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Thread: Russo-Ukraine War 2016 (April-June)

  1. #781
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    BREAKING: Kremlin retreats on financing 'Donbas project'
    http://uatoday.tv/politics/kremlin-r...ct-669266.html
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-08-2016 at 07:16 PM.

  2. #782
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    Russian shelling's and ground attacks are on tonight......

    The sound of battle from #Zaitsevo.
    #Horlivka

    https://twitter.com/kapralukr/status/740621265300520961

    21:07 #Horlivka @kapralukr #Zaytseve is noisy again

    Heavy incoming fire on #Avdiivka's outskirts now.

    22:33 #Donetsk "non-stop salvos"
    https://twitter.com/LifeInDonetsk/st...27952078073857

    22:33 #Avdiivka @LuftGanza Get it [=UA reply?]

    22:31 #Horlivka @tgorlovka_news Heavy ones again. In the north

    22:24 #Donetsk railway station area - "hearing salvos. It sounds like an empty bucket"
    https://twitter.com/TaylerRid/status/740625520241561601

    22:33 #Donetsk #Topaz @cranovschik since 22:15, periodically noisy, smth is launched with aftersound, rollingly, like nearby...Now strongy

    22:15 #Donetsk #center @Donetsk_Ukraine pro-RU hunting UAV

    22:26 #Donetsk #Kyivskyi @AlfaNubovsky north direction: far-off few artillery salvos? now smth booms again

    22:23 #Donetsk #Kuybyshevskyi @CKOTINYAKA mortars, outgoings, 3 rounds

    Donetsk @huyoviynovoros [as for salvos at 21:45] SPG started from chemicals plant area. Shelled about 5 rounds towards north. Pretty early
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-08-2016 at 07:40 PM.

  3. #783
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    Quote Originally Posted by OUTLAW 09 View Post
    Russian shelling's and ground attacks are on tonight......

    The sound of battle from #Zaitsevo.
    #Horlivka

    https://twitter.com/kapralukr/status/740621265300520961

    21:07 #Horlivka @kapralukr #Zaytseve is noisy again

    Heavy incoming fire on #Avdiivka's outskirts now.

    22:33 #Donetsk "non-stop salvos"
    https://twitter.com/LifeInDonetsk/st...27952078073857

    22:33 #Avdiivka @LuftGanza Get it [=UA reply?]

    22:31 #Horlivka @tgorlovka_news Heavy ones again. In the north

    22:24 #Donetsk railway station area - "hearing salvos. It sounds like an empty bucket"
    https://twitter.com/TaylerRid/status/740625520241561601

    22:33 #Donetsk #Topaz @cranovschik since 22:15, periodically noisy, smth is launched with aftersound, rollingly, like nearby...Now strongy

    22:15 #Donetsk #center @Donetsk_Ukraine pro-RU hunting UAV

    22:26 #Donetsk #Kyivskyi @AlfaNubovsky north direction: far-off few artillery salvos? now smth booms again

    22:23 #Donetsk #Kuybyshevskyi @CKOTINYAKA mortars, outgoings, 3 rounds

    Donetsk @huyoviynovoros [as for salvos at 21:45] SPG started from chemicals plant area. Shelled about 5 rounds towards north. Pretty early
    Shelling as heard from #Donetsk city tonight.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et6SNkpFfew

  4. #784
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    Donetsk is popping tonight, UAVs, anti-air cannon fire, artillery every few minutes and the smell of a fire in center city.

  5. #785
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    'Beware, Propaganda!': Russia's Independent Media Take On State TV
    http://www.rferl.org/content/russia

    Donbas frontline summary: militants increasingly using artillery; new tanks brought across the border from #Russia
    https://goo.gl/wivqOn

    43 pro Russian attacks on Ukrainian positions yesterday, 152mm artillery used - ATO

    Heavy artillery battle in #Dokuchaevsk last night:
    https://twitter.com/loogunda/status/740771259366137856

    00:12 #Dokuchajevsk-#Novotroitske Ongoing battle with small arms and mortars. Occasionally audible artillery. https://twitter.com/EverydayInUa/sta...55452388745217

    Russian militants shelled #Putylivka neighbourhood of #Donetsk with 122-mm SP-gun, - #Ukraine's General Staff
    http://en.censor.net.ua/n392431

