend to largely ignore these threats, we may deal with them if we stumble across them, but that isn’t what our intelligence is focused on. I think Jmm would agree that we simply don't have the legal authority to fight fire with fire in the shadow wars, so we focus on what we can. Specifically I want to focus on the E in DIME, and challenge the idea that our economic development efforts are achieving the desired results. A combination of luck, intent and globalism is allowing our irregular foes to effectively undermine our economic power. As Naim wrote in his book “Illicit” there is a growing gap between the haves and have nots as globalization spreads. This has facilitated, perhaps out necessity, the rapid growth of the black economy, which according to Naim is in the trillions of dollars. How does the Taliban manage to pay their fighters more than the State of Afghanistan paid theirs? How do numerous NGOs who are clearly tied to various terrorist organizations effectively fund the development of schools, medical clinics, etc.? How do we displace black economic activities such as the narcotics trade and other forms of smuggling without harming the locals who thrive off of it? The State is no longer relevant in this economic system (thus legitimacy is further undermined), and if the State intends to crush or displace this activity, what economic system will they replace it with? While this doesn’t apply to all conflicts, it does apply to OIF and OEF-A. If we even hope to understand the problem (system) we have to look at it globally, because the black economic systems are tied into the new global economy of which less and less is controlled by States. We see a rapidly increasing trend where organized transnational crime networks (its an open system) and other irregular threats such as insurgents, terrorists, etc. are converging on a global scale, and I suspect we don’t really understand the implications of this. These relationships are often based simply on mutual business interests. Such as AQ affiliated groups in the Trans Sahel assisting drug cartels from S. American and W. African smuggle cocaine into Europe. This is just one of many examples of how a terrorist network expands its links (perhaps unintentionally) from a regional effort in the Trans Sahel to bad actors in W. Africa, South America and Europe. The amount of money involved in these activities is overwhelming for developing states, so centers of power shift from State to non-state actors. These groups can now buy effective influence from the windfalls garnered from their illicit activities. Over time, I suspect this corruption/subversion changes the character of the war and its goals, thus my reference to new economic cultural norms in my previous post. We now have an area that neither our law enforcement nor military is ideally organized, trained, or enabled through authorities to confront effectively. Those limitations extend to our partner nations who are afflicted with this threat. I recommend a quick read through "Illicit" (there are other books on the topic now) to get additional context. http://www.amazon.com/Illicit-Smuggl...1677733&sr=1-1 |
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#88 |
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Council Member
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Upper Michigan
Posts: 3,583
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I like to read and think about your ideas. Lord knows, we need a more comprehensive approach to transnational violent non-state actors - and to the non-violent species as well. That cuts across the entire DIME spectrum and ultimately will affect all of the various legal systems that have to deal with these non-state problems.
Merry Christmas - I now have to go out in the snow and buy the bottle of Christmas dinner wine. Mike
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JMM When I quit learning, I'll be dead. Crabtree's Bludgeon (updated) - No set of mutually inconsistent observations can exist for which some human intellect cannot conceive a coherent explanation, however complicated and implausible - credits: R.V. Jones & Hayden Peake. |
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#89 | ||||
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,111
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How-to-build a wireless router:
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What about having a 'Virtual Easy Button' in the games to employ a 'gold farmer' in Afghanistan to help with the OEF effort?
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Sapere Aude Last edited by Surferbeetle; 12-24-2009 at 08:57 PM. |
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#90 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,111
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Quote:
I am in. Let's see where it goes...
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#91 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,111
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From IEEE Spectrum, Open-Source Warfare by Robert N. Charette (H/T to Global Guerrillas)
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#92 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Slapout,Al.