    In 24h situation in #Donbas worsened, RUS militants opened fire 43 times, used 152 mm &122mm artillery, 82mm mortars
    https://goo.gl/7em3Ft

    ATO: 43 russian attacks in #Donbas yday. Avdiivka, Optyne, Pisky came under fire fr small arms, mortars of various calibers, 152mm artillery

    06:58 #Dokuchaevsk @whicard5 "I spent last night in cellar. Artillery skirmish lasted 4hrs since 00:00. The battle in industrial area[=N]"

    Suddenly Putin/Russia "play nice".......trying to influence NATO meeting in Warsaw??
    Russia is showing uncharacteristic prudence—Why, and will it last?
    http://brook.gs/216VUDY
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-09-2016 at 06:01 AM.

  6. #786
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    The Bear in the Room: The US-Nordic Summit & Dealing with #Russia. @seipjm in @WarOnTheRocks→
    http://warontherocks.com/2016/05/the...g-with-russia/

    Czech Foreign minister says #Russia|n president is trying to ‘divide and conquer’ #Europe
    https://twitter.com/IlvesToomas/stat...57457971073024

  7. #787
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    Russian MOD Confirms Pilot Killed In Su-27 Crash Near Moscow
    http://www.interpretermag.com/russia...-9-2016/#14149

    One pilot killed after Mig-29 military jet of the Russian Knights flight stunt team crashed
    http://russia.liveuamap.com/en/2016/...of-the-russian
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIqPYJmYYak

    Kremlin’s troops in eastern Ukraine’s Donbass region - russia’s war in Ukraine.
    http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the...ars-most-16500
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-09-2016 at 10:11 AM.

  8. #788
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    Vladimir Putin destabilising EU through support for right-wing populists, Czech ForMin warns
    http://app.ft.com/cms/s/3d6b68aa-2d5...ectionid=world

    Russian ground fighting and artillery shelling's are still ongoing....

    11:48 #Krasnohorivka area @Huyovyi_Kolhoz Shooting combat near #Krasnohorivka, +BMP, +SPG... for now intensity decreased a bit
    12:13 ceased

    UAF's losses in yesterday's battles: 1 KIA and 5 WIA.

  9. #789
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    Crimea as An Aircraft Carrier, Threats To NATO, Russian Pilots' Butthurt (Video):
    https://informnapalm.org/en/jun02-cr...ussian-pilots/

    Ever creeping forward Russian annexation of Georgian territory.....
    Russian forces install new ‘border’ signs deeper in Georgian territory
    http://agenda.ge/news/59711/eng

    Just move the border signs and no one will say anything will they?????

    Both Sides Trade Claims Of Shelling Of Residential Areas As Fighting Worsens
    http://www.interpretermag.com/day-843/#14154

    RF authorities demand US court dismisses Yukos compensation case | Права человека в России
    http://hro.org/node/24641

    On Russia's links to Germany's "far right" AfD party.
    http://www.spiegel.de/international/...a-1089562.html

    Separatists have blocked OSCE access to territory, threatened monitors & systematically destroyed their cameras and UAVs.

    Russia deploys troops westward as standoff with #NATO deepens (& fearing #Ukraine may grab some Russian land)
    http://reut.rs/1VKaim5
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-09-2016 at 05:19 PM.

  10. #790
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    Quote Originally Posted by OUTLAW 09 View Post


    Some reasons for Putin to lose sleep: Analysts see Kremlin thinking of world war

    http://windowoneurasia2.blogspot.com/2016/06/kremli

    I'm afraid that Goble is wide of the mark on this one. While Putin salivates at the prospect of NATO's dissolution, there are absolutely no indications that he seeks a military confrontation that could turn nuclear. Nor is there anything that invading the Baltics could provide for Russia (i.e. human and natural resources) that could not be obtained by other means, such as annexing Belarus or northern Kazakhstan. The article touches on the prospects of invading these non-NATO states, but dismisses the them out of hand. Yet while the United States would not be willing to fight for Minsk or Astana, it would certainly slap much more severe sanctions on Russia, such as banning it from the SWIFT system, a possibility Kremlin mouthpieces have already declared as tantamount to war.