Posts: 4,453
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#93 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Maryland
Posts: 825
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Bill:
Your insight about the black economy is the driver. We are sitting heree with the notion that Afghanistan has virtually no economy, while the self-evident truth is that there is always an economy, everywhere, all the time. The Russian Ambassador, commenting on their failures, reiterated the truism that Afghanistan is not a war that cane be won, but a reconstruction/development process. Where, in truth, the many parts of Afghanistan were, more often than not, under "foreign" subjugation throughout history, it was to trade patterns and alliances that were productive. It is almost silly to believe that the largest global trade in opium derives from Afghanistan without a substantially evolved and routinely performing economic system. Obviously, in a three year period, Afghanistan has sprung two vibrant economies: first, the fantastically growing poppy trade; and, second, a booming business in foreign aid "supporting" industries (security, theft, extortion/kidnapping). So, if we start with the reality that Afghans, like everyone else, are substantially economically motivated and capable, we then turn to the problem that we don't like their economic system and desire to change it. But if I put on my Afghan farmer hat, why am I going to do something else, given my alternatives? Let's assume for a second that we substantially interfere with the poppy conveyor (arrest major leaders, disrupt production/distribution). Absent a credible alternative, wouldn't that, of itself cause such substantial opposition and economic suffering that we are back to where we started? If it was me, I would be interested in mapping out and understanding the poppy economy (not just the military/terrorist component), then looking for ways to re-direct it. India, for example, is a huge poppy economy, but for the legal medical markets. What's up with that? Could legal production displace illegal? What if, once you mapped out the system, you were able to limit external transfers of poppy wealth? You can earn it, but it has to be spent in Afghanistan. Does that become a basis for economic investment in infrastructure, etc... I continue to hear the lament from the North and West that they need to exploit mineral resources to create jobs, GDP. Lots of questions surrounding that, but our focus on the Northern Supply route (for military expedience) does not sound like a sustainable supporting investment on that path. I assume the black economy would see the Northern Route as a boon to getting opium to Europe by piggybacking on our efforts. Good idea to start with a base-line understanding of all economic systems. Merry Xmas. Steve |
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#94 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 6,218
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Bill,
A small quote from your longer commentary above: Quote:
I not aware of how much overseas funding is raised by such groups, IMHO mixing the non-violent even charitable actions and the violent actions enables donors to "pick & mix", or claim "I gave it to 'X' charity and it ended up there, shocking". Probably the best example is nearer the 'frontline' with LeT in Pakistan, with an established structure of charities, schools etc (see Stephen Tankel's writings on LeT). That provides not just supporters, but the wider public with facilities when others - including the state - fail to provide. It will be interested to watch, from afar, whether this non-violent aspect of the 'struggle' and the creation and maintenance of a broader coalition, which is assumed, is adopted by AQ. A question that has been posed in discussions amongst analysts on the future of the global jihad (FGJ).
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davidbfpo Last edited by davidbfpo; 12-25-2009 at 09:59 PM. |
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#95 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Slapout,Al.
Posts: 4,453
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Link to some real economic thinking, explodes the myth of so called free markets. Talks about the superiority of the Military business model applied to the civilian economy. Good stuff.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wUfYGl40KqE&feature=sub |
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#96 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,111
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From the WSJ, by DAVID LUHNOW Saving Mexico
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#97 | |
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,111
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From Bloomberg by Anthony DiPaola and Grant Smith on December 10, 2009, Iraq’s Second Oil Bidding Round Bolstered by Exxon, Eni Deals
From Bloomberg by Anthony DiPaola and Maher Chmaytell on December 11, 2009, Shell, CNPC Win Iraq Oil Contracts, Adding to Earlier Deals From the website Iraq and Gulf Analysis by Reidar Visser on December 13, 2009 The Second Licensing Round in Iraq: Political Implications Quote:
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#98 | |||
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,111
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From the 9 Jan '10 WSJ Chavez Devalues Venezuela's Currency By JOHN LYONS and DARCY CROWE
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#99 | ||
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Council Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,111
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Unfortunately little quantitative data is provided on how much $ by line of operation
From the January 10, 2010 LA Times, In West Bank, conditions 'not ripe' for Palestinian uprising by Edmund Sanders Quote:
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#100 |
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Council Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Maryland
Posts: 825
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Steve:
Financial Times had the latest on the opening of the Northern Route, and hearty encouragement for the line through Afghanistan to India via Pakistan: "From hell, through hell, to hell." Strange but typical business arguments about united all stakeholders, and long-term benefits if Taliban will join up with Pashtun brethren to reap the benefits... Seems out of place for a couple of reasons: First, corruption---How are all these long-term stakeholders supposed to perceive/receive a benefit in the current climate? Second, another reason to unite Taliban and Pashtuns for an inter-border "benefit" for Pashtunistan. No? http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/0e09d8fa-f...44feab49a.html Makes sense, but there are plenty of reasons why it hasn;t moved forward yet. |
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