  11. #791
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    CrowBat...what do you think??

    BreakingReport
    Rebel coalition under the leadership of Jaish al-Fatah attacks #Khalasah now.
    If it falls, #Iran & Assad r in heavy trouble.

    FSA Northern Brigade and Central Brigade are present in the battle too and claim destroyed IRGC tank and ATGM unit south Aleppo.

    AjnadSham claim #SAA & allies have begun withdrawing from Zaytan

    TOW destroyed rocket launcher in southern #Aleppo's Khalsah+seized a tank
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-09-2016 at 05:25 PM.

  12. #792
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azor View Post
    I'm afraid that Goble is wide of the mark on this one. While Putin salivates at the prospect of NATO's dissolution, there are absolutely no indications that he seeks a military confrontation that could turn nuclear. Nor is there anything that invading the Baltics could provide for Russia (i.e. human and natural resources) that could not be obtained by other means, such as annexing Belarus or northern Kazakhstan. The article touches on the prospects of invading these non-NATO states, but dismisses the them out of hand. Yet while the United States would not be willing to fight for Minsk or Astana, it would certainly slap much more severe sanctions on Russia, such as banning it from the SWIFT system, a possibility Kremlin mouthpieces have already declared as tantamount to war.

    Azor...but here is the core problem....the current Russian military is built for a quick super quick victory and then kicks in the Russian not so subtle threat of a tactical nuclear first strike as a "descalation" before NATO can react....it has practiced that series of maneuvers for the last three years and is still exercising that scenario religiously.

    This article carried here in SWJ is worth a quick read.......

    Taking War Seriously: Russia-NATO Showdown No Longer Just Fiction
    By James Sherr
    May. 25 2016 19:24

    http://www.themoscowtimes.com/opinio...on/570258.html

    Azor....a serious part of the problem now is that a number of the senior military and senior political leaders ie Putin really have drunk the koolaid and believe their own propaganda and that alone is dangerous especially when one has nuclear trigger.....there is right now a serious perception in Moscow that NATO led by the US really wants to destroy via regime change Russia once and for all....it is there and this belief is real.
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-09-2016 at 06:45 PM.

  13. #793
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    OSCE Confirms Missing Driver Being Held In Donetsk
    http://www.interpretermag.com/day-842/#14134
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-09-2016 at 07:19 PM.

  14. #794
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    Russian "vodka" hard at work......

    Russian Mission OSCE @RF_OSCE
    #Lukashevich: after seizing “grey zones” and failed breakthrough attempts the Ukr. forces resorted to shelling residential areas in Donbass

    Russian Mission OSCE @RF_OSCE
    #Lukashevich: we expect that SMM OSCE and JCCC would record and report on consequences of Ukr. shelling in Donbass on 8-9 June

  15. #795
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    Russian shelling's in support of their ground attacks........

    From #Shyrokyne right now. I've heard 10 booms in one min. Most probably artillery as usual. #Mariupol #Ukraine

    23:06 #Toretsk
    #Shumy (near #Horlivka) "battle continues, something heavy has joined"
    https://twitter.com/papakin78/status/740998547802345473

    23:05 #Yasynuvata @GirkinGirkin it is getting noisy

    23:00 #Toretsk @blessmaster a loud ka-boom and a minute-long active skirmish

    22:45
    Blockpost at #Kominternove, #Vodyane-#Lebedinske shootout.

    21:50 #Krasnohorivka @hyeva_maryinka [vk] machine guns again
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-09-2016 at 08:15 PM.

  16. #796
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    Default RE: Putin and Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by OUTLAW 09 View Post
    Azor...but here is the core problem....the current Russian military is built for a quick super quick victory and then kicks in the Russian not so subtle threat of a tactical nuclear first strike as a "descalation" before NATO can react....it has practiced that series of maneuvers for the last three years and is still exercising that scenario religiously...Azor....a serious part of the problem now is that a number of the senior military and senior political leaders ie Putin really have drunk the koolaid and believe their own propaganda and that alone is dangerous especially when one has nuclear trigger.....there is right now a serious perception in Moscow that NATO led by the US really wants to destroy via regime change Russia once and for all....it is there and this belief is real.
    Points taken, however, I would still say that Russia watchers are conflating capability with intent.

    Firstly, First Grozny notwithstanding, Russia has always had the conventional capability to defeat Georgia, annex Crimea, set Donbas on fire and deploy a small expeditionary force to Syria. We can argue over how much clumsier mission execution would have been if ordered by Yeltsin rather than Putin, or in 1999 vs. 2009, however, these activities were always possible.

    Secondly, we have the issue of intent. Yeltsin had a strong interest in Transnistria, Tajikistan, Abhkazia, South Ossetia, Crimea and Serbia. With respect to NATO expansion, only 3 new members were added during Yeltsin's tenure, of which only one (Poland) bordered Russia. In comparison, 9 were added during Putin's reign (not including Montenegro), of which 3 bordered Russia, and of which two effectively sealed off the western coast of the Black Sea. I think that you would be hard pressed to find an analyst who would suggest at any time that the Black Sea Fleet every would have vacated Crimea, or that Russia would allow the Russian-speaking enclaves in the former Soviet Union to be forcibly assimilated by their host countries.

    As far as nuclear weapons go, Putin's doctrine is not markedly different from that of the Soviet Union, other than telegraphing that it would use nuclear weapons to stave off conventional defeat and invasion. Certainly, the nuclear saber-rattling is worse than even at the height of the Cold War, yet Putin has found that reforming the Russian military has been a much harder and more glacial process than he initially believed. Russia currently has only 100,000 professional soldiers that it can really rely upon, including Internal Troops/National Guard Spetsnaz units, and many time zones to spread them across. It is sufficient to crush Georgia, deter Ukraine's ATO and overrun the Baltics, but not enough to conquer Poland, occupy all of Ukraine, or defeat NATO's RRF when it surges into the area. Therefore, this posturing is intended to mask conventional inferiority. The notion of nuclear "de-escalation" is ludicrous as neither NATO nor Warsaw Pact/Soviet planners ever believed that there could be a limited nuclear war. If NATO is as weak as some of these analysts claim and lacking in tactical nuclear capabilities, then Putin is faced with a dangerous redux of the New Look/First Offset, whereby NATO would be forced to defend the Baltics with strategic ballistic missiles. In addition, NATO accepted for decades that it could not hold West Berlin or all of Germany against a Warsaw Pact onslaught, but now the temporary loss of Narva is unacceptable?

    Thirdly, Putin's regime is inherently less stable than the institutionalized CPSU, meaning that Andropov-esque decision-making becomes even more dangerous. Nevertheless, analysts are interested in hyping the Russian threat to NATO in order to provide more funds for the US Army (largely without a mission now save air defense) and the shrinking NATO establishments. They are less interested in studying Putin's behavior, which would indicate that he has greater interests in Belarus and Kazakhstan than any NATO member states, and that while he will intervene to prevent a state becoming a NATO member, he does not want a conflict with the United States.

  17. #797
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azor View Post
    Points taken, however, I would still say that Russia watchers are conflating capability with intent.

    Firstly, First Grozny notwithstanding, Russia has always had the conventional capability to defeat Georgia, annex Crimea, set Donbas on fire and deploy a small expeditionary force to Syria. We can argue over how much clumsier mission execution would have been if ordered by Yeltsin rather than Putin, or in 1999 vs. 2009, however, these activities were always possible.

    Secondly, we have the issue of intent. Yeltsin had a strong interest in Transnistria, Tajikistan, Abhkazia, South Ossetia, Crimea and Serbia. With respect to NATO expansion, only 3 new members were added during Yeltsin's tenure, of which only one (Poland) bordered Russia. In comparison, 9 were added during Putin's reign (not including Montenegro), of which 3 bordered Russia, and of which two effectively sealed off the western coast of the Black Sea. I think that you would be hard pressed to find an analyst who would suggest at any time that the Black Sea Fleet every would have vacated Crimea, or that Russia would allow the Russian-speaking enclaves in the former Soviet Union to be forcibly assimilated by their host countries.

    As far as nuclear weapons go, Putin's doctrine is not markedly different from that of the Soviet Union, other than telegraphing that it would use nuclear weapons to stave off conventional defeat and invasion. Certainly, the nuclear saber-rattling is worse than even at the height of the Cold War, yet Putin has found that reforming the Russian military has been a much harder and more glacial process than he initially believed. Russia currently has only 100,000 professional soldiers that it can really rely upon, including Internal Troops/National Guard Spetsnaz units, and many time zones to spread them across. It is sufficient to crush Georgia, deter Ukraine's ATO and overrun the Baltics, but not enough to conquer Poland, occupy all of Ukraine, or defeat NATO's RRF when it surges into the area. Therefore, this posturing is intended to mask conventional inferiority. The notion of nuclear "de-escalation" is ludicrous as neither NATO nor Warsaw Pact/Soviet planners ever believed that there could be a limited nuclear war. If NATO is as weak as some of these analysts claim and lacking in tactical nuclear capabilities, then Putin is faced with a dangerous redux of the New Look/First Offset, whereby NATO would be forced to defend the Baltics with strategic ballistic missiles. In addition, NATO accepted for decades that it could not hold West Berlin or all of Germany against a Warsaw Pact onslaught, but now the temporary loss of Narva is unacceptable?

    Thirdly, Putin's regime is inherently less stable than the institutionalized CPSU, meaning that Andropov-esque decision-making becomes even more dangerous. Nevertheless, analysts are interested in hyping the Russian threat to NATO in order to provide more funds for the US Army (largely without a mission now save air defense) and the shrinking NATO establishments. They are less interested in studying Putin's behavior, which would indicate that he has greater interests in Belarus and Kazakhstan than any NATO member states, and that while he will intervene to prevent a state becoming a NATO member, he does not want a conflict with the United States.
    Azor....all good points but that is rational western thinking...you must place yourself into the current mindset of Putin and company...I often use the quote..."they are in an altered state of reality" to sum up their actions lately.

    In some ways Putin and company totally hate being ignored on their path to be accepted again as a "so called superpower".

    And those in such a state do not always think rationally or logically.

    There is a good example of this in the A2/AD article where I posted a comment today...in the "old days" the USAF had to bdeal with A2/AD belts composed of SA5/6/8s now the Russian A2/AD bubbles are well thought through and truly are designed to support Russia in a quick war...emphasis here is on "quick" and to deny NATO critical air space for a SEAD attack.

    BTW the defined use of a "tactical nuclear first strike" was first openly used by Putin in 2014 with their release of their new nuclear doctrine a rewrite of 2013 and it was not in any of their older nuclear doctrine ie SU days.

    BTW...it did not get much notice in US MSM nor a rise out of the Obama WH nor has the Obama WH and the US MSM gotten a rise out of the multiple violations by Russia of the INF.

    Again all designed to support a "quick war".....remember it takes all 28 NATO members in complete agreement to pull the Article 5 trigger and to go tactical nuclear is really questionable on NATO's part. I am not even sure the US and NATO even today has a tactical missile delivered nuke ability anymore???
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-10-2016 at 07:18 AM.

  18. #798
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    Reference the Russian shot down of MH17....Russia seems to accept they will in the end be charged as the shot down party and are going over to simply ignoring the issue from their POV.

    A new low even for Kremlin: Russia news agency says it doesn't matter who fired the missile which killed 300 #MH17
    http://m.ria.ru/analytics/20160609/1444959648.html

    "Who needs the truth on MH17? It won't bring the victims back, so what's the difference?"

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    Russian armed forces opened fire 46 times upon Ukrainian troops positions in southeast #Ukraine over the last day - ATO official

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    Footage (May 2016)
    The #Minsk "ceasefire" keeps taking a heavy toll.
    50+WIA Ukis in June.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyJR...has_verified=1
    UAF loses for the month of MAY.....29 KIA.....97 WIA......

    Ukraine Reports 46 Attacks Yesterday, With At Least 18 More After Midnight
    http://www.interpretermag.com/day-844/#14165

    SBU says "foreign intel" behind attempts to create another pseudo-republic in Ukraine
    http://www.unian.info/society/137174...n-ukraine.html

    Russia warns of countermeasures to U.S. vessels entering Black Sea
    http://www.unian.info/world/1371786-...black-sea.html

    Russia 'ready to destabilize half of Eurasia' – Georgian President
    http://www.unian.info/world/1371702-...president.html
    Last edited by OUTLAW 09; 06-10-2016 at 01:55 PM.

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